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1/10 R/C F1's...Pics, Discussions, Whatever...

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Old 02-22-2012, 08:26 AM
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Good stuff so far. At what point should the grandfathering of older cars stop? 1 year, 2 years, 5 years? The F104W with the old body sets kind of messed things up.

Let's look 5 years down the road. We now see mostly IRS 190mm cars running rubber tires. Motor size depends on track size. There still a few guys running F103s with the current tire and a couple hopped up F104s. We see WRC, Tamiya, 3Racing, HPI and Traxxas(tee-hee) cars as the norm. There are still guys wanting to push the envelope as their only goal in life is to win every time they set a car down. The rest of us will still be trying to win, but having fun with the hobby.
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Old 02-22-2012, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by 6376vette View Post
You summed up this whole discussion in one statement. You don't want anyone to have an advantage over your car. As long as they aren't in the top three let them run. In other words I don't care what they run as long as I win.

Again its not their car beating you its the driver and the setup. Yes technology advances and chassis become obsolete but its no reason to exclude them. If they are obsolete then why are you worried about getting beat? Sounds like the new generation of f1 missed the Mark and the 103 should be the standard. Should everyone shelf the 104 to go back to the 103? That's what is being asked of the 103 owners.

I say you in the post but it is not directed at you just used as an example.
Vette,

I do understand your post completely; I know you did not mean to attack or offend me with your post. I just want to be clear that what I said by "as long as your are not top 3 I dont care" is dont use a car that is outside the rule box for current class standards to gain an advantage is all. I do not believe a F103 to be obsolete chassis as far as speed and handling, just the Tamiya part number. Thank you for respecting my post.

Nick
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Old 02-22-2012, 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted by liljohn1064 View Post
Good stuff so far. At what point should the grandfathering of older cars stop? 1 year, 2 years, 5 years? The F104W with the old body sets kind of messed things up.

Let's look 5 years down the road. We now see mostly IRS 190mm cars running rubber tires. Motor size depends on track size. There still a few guys running F103s with the current tire and a couple hopped up F104s. We see WRC, Tamiya, 3Racing, HPI and Traxxas(tee-hee) cars as the norm. There are still guys wanting to push the envelope as their only goal in life is to win every time they set a car down. The rest of us will still be trying to win, but having fun with the hobby.
Love the post and the look into the future. Makes you think a little.

If we continue to exclude chassis based on 20mm of width from widest to thinnest then the future = no f1 class to run.
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Old 02-22-2012, 08:39 AM
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I dont think that it's a matter of the 104 being obsolete, it's about scale. In most cases, the F1 class appeals to the "modeler" in all of us. Tamiya has always tried to keep that relevant with their kits which is why the F104 is narrower like it's 1:1 counterpart, as opposed to the older generation F1s. If we allow the balance to shift from model first, racer second, we will lose the spirit of F1 R/C racing (ask a TC racer that's been around a while). F1 is pumping life back into onroad. Let's not kill it by arguing over the obvious. Paint 'em nice, charge 'em up, drive 'em hard, and have fun!
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Old 02-22-2012, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Thunderbunny View Post
I dont think that it's a matter of the 104 being obsolete, it's about scale. In most cases, the F1 class appeals to the "modeler" in all of us. Tamiya has always tried to keep that relevant with their kits which is why the F104 is narrower like it's 1:1 counterpart, as opposed to the older generation F1s. If we allow the balance to shift from model first, racer second, we will lose the spirit of F1 R/C racing (ask a TC racer that's been around a while). F1 is pumping life back into onroad. Let's not kill it by arguing over the obvious. Paint 'em nice, charge 'em up, drive 'em hard, and have fun!
+1
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Old 02-22-2012, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Thunderbunny View Post
F1 is pumping life back into onroad. Let's not kill it by arguing over the obvious. Paint 'em nice, charge 'em up, drive 'em hard, and have fun!
I agree.
The problem most of us are serious about our racing (fun class or not). When the older cars were brought out of the mothballs to compete against the newer 104..guess what? They were sometimes faster. This ticked off some folks and stirred up this whole debate/rules ect.
To be honest..most of the time at my local it was not the car..it was the wheel man.

A 103 IS scale and still readily available btw.(Tower has them in stock)

I don't think banning scale f1 cars in a class that you can buy "out of the box" at 200mm is a good idea..When a guy shows up with his 109 or 103 and finds out he can't race his f1 car in the f1 class...is where it get confusing for people looking to get into it.
When exceptions are made for the new chassis of the month and then some other cars are still left out...it confuses people even more.

I have personal experence talking with walk in's on a race day who get attracted to the class because "they look cool" and their interest quickly fades away after they walk around and get 25 different opinions from the 103/104 camp I always try and make my point to them that it's more about the driving in this class not the car.

If anything..all we really need is a tire set that is the same across all chassis.
Just don't think shelfing cars is a good idea to get the class up and running as long as they fit within a semi f1 scale appearance. (I think we all agree pan car style f1 is not what we want).

VTA=Everyone is on the same tire..width can be adjusted via hex shims (usually + or -5mm on most cars) any chassis,we know the rest of the rules.

T-car= Most tracks have a "spec" tire everyone must use..width again can be adjusted via.shims on most cars..any chassis,max width 200mm (but I think roar is still 190mm)

1/10 RCGT=Spec. tire everyone must run...open chassis,width can be adjusted for tuning.

