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Old 12-04-2008, 07:28 PM   #136
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Credit is due to SMC they are clearly the leader in LIPO, but big props to TP for the aggresive approach to bringing the best pack.

Unfortunatly, we still don't have pack-to-pack comparison numbers over a number of runs.

Seems a shame that with all the great discharge equipment out there... we can't see the comparison @ cycle #1 then #5 then #25
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Old 12-04-2008, 07:35 PM   #137
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Here I thought LiPo was supposed to end the battery wars.
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Old 12-04-2008, 07:58 PM   #138
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Here I thought LiPo was supposed to end the battery wars.
There is only one (workable) way to STOP product wars.

The rules makers need to make the RULES for a product BEFORE it's introduced or lealized to racing, BLUE PRINT the specs...then ANY company wanting to build a "LEGAL" product would have to built it to those exact blue printed specs.

No GRAY area, No FUDGE Factor, and random sampling would need to be done to assure product compliance at random intervals.

When MFG's drive the bus, you never know which route it's gonna take, or where it's going to end up!
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Old 12-04-2008, 08:23 PM   #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpraydbySprague View Post
Here I thought LiPo was supposed to end the battery wars.

This is racing, Lipos did bring back reliability 10 folds.

I have lipos bought last year and both still work like it was when I first bought it.
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Old 12-04-2008, 09:33 PM   #140
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Originally Posted by SpraydbySprague View Post
Here I thought LiPo was supposed to end the battery wars.
With lipos, I think the battery war is much more talk than reality. The difference between different types of nimh cells is drastic, both in performance and longevity, whereas the difference between different race-spec lipos is largely in people's heads.
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Old 12-04-2008, 11:27 PM   #141
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I am heading back to Asia soon and would like to know if this product will be available in the your Asian distributor channel soon. would like to know if the same introductory price will be valid there as well.

I am not going to risk leaving these batteries in my luggage no matter how much safer people say it is.

Since this is going to be my first Lipo pack, I would like to have one to remember not the one to forget.
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Old 12-05-2008, 02:21 AM   #142
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Jason: I really don't believe your info on testing the C rate of a 5000 parallel cell makes sense. I agree with O'Brain that 12 gauge wire and Deans connectors can't be used to pull 200 amps so why are you claiming this? Below is a piture of our how our supplier tests a pack. There not using 12 gauge wires and Deans connector when using 140amps so how can 200 amps work ?

I'm sure that the TP pack is good and has good performance but it's impossible to use 12 gauge wire and Deans connectors to discharge cells at 200 amps.
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Old 12-05-2008, 02:23 AM   #143
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Forgot to attach how packs/cells should be connected for high C rate testing.
Attached Thumbnails
Thunder Power Rc 40C 5000 Lipo-img_0115.jpg  
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Old 12-05-2008, 02:53 AM   #144
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Where can I get wire that fat? I bet it's worth a tenth!
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Old 12-05-2008, 04:47 AM   #145
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Old 12-05-2008, 06:42 AM   #146
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Originally Posted by reenmachine View Post
With lipos, I think the battery war is much more talk than reality. The difference between different types of nimh cells is drastic, both in performance and longevity, whereas the difference between different race-spec lipos is largely in people's heads.
+1 for sure!!
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Old 12-05-2008, 11:17 AM   #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny/SMC View Post
Forgot to attach how packs/cells should be connected for high C rate testing.
So THAT'S why Danny's batteries are so fast! Stuffing a 4cell pack into the 2 cell case!!j/k
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Old 12-05-2008, 10:04 PM   #148
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Hello O’Brain, Danny/SMC and everyone,

My apologies for not being more clear and accurate in my last post regarding the way we test the 5000mAh parallel cell arrangement up to 200 amps. We actually have 2 sets of 10 gauge (sorry, not 12 gauge) wire leads, each set of leads with its own female Deans Ultra Plug connector (2 total), soldered to the tabs of the cell/s (yes, it is definitely impossible to run the 200 amp test with a single set of leads and a single Ultra Plug connector!). The high-current discharger is equipped with 2 sets of 10 gauge wire leads, with mating male Ultra Plug connectors (2 total), attached to heavy-duty bolt terminals. Voltage is measured directly from the tabs of the cell/s using a DMM/scope which connects directly to a PC for data logging. See the image attached below for reference.

