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Old 08-31-2010, 12:32 PM   #466
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ok i hope i am not beating a dead horse.. but with the new rule change, what will be the fdr with the 25.5? it dont say on the site?
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Old 08-31-2010, 12:34 PM   #467
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ok i hope i am not beating a dead horse.. but with the new rule change, what will be the fdr with the 25.5? it dont say on the site?
No FDR rule with 25.5. Run whatever you want.
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Old 08-31-2010, 12:54 PM   #468
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Ok, I've never been good at setting up a car. Today I ran my new/used 415 on our track.

Using a front one way I need a lot more steering, it's pushing like crazy.

Now I have the XRay set up book downloaded and have read though it.

Here's my problem, making a change to 1/2 a dozen settings can increase front steering, but how do you choose which on to start with? Why?
Loaded question, since everybody has an opinion on this, but here's my 2 cents. I just got a used TA05R and run on carpet GT, medium traction. I also run a XXX-S in VTA.

It's all about balance & weight transfer from front to back. Pushing means to much weight has move to the rear while loose (pulling) is just the opposite.

Square and balance the car first.
1) Pull the shocks & make sure the arms are free and the left camber links are the same length as the right. I tend to run the links full length and parallel so I get max corner traction. Also look at the hinge pins. Are they paralle with the chassis? No anti-squat or anti-dive?

2) Check that the both front shocks are the same length. Repeat for the rear. The front & rear don't have to be the same, just left matches right.

3) Pop the shocks on and set the ride height. I run around 6mm because the track is still dusty. As the traction comes up the ride height can go down.
5mm is our minimum. Pop the shocks off again and measure the distance from the collar to the top, they should be the same.

What this all does is make the left & right suspension the same.

4) Droop. Pull the tires & block the chassis. I use some hard plastic I cut, the trick is you want two blocks the same height and uniform across the block. I place one under each end of the chassis between the arms. Now measure the distance from the flat surface it's all sitting on (kitchen counter ) to the top of the wheel shaft. I usually start with all four wheel shaft being the same. You adust this with the droop screws (spacers & shock shaft length if you don't have droop screws.). Setting the droop screws like this makes the limits for weight transfer front to back the same.

OK...mechanically the car is neutral. Next check weight with scales (if possible) with everything installed. you want left & right to weight the same and front & rear to weight the same. Add weights if you need to but don't get carried away or sweat little differences. This is where I start, I don't do this every race or even once a week.

Springs one size stiffer in the front than the rear. Generally soft for VTA. Start with them middle top holes. A-arm holes inside. (outside stiffens the shock.) You probably end up laying the rears down A(softer) and standing the fronts up.

So.................. back you your original question. I would first soften the front by laying the front springs down. If this doesn't help try softer front springs but it may start to dive. Droop may also be your problem, you would want to increase the rear droop (allows the rear to rise more-transferring more weight to the front) To do this you usually un-screw the droop screw, not much, maybe a 1/2 turn at a time.

Sorry about the long post, hope this helps.
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Old 08-31-2010, 01:10 PM   #469
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thats some really good info! will give that a try on the cars I have sitting here.

By the way, what are people finding that they commonly use for toe in settings on the rear?
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Old 08-31-2010, 01:58 PM   #470
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I've found pretty good success with 2.5 on both a TC4 and Pro4. I also run a TC3 but can't recall the rear toe setting on that car.

I do prefer that the rear arms are parallel to the ground. That requires some creative shimming but i think my TC3 is the best it has ever been in VTA trim with parallel rears and a slight amount of kick-up for the front.
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Old 08-31-2010, 02:22 PM   #471
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I've found pretty good success with 2.5 on both a TC4 and Pro4. I also run a TC3 but can't recall the rear toe setting on that car.

I do prefer that the rear arms are parallel to the ground. That requires some creative shimming but i think my TC3 is the best it has ever been in VTA trim with parallel rears and a slight amount of kick-up for the front.
What degree caster blocks are you running?
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Old 08-31-2010, 02:42 PM   #472
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thanks. I got one car here setup with 2 degrees and another at 3. I like how 3 degrees locked in the rear to keep it from coming around on me, but playing with settings it may not be necessary. May try to use the 3 degree mainly for my girls cars.

