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Old 02-25-2007, 03:03 AM   #17701
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Originally Posted by Burlap
Ok, not Monday, but still Sunday here.

Gave the car a run today at the races with the short arms.

Car has tons more grip than with the longer arms. Also not as twitchy under power (although only running Stock, so YMMV). That much grip it pretty well cooked my tyres in not too hot conditions.

Car seemed a lot smoother with the suspension change. Sure there might be a placebo effect, but even co drivers noticed the changes with my car. And the short arms are a hell of a lot more stronger than the long ones. I got punted into a corner with a wood barrier, and the car bounced off, no broken front arm.

I highly recommend the short arm setup. Here are the toeblocks I used

Front: 1B-1A (the bridge 1A block, which came on the original 415)
Rear: 1XA-1D (2.5 deg Toe in)
Running 42mm outdrives on the front with the one way, as the 46mm bind up.
Hey Burlap. Sounds interesting... I might have to give this a try. Just one question, did you widen the car so that track width remained the same or are you running narrower with the short arms? Since I don't have shorter drive shafts, I may go with D blocks up front. Just curious whether this would negate the effects of the short arms somewhat...
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Old 02-25-2007, 03:36 AM   #17702
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i have 415 and got 23t superstock tamiya RZ.. in the manual of the 23t superstock it says that it should be geared at 6-7.5:1 but in the back of the manual it has a recommended gearing for tamiya cars and i found the 415 recommended gearing it says use 102t spur and 42t pinion, but when i look at the manual and check the gear ratio for 102t spur and 42t pinion the ratios is 5.4:1, but in the manual of the motor it should be geared at 6-7.5:1...?? any comments?
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Old 02-25-2007, 04:47 AM   #17703
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Quote:
Originally Posted by veecee
Hey Burlap. Sounds interesting... I might have to give this a try. Just one question, did you widen the car so that track width remained the same or are you running narrower with the short arms? Since I don't have shorter drive shafts, I may go with D blocks up front. Just curious whether this would negate the effects of the short arms somewhat...
Sadly (and possibly stupidly) I forgot to measure the width of the car before and after the conversion. I am running 1mm spacers on each wheelhub (I forgot that bit in the original reply), and from what I can tell with the body on the car, it doesn't seem any narrower than it does with the long arms.

I tried D Block on as the front block on the front end, but the outdrives were still binding when I did the alignment. Plus none of the 1A-1E blocks have the cut aways like the 1X blocks for spacers. So if you mount a 1D upside like the 1XB on the front end, the spacers do not sit flat, and can bend the screws or badly tweak the front end.
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Old 02-25-2007, 04:56 AM   #17704
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Originally Posted by Burlap
Sadly (and possibly stupidly) I forgot to measure the width of the car before and after the conversion. I am running 1mm spacers on each wheelhub (I forgot that bit in the original reply), and from what I can tell with the body on the car, it doesn't seem any narrower than it does with the long arms.

I tried D Block on as the front block on the front end, but the outdrives were still binding when I did the alignment. Plus none of the 1A-1E blocks have the cut aways like the 1X blocks for spacers. So if you mount a 1D upside like the 1XB on the front end, the spacers do not sit flat, and can bend the screws or badly tweak the front end.
No worries Burlap. I guess I've finally found a use for that D bridge block...
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Old 02-25-2007, 08:26 AM   #17705
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nikkiesteban
i have 415 and got 23t superstock tamiya RZ.. in the manual of the 23t superstock it says that it should be geared at 6-7.5:1 but in the back of the manual it has a recommended gearing for tamiya cars and i found the 415 recommended gearing it says use 102t spur and 42t pinion, but when i look at the manual and check the gear ratio for 102t spur and 42t pinion the ratios is 5.4:1, but in the manual of the motor it should be geared at 6-7.5:1...?? any comments?
I used 5.4 at the Tamiya Nationals last year to good success. If motor wear and life are not an issue to you, this will give you the best performance. Trinity E brush or 767s with Trinity Purple springs.

You might try something more conservative in the 5.6 range.
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Old 02-25-2007, 08:56 AM   #17706
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Originally Posted by MDawson
I used 5.4 at the Tamiya Nationals last year to good success. If motor wear and life are not an issue to you, this will give you the best performance. Trinity E brush or 767s with Trinity Purple springs.

