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Old 06-21-2009, 10:40 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by SalvadoriRacing View Post
the reasons of rotor breakage are most likely very hard braking, over reving (this could be one as you mentioned the track is large and you geared short previously), or bumpy tracks also can ruin the rotor because of sudden stress under power or braking through bump sections........
My car was doing all of the things you mentioned. There is a lot more reving with the sxx speedo. The car wheelspins more coming out of the corners.

The track layout does require hard breaking and the track is bumpy. I hope this was a one off and it doesn't happen again. Ill put the 13mm rotor in for now but i dont think it will help my problems(Probably make the reving worse). Do you think i should get the 12mm rotor to try and stop this.

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Old 06-21-2009, 11:07 PM   #92
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I don't think it's because of the revving or hard braking that causes the rotor to break, mine was a brand new unit, installed, pull the throttle (less than 10%) twice and it BLEW!!!

A friend of mine sugg that the rotor breaks could be due hard impact during shipping resulting it cracked or could be due to poor QC.

Anyway sent mine back to the shop for warranty claim..... wondering when would it be back....
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Old 06-28-2009, 03:26 PM   #93
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Default Gearing question X12 4.0T

Hello Reto,

I went this weekend to the warm-up race in Luxemburg as practice for the upcoming EC. I drove with the new speedo and an X12 4.0T motor. Now I was wondering what the gear ratio would be that you recommend for running on this track? My current ratio was around 7.0 but I was missing some top speed and I could barely make the 5 minute mark. Program of the speedo is as per standard (gray values in manual).
Hope you could give me some advise.

Best regards.
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Old 06-30-2009, 10:41 PM   #94
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I went to mount the new X12 5.5T to my 007 and found the rotor to be cut too short. After mounting up and going to tighten the grub screw, it would not even touch that shaft with a Losi pinion. I switched to the Robinson pinion and can barely get 1/3 of the grub to contact the rotor. Compared to other motors including a LRP X11 13.5 its close to 1/8" shorter in length. I have attached a pic. Has anyone else noticed this? I'm wondering if I got an out of tolerance rotor?
Attached Thumbnails
LRP Vector x12 Brushless Motors-lrp-x12-short-shaft-004.jpg  
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Old 07-01-2009, 08:42 AM   #95
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@Gerrit: I just spent two days of testing in Luxemburg (Monday/Tuesday) as well, the best setups we found were as following for X12 3.5 and 4.0t:

X12 4.0t:
- "oooo" timing insert (lowest timing)
- 12.5 or 13.0mm rotor (13.0mm has slightly more runtime!)
- 7.8:1 or 7.5:1 gearing (depending on rotor)
- profiles on SXX: 2-5-2-0

X12 3.5t:
- "oooo" timing insert (lowest timing)
- 12.5 or 13.0mm rotor (13.0mm has slightly more runtime!)
- 8.6:1 or 8.3:1 gearing (depending on rotor)
- profiles on SXX: 2-2-2-0


Make sure you run 0 autobrake in Luxemburg as this gives most runtime.

What is most important in Luxemburg is a good car setup, if car pushes or is loose it's impossible to make runtime with any motor or motor-setup as there is no flow and too much "stop/go" which makes runtime suffer...
Ronald for example made runtime every run (no matter which combination or battery he used) while other drivers couldn't make runtime in any of their runs...


@Verndog: can you not mount your pinion the other way? E.g. the grub screw facing to the motor. I never heard of this issue before!
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Old 07-01-2009, 09:46 AM   #96
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@Verndog: can you not mount your pinion the other way? E.g. the grub screw facing to the motor. I never heard of this issue before!
The only way to do that would be to remove the top deck every time I wanted to change a pinion to access the screw, that is IF it would even still line up. Dont have to do that with any other motor. Can someone check the length of shaft outside the end of can to another motor brand / style and tell me if they see its a good 1/8" shorter...please?? Possibly I got short shafted?
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Old 07-01-2009, 10:15 AM   #97
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The only way to do that would be to remove the top deck every time I wanted to change a pinion to access the screw, that is IF it would even still line up. Dont have to do that with any other motor. Can someone check the length of shaft outside the end of can to another motor brand / style and tell me if they see its a good 1/8" shorter...please?? Possibly I got short shafted?
i just compared an x12 5.5T with the following motors - SP 3.5, LRP 10.5, LRP 13.5, LRP 17.5, LOSI 10.5..

all shafts measured 19mm from the top of the can to the top of the shaft
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Old 07-01-2009, 10:41 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by mok View Post
i just compared an x12 5.5T with the following motors - SP 3.5, LRP 10.5, LRP 13.5, LRP 17.5, LOSI 10.5..

all shafts measured 19mm from the top of the can to the top of the shaft
Excellent, thank you xx00! I will check the length when I get back home. I know its shorter then my Losi 10.5 and Trinity Pulse 17.5 for sure. Sounds like the rotor output shaft was cut short on mine.
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Old 07-01-2009, 10:49 AM   #99
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ive seen a few mod motors throw rotors or sieze bearings and thrown rotors in 13.5 as well.
Its been happening not only with LRP but with Nosram motors too.
From what i have seen they seem to still be using the old style rotors.
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Old 07-01-2009, 02:31 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by Verndog View Post
I went to mount the new X12 5.5T to my 007 and found the rotor to be cut too short. After mounting up and going to tighten the grub screw, it would not even touch that shaft with a Losi pinion. I switched to the Robinson pinion and can barely get 1/3 of the grub to contact the rotor. Compared to other motors including a LRP X11 13.5 its close to 1/8" shorter in length. I have attached a pic. Has anyone else noticed this? I'm wondering if I got an out of tolerance rotor?
i have exactly same problem with my 007, the pinion is in the same position.
i found the solution is to remove motor and put it with the pinion gear back,
it is boring but couldn't find a better solution. and it won't work with the bigger size pinions.
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Old 07-01-2009, 06:32 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by mok View Post
i just compared an x12 5.5T with the following motors - SP 3.5, LRP 10.5, LRP 13.5, LRP 17.5, LOSI 10.5..