So I am going to try the following:

- Long parallel links front and rear
- soften suspension up
- get arms parallel to ground

Funny thing is the stock setup on the car is actually not bad, when I was all over the place, i put it back to stock and it seemed to work much better.
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Old 08-31-2010, 03:27 PM   #473
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4* castor blocks... but that was on a pretty tight track with lots of 180* turns. A lot of off throttle entry and on throttle exit. A more flowing track might call for a 2* block, but testing would verify that.


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What degree caster blocks are you running?
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Old 08-31-2010, 03:39 PM   #474
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4* castor blocks... but that was on a pretty tight track with lots of 180* turns. A lot of off throttle entry and on throttle exit. A more flowing track might call for a 2* block, but testing would verify that.
OK that makes sense to me. (Finally after few years of trying to get my head around it all )
6* total caster = tight 180s
4* total caster = more flowing
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Old 08-31-2010, 04:04 PM   #475
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According to Xray's T2 setup book...

Less caster (0*)- decrease straight line stability; increase entry steering

More caster (6*)- increase straight line stability; increase exit steering

However, 4* seems to be standard for a lot of people. I've never had the opportunity to try the extreme ends of the spectrum.

Great setup book, definitely download it.
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Old 08-31-2010, 04:31 PM   #476
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looking for a setup for the Sprint 2 Sport for VTA...

http://www.hpiracing.com/kitinfo/708/
OK Darkside here is my setup. This is for a small,50x30, track. This is a work in progress, but it hooks up well on our track. I have the CF chassis and shock towers installed. The main chassis was a huge improvement over the plastic chassis.

FRONT
Ride Height - 6mm
Droop - 2mm over ride height
Caster - 4*
Camber - -1.5*
Toe - 0*
Upper control arm - E
Shock location - 3B
Springs - HPI Pink (15.2#)
Oil/Piston - Trinity30/2 hole
REAR
Ride Height - 6mm
Droop - 1.5mm over ride height
Camber - -1*
Toe - -3*
Upper control arm - C2
Shock location - 3B
Springs - HPI Orange (12.1#)
Oil/Piston - Trinity30/2 hole
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Old 08-31-2010, 06:21 PM   #477
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its alive...thx
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Old 08-31-2010, 09:09 PM   #478
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pejota View Post
According to Xray's T2 setup book...

Less caster (0*)- decrease straight line stability; increase entry steering

More caster (6*)- increase straight line stability; increase exit steering

However, 4* seems to be standard for a lot of people. I've never had the opportunity to try the extreme ends of the spectrum.

Great setup book, definitely download it.
Xray setup book IS great stuff. Also the XXX main book I use alot.
I run 4* no kickup. With your kickup you add to the caster angle, that's where I came up with the 6*. XXX main mentioned that with higher total caster you lose a little inital turn in but have more steering once the car settles into the turn.

TWOTONE asked what sequence to make adjustments. Here's XXX main's order

1st:
Tweak
Tires
Springs
Camber
Ride Height

2nd:
Droop
Sway bars
toe

Fine tuning:
One-ways
Shock Mounting
Shock Oil
Wheelbase
Caster
Anti-squat
Kick-up
Roll Center
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Old 09-02-2010, 09:36 AM   #479
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Originally Posted by 2xs View Post
OK Darkside here is my setup. This is for a small,50x30, track. This is a work in progress, but it hooks up well on our track. I have the CF chassis and shock towers installed. The main chassis was a huge improvement over the plastic chassis.

FRONT
Ride Height - 6mm
Droop - 2mm over ride height
Caster - 4*
Camber - -1.5*
Toe - 0*
Upper control arm - E
Shock location - 3B
Springs - HPI Pink (15.2#)
Oil/Piston - Trinity30/2 hole
REAR
Ride Height - 6mm
Droop - 1.5mm over ride height
Camber - -1*
Toe - -3*
Upper control arm - C2
Shock location - 3B
Springs - HPI Orange (12.1#)
Oil/Piston - Trinity30/2 hole
thanks for the help...I will make sure he gets the info
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Old 09-02-2010, 03:12 PM   #480
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looks like its getting close to that time again. I wonder what we will be doing out here for VTA rules since some use USVTA others VTA.

End of season last year was getting traction roll issues again.

I wonder if I am over saucing the tires. sort of like running too soft a compound in my pan cars LOL.

Slow down in the corners. LOL.
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