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Old 02-01-2009, 05:50 PM   #796
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Default 10.5 rollout

Hi all.
Question..any one worked out the rollout for a 10.5?
Im using a lipo in a 12r5 and had mixed appeal to my local club members..
I know if i can get it to run with the nimh 10.5's..it will take off.
Im tryng 88/35=2.51.&.52mm tire=64.97 rollout..went up 2 teeth from last test, car was very slow..
Thanks
mike
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Old 02-01-2009, 09:18 PM   #797
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I don't think rubber on a 12th car would work very well.. but do you really think people would do it if it sucked for everyone ? I think Foam is for Pan Cars. Rubber needs independant suspension.
John from BSR makes rubber "capped" tires for 1/12th they work really well.
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Old 02-01-2009, 09:56 PM   #798
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John from BSR makes rubber "capped" tires for 1/12th they work really well.
Sure , I've seen those. But they are so expensive. Not in my bidget. Last I remember the oval guys ran them outside and omg I cant imagine the tire bill.
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Old 02-02-2009, 05:26 AM   #799
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Sure , I've seen those. But they are so expensive. Not in my bidget. Last I remember the oval guys ran them outside and omg I cant imagine the tire bill.
Sure they are expensive upfront, but you don't true them to nothing, run once or twice and trow away. right height is always them same and in the long run are likely much cheaper.
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Old 02-02-2009, 07:07 AM   #800
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Sure they are expensive upfront, but you don't true them to nothing, run once or twice and trow away. right height is always them same and in the long run are likely much cheaper.
They are only used on banked paved or concrete oval tracks. They don't work at all for on road (or flat track oval)...not enough grip.
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:16 AM   #801
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I ran single cell last Thursday and it was actually pretty good (for stock). I found that my Novak motor needed about a 3.6 rollout on the small track I race at so you'll probably need more than that to run on a normal sized track.

I am finding that 17.5 single cell likes a ton of timing. It will lose bottom end but it's not a big deal once you get the car to run through the corners without bogging down.

With 17.5 I think it's more important to have a speed that beginners can actually handle. Running with the same 10 or 15 guys split between two tracks is getting pretty old actually. If we can get some new racers at the club level we can eventually start running a seperate faster class.

Tire wear is great with the lighter cars. I think that 730 to 750 grams would be a good place to start. I'm finding that on some tracks you can almost run the same motor as the 4 cell guys if you run light. It's a lot easier on the motor and on the car when you pile it in.
Were are you racing 1/12th at? Same here, same 10 guys. One or two new guys but some of the other guys are leaving cause they cant figure out how to get the tweak out of these pan cars. I help as much as I can but cant build and setup everybodys car. The more help they get the better. I keep pushing the BMI car, its supposta be tweak free short of a collapst spring or broken part.

Ya, I had to play with the timming on my novak. Almost got it to not bog in the corners and still have some kinda straight away to it. Top end wise, its not really any slower than a 4cell car, just lighter with no punch. Again, have to wait for the guys to get back from snow birds to really see. Im thinking it cant keep up. Guess we will have to wait for our own class. Mean while I will be trying to get the last little bit out of this 17.5. Really like the 13.5 though and if had the choice thats what I would run.


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Old 02-02-2009, 09:17 AM   #802
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They are only used on banked paved or concrete oval tracks. They don't work at all for on road (or flat track oval)...not enough grip.
Yeah I assumed (perhaps incorrectly) that he knew that when pricing.
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Old 02-02-2009, 11:12 AM   #803
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Were are you racing 1/12th at?
I'm running in the Michigan area. I tend to hit a few of the tracks in the area during the season.

We ran 13.5 single cell Saturday on a fairly big track in Grand Rapids and it was pretty good. Not really a good speed for beginners but the guys I was running with are fairly good. The whole single cell deal seems to be pretty dependant on speedo and timing. None of us were running the exact same speedo and motor but it did seem like having the correct speedo made a big difference.

I was running a Tekin RS and Novak motor. Timing and "boost" were cranked and I had a rollout of about 3.15 with 13.5 and no weight added.
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Old 02-02-2009, 03:57 PM   #804
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I'm running in the Michigan area. I tend to hit a few of the tracks in the area during the season.

We ran 13.5 single cell Saturday on a fairly big track in Grand Rapids and it was pretty good. Not really a good speed for beginners but the guys I was running with are fairly good. The whole single cell deal seems to be pretty dependant on speedo and timing. None of us were running the exact same speedo and motor but it did seem like having the correct speedo made a big difference.