all shafts measured 19mm from the top of the can to the top of the shaft
OK, just got home and checked. The X12 5.5 I have is .530 or 13.46mm long from end of shaft to end of can, over 5mm shorter then yours.

I can get up to a 19T pinion thru the bulkhead by removing motor and putting on "backwards" to all other motors I've run, bigger then that, I have to remove the top deck just to change the pinion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by razzor View Post
ive seen a few mod motors throw rotors or sieze bearings and thrown rotors in 13.5 as well.
Its been happening not only with LRP but with Nosram motors too.
From what i have seen they seem to still be using the old style rotors.
I checked the rotor part numbers and they are different for the LRP X11
and LRP X12. I'm wondering if some got mixed up at the assembly plant?

Here is the X11 rotor HERE

Here is the X12 rotor HERE

Pic on the X12 rotor look longer to me. I'm going to pull the rotor from my X11 13.5, and the new X12 5.5 and see if i've been hornschwaggled or not....they better not be the same.
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Old 07-01-2009, 06:44 PM   #102
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Hi Burito,

I am running Lipo batteries, what motor turn I need to run to get equivalent performance (speed, power, etc) as compared to running a X12 4.0 on 5 cells or X12 4.5 on 6 cells?

Thank you
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Old 07-01-2009, 11:53 PM   #103
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Some of you must measure wrong, I just doublechecked again myself... shaft output length of different motors, measured from motor mounting flange (not ball bearing step!) to end of shaft, is as following:
- LRP X12: 13.3mm
- Trinity Duo: 13.9mm
- LRP X11: 13.9mm
- GM Evo3: 14.3mm

So all motors are within 1mm, that really shouldn't make a difference!

@razzor: don't think what you write is verndog's problem, also this is not related to X12 based motors.

@verndog: shafts are ground on precision CNC machines, there is no shafts which are shorter then others and also a confusion is impossible as rotors between X11 and X12 are not interchangeable.

@[email protected]: the two most popular X12 winds, when running LiPo's on average sized tracks, are 5.5 and 5.0t.
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Old 07-02-2009, 06:59 AM   #104
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Originally Posted by burito View Post
@Gerrit: I just spent two days of testing in Luxemburg (Monday/Tuesday) as well, the best setups we found were as following for X12 3.5 and 4.0t:

X12 4.0t:
- "oooo" timing insert (lowest timing)
- 12.5 or 13.0mm rotor (13.0mm has slightly more runtime!)
- 7.8:1 or 7.5:1 gearing (depending on rotor)
- profiles on SXX: 2-5-2-0

X12 3.5t:
- "oooo" timing insert (lowest timing)
- 12.5 or 13.0mm rotor (13.0mm has slightly more runtime!)
- 8.6:1 or 8.3:1 gearing (depending on rotor)
- profiles on SXX: 2-2-2-0


Make sure you run 0 autobrake in Luxemburg as this gives most runtime.

What is most important in Luxemburg is a good car setup, if car pushes or is loose it's impossible to make runtime with any motor or motor-setup as there is no flow and too much "stop/go" which makes runtime suffer...
Ronald for example made runtime every run (no matter which combination or battery he used) while other drivers couldn't make runtime in any of their runs...


@Verndog: can you not mount your pinion the other way? E.g. the grub screw facing to the motor. I never heard of this issue before!
Thank you very much for this info Reto. I will give it a try next time I will be testing in Luxemburg. This will be on monday after the ETS race in Andernach.

BR
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Old 07-02-2009, 08:24 AM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burito View Post
Some of you must measure wrong, I just doublechecked again myself... shaft output length of different motors, measured from motor mounting flange (not ball bearing step!) to end of shaft, is as following:
- LRP X12: 13.3mm
- Trinity Duo: 13.9mm
- LRP X11: 13.9mm
- GM Evo3: 14.3mm

So all motors are within 1mm, that really shouldn't make a difference!

@razzor: don't think what you write is verndog's problem, also this is not related to X12 based motors.

@verndog: shafts are ground on precision CNC machines, there is no shafts which are shorter then others and also a confusion is impossible as rotors between X11 and X12 are not interchangeable.

@[email protected]: the two most popular X12 winds, when running LiPo's on average sized tracks, are 5.5 and 5.0t.
Looks like we got the same measurment for X12, and the X12's are a bit shorter then the other motors. That .6 -1.0mm difference to other motors would be close to enough to get full contact of the grub screw and allow for proper instalation on a 007.

Anyway, I should end up with small enough pinion to change by removing motor, but to get lined up with spur, the end of pinion is literally against the end of can (Losi pinion when pushing in end play), I'm hoping this doesn't create a problem, no real side force on shaft to create much friction.

Thank you all for taking time to check...track testing tomarrow
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