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Old 05-16-2014, 07:46 AM   #916
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This doesn't apply in our case. The 2s batteries used in 1/12 scale are the same size and weight as 1s cells, so the energy storage is the same. If the motor wind is changed to maintain the same power level (i.e. 1s/10.5 versus 2s/21.5) then the battery will see the same C-rate load.

The only thing that the higher voltage buys for performance is that lighter gauge wires may be used. For a 1/12 scale car, that's a good thing!
I think the assumption was if people are all running the same motor you are punished less performance-wise for having a mediocre pack in 2s vs. 1s. My experience running both 2s and 1s classes tells me this is accurate at the club racing level.
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Old 05-16-2014, 08:40 AM   #917
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17.5 is the most popular motor size in the USA
TC or 12th

We could run any size, 13.5, 10.5 mod etc
Most choose 17.5

Not sure what that says about this market, but that's the facts

The majority of racers I talk to about 12th, don't like the foam tires, and, or think it looks too fast, or too hard to work on
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Old 05-16-2014, 09:05 AM   #918
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For your info and that is all:
1s 4000 mah pack - 115g
2s 4200 mah shorty pack - 215g
1s 7000 mah pack - 150g
2s 7600 mah pack - 330g (this wouldn't fit in a 1/12 scale without being very creative)

Fresh off of the scales
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Old 05-16-2014, 09:33 AM   #919
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2s LiPo for 1/12 scale (1s case size), 155g:

http://www.amain.com/product_info.ph...ts-74V-3200mAh
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Old 05-16-2014, 09:46 AM   #920
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I'd love to run 1/12....sadly everyone here is into "spec" gt2 sedan/don't want to be bothered with foam tires.

I really caught the bug after racing my f1 and trying out 1/12 on vrc pro. The cornering speeds are just so addictive!!!
Also if there was a rubber tire for 1/12 (pains me to say that) it might catch on here.
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Old 05-16-2014, 09:58 AM   #921
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Originally Posted by TCS_FUN View Post
I'd love to run 1/12....sadly everyone here is into "spec" gt2 sedan/don't want to be bothered with foam tires.

I really caught the bug after racing my f1 and trying out 1/12 on vrc pro. The cornering speeds are just so addictive!!!
Also if there was a rubber tire for 1/12 (pains me to say that) it might catch on here.
Mini's use rubber tires, and are about same size as 1/12

True, in Japan there are 1/12 rubber tires, they look great, but run painfully slow

12th scale is about agility, simplicity

imho
Rubber tires need 4W IS to work proper
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Old 05-16-2014, 10:03 AM   #922
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Originally Posted by RedBullFiXX View Post
Mini's use rubber tires, and are about same size as 1/12

True, in Japan there are 1/12 rubber tires, they look great, but run painfully slow

12th scale is about agility, simplicity

imho
Rubber tires need 4W IS to work proper

Agree that 1/12 is about agility, however rubber tire 21.5 2s might be better for beginners to control the speed. Personally I like foams but to get more people into it rubber might be the answer at my club anyways
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Old 05-16-2014, 10:08 AM   #923
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Originally Posted by old_dude View Post
For your info and that is all:
1s 4000 mah pack - 115g
2s 4200 mah shorty pack - 215g
1s 7000 mah pack - 150g
2s 7600 mah pack - 330g (this wouldn't fit in a 1/12 scale without being very creative)

Fresh off of the scales
Ron, aren't the current 1s packs actually 2 cell wired in parallel? I assume they could be wired in series and keep the same pack dimensions and weight.
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Old 05-16-2014, 10:11 AM   #924
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Originally Posted by howardcano View Post
2s LiPo for 1/12 scale (1s case size), 155g:

http://www.amain.com/product_info.ph...ts-74V-3200mAh
oops, missed your post. Nice find and i woudln't mind picking one up to toss in my 17.5 car to easily get my speed fix.
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Old 05-16-2014, 10:19 AM   #925
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oops, missed your post. Nice find and i woudln't mind picking one up to toss in my 17.5 car to easily get my speed fix.
It might be cheaper (but probably not easier) to just buy a used 8.5T motor to put in. That would give you about the same horsepower increase.
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Last edited by howardcano; 05-17-2014 at 07:54 AM. Reason: Removed "4X".
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Old 05-16-2014, 11:10 AM   #926
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21.5/2s gives almost exactly the same power as 10.5/1s.
Thank you...that's what I was looking for and thinking. As much as I would like to see 1/12th go 2s...that's just too fast for most people.
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Old 05-16-2014, 11:36 AM   #927
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Thank you...that's what I was looking for and thinking. As much as I would like to see 1/12th go 2s...that's just too fast for most people.
That was the problem way back when people were considering doing 2s with a 380 motor. The concept was good, but the only sensored 380 motors were made by Novak, and the winds available were WAY too much power for the average driver.

FYI, some rules of thumb are:

Power increases as the square of voltage. (Doubling the voltage gives four times the power, all else being equal.)

Power increases as the inverse square of motor turns. (Halving the number of turns gives four times the power, all else being equal.)
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Old 05-16-2014, 11:43 AM   #928
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Originally Posted by RedBullFiXX View Post
Mini's use rubber tires, and are about same size as 1/12

True, in Japan there are 1/12 rubber tires, they look great, but run painfully slow

12th scale is about agility, simplicity

imho
Rubber tires need 4W IS to work proper

If I'm not mistaken, there are certain class in Japan that runs 1/12 with 2s - 21.5T

If they could tame and control the speed of 1/12 with 2s Lipo, then no wonder if the world champs have been dominated by them.

At least they should've enjoyed the benefit of handling faster speed and agility of a mod 1/12 with their fingers.

CMIIW
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Old 05-16-2014, 12:13 PM   #929
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That was the problem way back when people were considering doing 2s with a 380 motor. The concept was good, but the only sensored 380 motors were made by Novak, and the winds available were WAY too much power for the average driver.
Bummer, even the little motors scream.
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Old 05-16-2014, 01:39 PM   #930
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Originally Posted by TCS_FUN View Post
I'd love to run 1/12....sadly everyone here is into "spec" gt2 sedan/don't want to be bothered with foam tires.

I really caught the bug after racing my f1 and trying out 1/12 on vrc pro. The cornering speeds are just so addictive!!!
Also if there was a rubber tire for 1/12 (pains me to say that) it might catch on here.
If a rubber tire could be made that works well...I think that would catch on. The problem is rubber tires do not work well on pan cars. Just drive a rubber tire F1 car and you can see the difference. Even if a rubber tire could be made that worked close to as well as foam. I'm not sure it would stick for long due to tire wear not really being as big of a benefit as most people think. On asphalt the TC guys are going through rubber tires almost as fast as 1/12th and the WGT tires are actually outlasting the TC rubber tires.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TCS_FUN View Post
Agree that 1/12 is about agility, however rubber tire 21.5 2s might be better for beginners to control the speed. Personally I like foams but to get more people into it rubber might be the answer at my club anyways
A lot depends on the surface...I find more often than not my F1 on rubber tires is much harder to control than my 1/12th on foam. Sure it will slow the cars down but at the cost of grip which beginners really need more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by howardcano View Post
That was the problem way back when people were considering doing 2s with a 380 motor. The concept was good, but the only sensored 380 motors were made by Novak, and the winds available were WAY too much power for the average driver.
I still think this is the better way to go...but we'd need manufacturers to step up and produce more sensored 380 motors.
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