R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10-21-2003, 09:25 PM   #1
Team EAM
 
EAMotorsports's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Posts: 9,158
Trader Rating: 79 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to EAMotorsports
Default Droop measurement

Ive been told several different ways to measure droop and just wanted to get some feedback on what everyone else does.

The most common way is with drop guages and blocks. But some people say to set your ride height with everything installed then hold the tires down and lift up on the shock tower (kinda hard to do!!) and then measure ride height again...Subtract the two and that is your droop.

I know it doesnt really matter as long as you use the same method every time you check it but when your comparing setups with someone else it does matter...Because using the two differnt methods will produce drasticlly different results.

Just curious.

eric a
__________________
Contact Us
Team EAM, Our Facebook
Team EAM | Xray | RCAmerica | Hudy | APEX Raceway and Hobbies | RC Mission | Killer Concepts | AVID | Hobbywing.
EAMotorsports is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2003, 09:54 PM   #2
Tech Elite
 
popsracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: "Hot, Sunny Southern California"
Posts: 3,120
Default Droop measurement

EAMotorsports;

IMHO, the EASIEST way is the ride height gauge method.

Set Chassis (ride) height first, then push the gauge in further until the Tires just clear the set-up surface.
Subtract this measurement from the ride height and you have the EXACT amount of droop at that end. Then adjust each side if nessesary, with stop screws or shock length.

No need to hold the Tires down, just make sure that the Shocks are fully extended each time you check.

Only 1 tool needed to adjust this way and I feel it is much more accurate.
popsracer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2003, 09:54 PM   #3
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Irvine California
Posts: 870
Send a message via AIM to Bubblestc3 Send a message via Yahoo to Bubblestc3
Default

What car are we talking about...?

I know that for the TC3 there are atleast two ways to measure droop. The first is easy to understand, but more complicated in the end(more equipment to mess with). The second method of droop measurement, is more of a trick, but hard to explain...

First you need to set all the camber, toe, and the ride height. Once all this is done, check your tweak on the chassis. After the car is all setup and the droop screws are not touching the chassis, screw the screw in until there is almost no spring play, or no spring play. You really can't measure this method, but it creates even droop at all four corners... (you could set it so there is more or less to the front or rear)
Bubblestc3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2003, 10:17 PM   #4
Registered User
 
OB42TC3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 417
Default Re: Droop measurement

Totally agree. This is the easiest to understand and is independent of tire size. I wish they would put it down this way on setup sheets.

Quote:
Originally posted by popsracer
EAMotorsports;

IMHO, the EASIEST way is the ride height gauge method.

Set Chassis (ride) height first, then push the gauge in further until the Tires just clear the set-up surface.
Subtract this measurement from the ride height and you have the EXACT amount of droop at that end. Then adjust each side if nessesary, with stop screws or shock length.

No need to hold the Tires down, just make sure that the Shocks are fully extended each time you check.

Only 1 tool needed to adjust this way and I feel it is much more accurate.
OB42TC3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2003, 12:31 AM   #5
Tech Elite
 
BigDogRacing's Avatar
R/C Tech Charter Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 2,955
Trader Rating: 12 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to BigDogRacing
Default

Eric the reason we hold the tires down with rubber tires is because there is usually an air gap and I don't want the air gap in the tire to fool me into thinking I have some droop when I don't. Especially since I prefer very little droop in my setups.

With foam tires putting light pressure on the tires just makes it a little quicker and easier. It doesn't affect the actual droop.
BigDogRacing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2003, 01:34 AM   #6
Tech Champion
 
JDM_DOHC_SiR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Chula Vista, CA
Posts: 9,070
Trader Rating: 31 (100%+)
Default

And then there is set up wheels(Yokomo,ATLAS...ect ect) to give you a dead "nutZ" on reading since they are all the same size... and you"ll be able to get the settings really close

BTW if this if for that Black Fish that you own... try around 4.5mm in the back and 3m in the front for starters

-Dave
__________________
Ȼ4.5 Centro+α ◊ TRF 501ӽ ◊ TRF 502ӽs ◊ TRF 503 ◊ TRF 511 ◊ TRF 201ӽr ◊ TRF 211ӽ
B5m ◊ T5m ◊SC5m ◊ B64deez nutz
Speedway PAL ◊ SDRC ◊ Shop UFO ◊ SMC
JDM_DOHC_SiR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2003, 05:59 AM   #7
Team EAM
 
EAMotorsports's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Posts: 9,158
Trader Rating: 79 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to EAMotorsports
Default

How do you measure yours dave? Because if I am going to try the droop setting you just said I need to know how YOU measure it. Because both ways will be different.

I just wanted to hear how everyone else does it. I use the ride height method because I think that is measuring actual droop at ride height to the tire contact . Using the other method is measuring it using the lowest part of the arm. Doest really matter either way as loong as you use the same method and when you compare with other people you ask how they do it to make sure its the same as you.

ea
__________________
Contact Us
Team EAM, Our Facebook
Team EAM | Xray | RCAmerica | Hudy | APEX Raceway and Hobbies | RC Mission | Killer Concepts | AVID | Hobbywing.
EAMotorsports is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2003, 09:41 AM   #8
Tech Elite
 
popsracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: "Hot, Sunny Southern California"
Posts: 3,120
Default Droop measurement

Guys;

Setting Wheels do work great for the Droop.