Also, this is of course not the only way to do it, but is how we test cell performance in-house as we do not rely on data supplied by the cell manufacturer alone (as some LiPo pack manufacturers/resellers unfortunately seem to).


O’Brain,

We will also offer a limited selection of 40C batteries for use in aircraft applications, however, we find that most airplane/helicopter pilots prefer the energy density of our Pro Lite V2 and Pro Power 30C series batteries for their models. In aircraft applications the right balance of weight, power and capacity is typically preferred to just raw power alone, as weight and flight time can be more critical than just power in some applications. As you know, higher-discharge rate capable cells typically weigh more for the same capacity (or the same with less capacity) than lower discharge-rate capable cells, and this is not always better for every aircraft (nor even surface) application. That said, some of the very large-scale electric ducted fan (aka – EDF or “electric jet”) models pulling upwards of 200-250 amps (though usually in bursts, not always continuously) will likely benefit most from the 40C cells for example.

Everyone,

As we and many others are very interested in the cycle life performance of our and other brand batteries in comparison, we’ll be conducting cycle life testing of the Pro Race 40C and other brand batteries in the coming weeks. It does take quite a bit of time to test and gather the information for multiple batteries and many cycles, but we are committed to completing the tests as soon as possible (though it may take at least a few weeks).

Also, some of the representatives from other LiPo pack manufacturers/resellers are speculating/implying that the cycle life of our all-new aircraft and surface series batteries will be similar to some of our previous/current (and many now-discontinued) battery series offerings, but this is simply not the case. Nearly every all-new Pro Lite V2, Pro Power 30C, Sport Race and Pro Race 40C series battery we’re offering is built using cells specifically developed and manufactured for not only excellent power delivery (upwards of 25% more than some of our previous/current offerings for the same class of battery), but also maximum cycle life (upwards of 4 times more than some of our previous/current offerings). To us, truly high-performance doesn’t stop at just high power delivery…it also includes good cycle life performance too. It’s also true that the value of a battery is not only measured by the power it delivers, but how many times you’re able to use it before it doesn’t deliver the power you need any longer.

BTW – Thank you to everyone for all your support! The response since this thread started has been absolutely incredible, and many, many orders for the 5000mAh Pro Race 40C 7.4V batteries have been taken. Numerous shipments of these batteries continue to go out daily, but please bear with us as we try to fill all the orders as quickly as possible as the demand has exceeded our initial expectations. Also, our distributors and dealers will be receiving additional shipments over the next few weeks, so please be sure to check your favorite shop for stock first. If they don’t have packs in stock or on order, tell them to order ASAP as it looks like demand will be very high through the holiday!

Good luck and we look forward to hearing more reports of on-track performance (where performance matters most….though we would like to race our GFXs at the next Nationals….is there a limit to input voltage though? ) soon!

Jason
Attached Thumbnails
Thunder Power Rc 40C 5000 Lipo-5000mah-pro-race-40c-cell-test.gif  

Last edited by Jason/TPRC; 12-06-2008 at 05:00 AM.
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Old 12-05-2008, 10:24 PM   #149
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Just out of curiosity, what's the purpose of having the Deans connectors in the system? Why not just connect/disconnect from the bolt terminals?
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Old 12-05-2008, 10:54 PM   #150
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Originally Posted by reenmachine View Post
Just out of curiosity, what's the purpose of having the Deans connectors in the system? Why not just connect/disconnect from the bolt terminals?
I am wondering the same thing. 2 none the less.
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