1/10 wgt=spec tire everyone must run..open chassis,width can be adjusted for tuning.

1/12= tires (f/r) are all the same width,and diameter (for the most part ) open 1/12 chassis,width can be adjusted for tuning.
These guys have it figured out already.

We all have valid points and our passion for the class sparks up much debate..Good ,bad or indifferent.
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Old 02-22-2012, 09:28 AM
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Okay, to be honest, reading your guys posts pushs me away from this class.... Everything points back to Tamiya having a HUGE grip on this class. Let it go and let people make there decisions on what chassis to run. So what if that next guys chassis is has a slight difference... The FGX has a TRUE to scale drivetrain, since when did you see a solid axle F1 car. Or should we call these Go Karts.

When its time to buy a F1 car I will buy a FGX and enjoy it. If the next guy thinks its an advantage I'll tell him they are only $120 go buy one.
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Old 02-22-2012, 09:35 AM
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Well put.
It used to be fun the F1 class but hearing this it will be a pain to drive there.
Thank god we don't have those issues here.
We can drive the F104 in all specs(exept exotec) en de F103 also.
Foam or rubber, no problem.
Only rule is, it has to be Tamiya(dohh it is the Tamiya Cup) and you need a spec motor.
Heeps of fun and the turnout is getting bigger and bigger.

regards Roy
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Old 02-22-2012, 09:43 AM
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At this point in the game, a spec tire in F1 is virtually impossible. Some chassis work better with certain tires. If spec tires are used, it may narrow the class to one patricular car. I think we really need to look to the UF1 guys for opinions due to their extensive testing. They have been racing F1 consistantly as a group for a while now and we can learn a lot from their format and rules. The main problem I see from some of the discussions is that they are more destructive than constructive. Personally, I like the 190mm, rubber tire rule. I feel that as the class gains more ground on a local level, maybe an open class could be created; up to 200mm, foams, maybe even a hotter motor. But in the meantime, there needs to be a standard. just my $.02
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Old 02-22-2012, 09:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Pro10noob View Post
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Well put.
It used to be fun the F1 class but hearing this it will be a pain to drive there.
Yeah, I'm surprised at the arguments, to be honest.

Thank god we don't have those issues here.
We can drive the F104 in all specs(exept exotec) en de F103 also.
Foam or rubber, no problem.
Only rule is, it has to be Tamiya(dohh it is the Tamiya Cup) and you need a spec motor.
Heeps of fun and the turnout is getting bigger and bigger.
We run an 'open' F1 class at AMCA (Apeldoorn), the only limit being a club standard brushed motor (but we allow the TamiyaCup one for obvious reasons ). Simply heaps of fun.
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Old 02-22-2012, 10:00 AM
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Usf1 guys have a good set of rules with a great following of dedicated f1 racers.

Please don't confuse a discussion about current rules ect. with inner class "war"

I think we all (me included) follow our local track rules set by the local track race directors.
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Old 02-22-2012, 10:02 AM
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No reason to get turned off to f1. I can guarantee it is one of the most fun and interesting classes to run. This debates over a national rule set. Your local track will probably have a rule set that is easy to follow and a lot of fun. Some are more open some more restrictive but they are all fun. The fact that this discussion is taking place is good for the future of the class. Lots of good opinions and information. If you go to the vta thread you will find the same type of discussion right now. Its a growing pain but in the end it is good for the class. Whatever the result of this is it will have parts that we like and parts we don't but it will help f1 grow in the long run. At least we are participating and trying to come to an agreement. If more people participated in things then the USA wouldn't be facing all of the challenges it is right now. Sitting on the sidelines and not participating doesn't help anyone.

I have gained a lot of respect for everyone participating this discussion.The ones I agree with and the ones I don't. It makes me feel like I can go to any track and hang out with any of these guys and learn from them while having a ton of fun.
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Old 02-22-2012, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Thunderbunny View Post
I dont think that it's a matter of the 104 being obsolete, it's about scale. In most cases, the F1 class appeals to the "modeler" in all of us. Tamiya has always tried to keep that relevant with their kits which is why the F104 is narrower like it's 1:1 counterpart, as opposed to the older generation F1s. If we allow the balance to shift from model first, racer second, we will lose the spirit of F1 R/C racing (ask a TC racer that's been around a while). F1 is pumping life back into onroad. Let's not kill it by arguing over the obvious. Paint 'em nice, charge 'em up, drive 'em hard, and have fun!
Thunderbunny......every word you mentioned in your above post I agree with 100%. Well said. You really nailed it. It would be great if everyone had your exact feelings about this fun F1 class.
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Old 02-22-2012, 10:07 AM
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[QUOTE=ijdod;10365871]Yeah, I'm surprised at the arguments, to be honest

I don't see this as a destructive argument but rather a healthy mature discussion. No one has gotten mad or nasty over any of these posts. Sorry if it looks different but I think we all want what will help f1 grow.
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Old 02-22-2012, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by 6376vette View Post
No reason to get turned off to f1. I can guarantee it is one of the most fun and interesting classes to run. This debates over a national rule set. Your local track will probably have a rule set that is easy to follow and a lot of fun.
Well said sir.
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