Just use your racing Tires/Wheels for the ride height, then install the setting Wheels to measure & adjust Droop. The exact same method still applies.
popsracer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2003, 01:28 PM   #9
Tech Regular
 
hyperformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: knoxville, TN
Posts: 369
Default droop

eric, the method of measuring droop with the droop guages has caught on cause poeple find it easier to compare setting that way. the measurment & adjustment is really nothing more the negative suspention travel. with this in mind the method of measuring ride height with the car at rest then with it lifted (but with the tires contacting the ground) would be ideal, but it is seldom exact. i used to measure it that way but everyone i raced with was using droop guages so to compare notes i now use the droop gauge as well. i don't like it but it works.
hyperformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2003, 02:06 PM   #10
Tech Elite
 
speedxl's Avatar
R/C Tech Charter Subscriber
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Portland Oregon.
Posts: 3,881
Default

i run a tc3 and have tried both methods
at the end the result is about the same when you know how to measure it at the arm and then with the tires at rest.
its good to know both so if someome says
to you i run 2mm droop at ride hieght
you check what you got set the droop
and then check the droop at the arms to see what the difference is.
and then you can replicate it when you are setting up your suspension up with out the wheels.
__________________
Pemberton / R1 / All out motorsports / Team Power Push
speedxl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2003, 04:24 PM   #11
Tech Addict
 
Barry White's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: HEAVEN
Posts: 720
Default

I don't like the blocks becouse you can't compare different types of cars. Some cars have smaller suspension parts than others so the only way is to lift up the cars.
An other reason is you must measure droop whenever you change your tire diameter and a lot of people ignore this when using blocks.
Barry White is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2003, 10:52 PM   #12
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: TX
Posts: 115
Default

like what barry white said...i set-up my droop holding the car...i take the shocks and wheels off then set the droop using the droop screws...i'm not worried about the shock length that much since after setting the droop it will lessen shock travel too...as for the ride height...i always set it up as high as i want..usually 6 front and 5 1/2 rear...car handles very well...some guys think my ride height is way too high....anyways..just my way to set my car up....
Los1Fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2003, 06:57 AM   #13
Tech Elite
 
Joel Lagace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 2,628
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

A very good topic. Like roll out i like to have everyone doing the same calculations so that when a guy asks whats your ratio i tell him my roll out is say 25mm. So if he is driving brand A,B or C he can just calculate his rollout with his data and compare to mine.

With droop measurements its the same thing. IF u run A,B or C car they use differen blocks and tell u to measure from different points on the suspension arm.

I prefure the UPTRAVEL MINUS RIDE HEIGHT calculation because this can be done universally on any car. A few factors need to be correct before doing this though:
-4 tru tires(foams vary so set it when the tires are tru)
-4 or 2 pairs of shocks at the same length
-Camber and desired ride height set.
-car in race ready form(motor/batteries ect)
-for and initial "zero" setting i do use blocks to get the left and right sides precisly the same. This way at the track im 99% correct when i make 1/8th or 1/4 turns to adjust each side when doing on the fly adjustments. For me it doesnt matter what the setting is on the blocks at this point i just want the left and right to match. At this point i dont know my ride height nor what tires will be on the car.

Once your car is race ready this is the time i measure ride height:
*5mm
Then i measure the rideheight with the shocks at max uptravel by pulling up on the shock tower.
*7mm
My droop is:
*2mm

It dont matter what car u run when u ask me what im running i tell you 2mm and in 20seconds you can have your car at the same droop setting. No need to dismantal the car or pull out tools just the hex wrench and ride height gauge.

I feel its important to do it this way because i fun foam and rubber on sedan. And with one guy on 60mm tires and another on 54mm tires using the droop guages will not yield similar results. One will have way more droop then the other and possibly way to much for the car to handle properly.


Here is an example of how this meathode saves your azzz. Your at a race and your about to race but discover a warped rim or chuncked tire. They are at 56mm. You have another identical set at 58mm. You swap them and adjust ride height.But in doing so your droop has increased. With the uptravel minus ride height measurement you can be done in seconds and be fairly accurate.
__________________
"Without Rules its just Backyard Bashing!"
www.rcottawa.com
Joel Lagace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2003, 07:13 AM   #14
Tech Master
 
Im2lazy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Hawaii!
Posts: 1,967
Default Re: Droop measurement

Quote:
Originally posted by popsracer
Guys;

Setting Wheels do work great for the Droop.

Just use your racing Tires/Wheels for the ride height, then install the setting Wheels to measure & adjust Droop. The exact same method still applies.
I use the setup blocks I have instead of setup wheels as that's another thing to buy. Using the setup station blocks, I only have to measure ride height and width, then I can do the rest of my car's setup with the setup blocks installed.
Quote:
I prefure the UPTRAVEL MINUS RIDE HEIGHT
... um, isn't that what most everyone else has been discussing?

Im2lazy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2003, 07:21 AM   #15
Tech Elite
 
Joel Lagace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 2,628
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Yes it is, i simply stating that i prefer it. Or should i have said i prefer it as well?
__________________
"Without Rules its just Backyard Bashing!"
www.rcottawa.com
Joel Lagace is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
RMS-1 - Rotor Measurement System A. Rhodes Oval, Larger Scales and More 3 07-25-2008 08:41 PM
B4 measurement question.. Johnathan Electric Off-Road 6 06-04-2006 07:51 PM
setting droop on droop blocks mrgsr Nitro On-Road 3 01-08-2006 07:01 PM
Better Droop Measurement kufman Electric On-Road 15 03-07-2005 08:27 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 05:10 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net