You might try something more conservative in the 5.6 range.
ohh thanks for that.. but what if i geared it a 6.0?? what will be the effect to the motor compared to 5.4..?
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Old 02-25-2007, 09:30 AM   #17707
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looking at all the pictures posted of your msx,mre,s no one seems to use the servo saver from the kit,why is this are they not up to the job?
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Old 02-25-2007, 09:43 AM   #17708
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Nik--who knows depending on your track you could be way overgeared or undergeared....If it is Tamiya America you will be undergearing and slow

Pug after a few hits they loosen up a touch. If your track is forgiving you can run an alum servo horn. It keeps the slop to a minimum the downside is if you get a pipe good and plastic gears on the servo you will be replacing them.
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Old 02-25-2007, 01:30 PM   #17709
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Originally Posted by nikkiesteban
ohh thanks for that.. but what if i geared it a 6.0?? what will be the effect to the motor compared to 5.4..?
With a 6.0 final drive your car will accelerate better, but have a bit less top speed(but will also be easier on your batteries, though that's not much of an issue anymore with today's batteries). But as to whether that's the right ratio for you, that really depends on the track you race at, where I race, I'd only gear a Novak 13.5 brushless motor that tall, if I did that with any brushed motor, it'd put a terrible strain on it & the car would not accelerate as well as I'd need(with a Trinity CO27 stock motor, I'm gearing mine at about 7.3 FDR, which seems about right for the smaller track I race on). If you're overgeared, your car will run out of room on the straights before it'll even top out, & just won't accelerate as well as it can, & since every track is different, the best people to ask about gearing is the guys who race at that track(though if you could give us a good idea of the general size & layout of your track, we might be able to offer a ballpark starting point).....
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Old 02-25-2007, 03:26 PM   #17710
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With a 6.0 final drive your car will accelerate better, but have a bit less top speed(but will also be easier on your batteries, though that's not much of an issue anymore with today's batteries). But as to whether that's the right ratio for you, that really depends on the track you race at, where I race, I'd only gear a Novak 13.5 brushless motor that tall, if I did that with any brushed motor, it'd put a terrible strain on it & the car would not accelerate as well as I'd need(with a Trinity CO27 stock motor, I'm gearing mine at about 7.3 FDR, which seems about right for the smaller track I race on). If you're overgeared, your car will run out of room on the straights before it'll even top out, & just won't accelerate as well as it can, & since every track is different, the best people to ask about gearing is the guys who race at that track(though if you could give us a good idea of the general size & layout of your track, we might be able to offer a ballpark starting point).....
oh.. thanks.. but as for the manual included on its box it says the gearing should be 6-7.5:1.. so maybe which one has a bit good acceleration and a top end? which is that inside the 6-7.5:1??
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Old 02-25-2007, 03:33 PM   #17711
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Originally Posted by veecee
No worries Burlap. I guess I've finally found a use for that D bridge block...
There is a D Bridge block? Damn, would've needed to change the outdrives
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Old 02-25-2007, 06:35 PM   #17712
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Originally Posted by Burlap
There is a D Bridge block? Damn, would've needed to change the outdrives
Yep - 51064. I knew it would come in handy one day. Can't say the same for a lot of the X-series blocks I bought...
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Old 02-25-2007, 06:54 PM   #17713
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nikkiesteban
oh.. thanks.. but as for the manual included on its box it says the gearing should be 6-7.5:1.. so maybe which one has a bit good acceleration and a top end? which is that inside the 6-7.5:1??
Don't worry too much about what the manuals say on what ratio for what motor, as they get those numbers from their own testing at their own tracks, & as I said, EVERY track is different in one way or another, which is why I said the absolute BEST source of gearing info is they fast guys at YOUR track. But again, just remember, smaller final number means higher top speed & slower acceleration, bigger number means less top speed & better acceleration....
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Old 02-25-2007, 08:00 PM   #17714
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whats up guys i was wondring if any body give thire setup 415 ms at trackside in wi iam going four the tcs raci next week it would help a lot

thanks
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Old 02-25-2007, 09:20 PM   #17715
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Originally Posted by veecee
Yep - 51064. I knew it would come in handy one day. Can't say the same for a lot of the X-series blocks I bought...
Ah well, I'll get one next order instead of ordering new 42mm outdrives.
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