I was running a Tekin RS and Novak motor. Timing and "boost" were cranked and I had a rollout of about 3.15 with 13.5 and no weight added.
Ive been racing at larrys and msi. Yep, LRP with Novak motor. 13.5 rolled to 3.15, motor cranked and speedo on 6 (out of 8). With the 17.5 I had to crank both the speedo and motor up. Still working on the roll out. No weight added.

Grand rapids is a bit too far for me to travel. Maybe I will get up to yipsi some time.

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Old 02-09-2009, 01:47 PM   #805
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Here's my newest car. A "CRC Gen-X T-Force A123 Spec" The chassis is for a 2S A123 (6.6V, 2300mAh) battery.

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Old 02-09-2009, 03:54 PM   #806
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They are only used on banked paved or concrete oval tracks. They don't work at all for on road (or flat track oval)...not enough grip.
I use BSR capped tires on my solar car and they work just fine....

but then again, my solar car only puts out 30watts peak power and weighs 1000g.



Capped tires are good for lowering rolling resistance and that is about it. On oval cars that is a good thing, on road course that could lead to some tail slides. The design for capped tires would end up having to have the same properties as sedans rubber tires to make them work on 1/12. I'll stick with pan cars having foam and independant suspension cars having rubber.
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Old 02-09-2009, 04:25 PM   #807
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Could not agree more, so why is everyone trying to find an equivalency to stock speed??

Li-Po would have a lot less resistance if it emerged as another (slower class) Sure numbers might divide at first but in the end it will either work or not.

Slower speeds and easier for novice seems to be the recurring theme, running these cars with a 13.5 and light (skitish at speed) weight does not fit either idea.

I happen to enjoy helping 'some kid' run and have and do at times sacrifice my run/prep to help. Realistically the Stock speeds are simply too fast for most true beginners and the line required to run near the front requires a lot of practice at any speed. Slow em down would help all the way around.

Long live 17.5 or 21.5 Li-po
An easy fix to this problem would be for every track to start implimenting a min weight for these lipo cars and start weighing them... 740 grams-now everyone can race on a level playing field.

Not rocket science right??
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Old 02-09-2009, 05:09 PM   #808
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An easy fix to this problem would be for every track to start implimenting a min weight for these lipo cars and start weighing them... 740 grams-now everyone can race on a level playing field.

Not rocket science right??
740 grams with a 13.5 is still faster than stock 4 cell. They're close but not the same. Some of the complainers will go nuts.

We ran both mixed last weekend and it wasn't a big deal. No problems with people hitting each other or anything like that. We did have decent drivers on the track but it's not hard to run both together.
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Old 02-13-2009, 11:07 AM   #809
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Ok, I machined a lipo plate for my car out of steel, thats all we had at work, and it came in around 80'ish grams. Got to try it this wed. Well, the car did have a little less snap out of the corner but every thing else was fine. As much as I hate to admit it.....the car handled better. Would rotate easyer into the corner witch translate's into lifting off the throttle less and more corner speed. But that was mostly the 180s, everywhere else it seemed really close to the light version. It did have just a touch more rear traction too but it turned the same lap times and with the same consistancy. Starting to think I would need a softer spring up front when running the light version to get that off power steering the heavy setup has.

The car was really close to the old roar weight, tipped the scales at 785 grams. I only ran it in one of the qual's so cant comment on tire wear but Im sure its more than the 708 grams I was running the rest of the night.

unfortunately I cant run it tonight against the fast guys to see how close they are because of all the crying thats going on at my track but hopfully soon I will get a chance to put it up against the fast guys and see whats needed from there. It started as 13.5 light, was told its a slight advantage, then did 17.5 light and got ripped up in the hp department. Tonight is 17.5/4cell so I dont have to listen to it. Soon it will be 13.5/1c at old roar weight. Starting to think that between 750 and 800 grams is where it will land to be dead even with the 4cell cars. Just hope after this points series is over theres still a guy or two left to run with for testing.

Will keep you guys posted on the testing.

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Old 02-13-2009, 12:02 PM   #810
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I doubt that you'll ever see single cell be dead even with the 4 cell cars because they have different powerbands.

They can run together but they aren't going to be the "same". It's not a big deal at a club level as far as I'm concerned but the class needs to be seperated at big races. Maybe even with a 17.5 single cell class at 750 grams or so.
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