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Old 11-25-2008, 01:47 PM   #466
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But 1 cell is the way to go.. and as for my humble opinion... stick with 17.5 and make it a real drivers race! not a speed issue. Hell I watched 4 formittible opponents race at CEFX and couldnt keep their cars together for 5 mins let alone 8. And the fella that one , drove the slowest car on the track. Speed makes it costly and frustrating. Lets put the FUN back in RACING.
John since when is racing about how slow U can go. No I'm not trying to be mean but If racing is too costly for U, try Bowling, or play video games. And as for putting the Fun back in Racing if it's not fun for U anymore, why are U still doing it? Again I am only asking a question.
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Old 11-25-2008, 01:50 PM   #467
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I haven't read every post in here, but what I am getting from what I did read is that some people believe that 1cell Lipo is the future of 12th scale. Here are the problems I see: 1st= there are T-bar cars currently being made and they require a saddle pack. What that means is if U have one of these cars U have to buy a new one. That just raised expense for some people, like me who is running a Corally SP12X to try to sell it which won't be easy because who ever buys it couldn't use it either, or I shelf it forever and then spend $200+ on a new kit just so I can still race.

The second problem comes if 1c lipo replaces 4cell. there wouldn't be much need for battery matchers. 2c lipos are already hurting some matchers and a couple already closed shop. So if 4cell is replaced not only do long time supporters have to buy all new stuff, but the Matchers have to close and alot of people have to find new jobs.

If single cell Lipo's can't be implemented into RC like 2 cell was. Why make it.

And If your answer is cost and/ or it's easier to maintain, Please tell me 1= which form of racing doen't cost money. Which is easy to maintain. And who started racing as a hobby because it's cheap.
Take the time to read the thread then. It's about a whole lot more than that.

I'm sorry, but progress never stops because change may put someone out of business -- that's just the way it goes. Do you think carriage makers were thrilled about the invention of the automobile? The smart ones adapted and started coachbuilding for auto manufacturers. The transistor wasn't axed because it would bankrupt the vacuum tube industry. I could fill pages with similar analogies, but hopefully you get the picture. Sounds cold, but it's ust the way it is.

Even Trinity, who used to very publicly bash brushless technology, is now becoming a major player in the brushless market.
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Old 11-25-2008, 01:53 PM   #468
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That just raised expense for some people, like me who is running a Corally SP12X to try to sell it which won't be easy because who ever buys it couldn't use it either, or I shelf it forever and then spend $200+ on a new kit just so I can still race.
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I'm not trying to be mean but If racing is too costly for U, try Bowling, or play video games.
Arguing with yourself in consecutive posts?
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Old 11-25-2008, 01:56 PM   #469
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Take the time to read the thread then. It's about a whole lot more than that.

I'm sorry, but progress never stops because change may put someone out of business -- that's just the way it goes. Do you think carriage makers were thrilled about the invention of the automobile? The smart ones adapted and started coachbuilding for auto manufacturers. The transistor wasn't axed because it would bankrupt the vacuum tube industry. I could fill pages with similar analogies, but hopefully you get the picture. Sounds cold, but it's ust the way it is.

Even Trinity, who used to very publicly bash brushless technology, is now becoming a major player in the brushless market.
I understand completely. My thing is if the 2 can't coexist wht make it. And my main thing was and still is what major race organization is making their races cheaper and easier on the racers. Not Nascar, not the NHRA, not the IHRA. Safer yes. CHEAPER and EASIER NO
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:01 PM   #470
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Arguing with yourself in consecutive posts?

Not arguing with myself. I like racing. And I race both on and off road. Nitro and electric. I also bowl and play games on my computer and PS3.
If U read my post I'm not complaing about the cost of racing, I'm saying if it's too hard for U why are U still in it
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:06 PM   #471
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John since when is racing about how slow U can go. No I'm not trying to be mean but If racing is too costly for U, try Bowling, or play video games. And as for putting the Fun back in Racing if it's not fun for U anymore, why are U still doing it? Again I am only asking a question.
LOL I'm pretty confidant I can handle it .. Problem is most ppl cant. And we need more ppl in this sport/hobby. I can afford to race , thats not the issue here . I for one greatly miss 10.5 in my T/C . Some of the best racing is where most everyone can be right there running with the pack so to speak. I had to give up off road racing as it is way out of hand. I love the global Spec GT class as its fast enough but not crazy! But still it would seem that everyone would perfer Li-Po's over "round cells" and 2 cells are way too fast in that car. As for T-Bars.... I know some ppl love 'em but... they are fading fast ! That fiberglass center section is best suited for billiard table smooth tracks , and last I checked .. billiard tables are far too small for 1/12th racing. Almost every car has gone to the non t-bar style and as for those that havnt well... time for a new design! And as for the matchers? If they havnt started doing lithium whatever .... perhaps they should have closed their doors long ago. Time chames things and things change the times.
Either S**t or get off the pot. Every class out there in every country is trying to slow the cars down, weather you like it or not. 5 cells for this 4 for that... I think it overdue actually. Things have gotten out of hand and I for one dont want to see R/C racing go down like Slot cars did! I hope I have made my point a bit more clear.
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:11 PM   #472
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I understand completely. My thing is if the 2 can't coexist wht make it. And my main thing was and still is what major race organization is making their races cheaper and easier on the racers. Not Nascar, not the NHRA, not the IHRA. Safer yes. CHEAPER and EASIER NO
You might want to do a little research on those sanctioning bodies in regards to less expensive racing.

And for the speed thing, go run mod for a bit and see if a 4.5 is too fast.

It's about racing and if the class you're running is too slow then run a faster class.
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:19 PM   #473
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LOL I'm pretty confidant I can handle it .. Problem is most ppl cant. And we need more ppl in this sport/hobby. I can afford to race , thats not the issue here . I for one greatly miss 10.5 in my T/C . Some of the best racing is where most everyone can be right there running with the pack so to speak. I had to give up off road racing as it is way out of hand. I love the global Spec GT class as its fast enough but not crazy! But still it would seem that everyone would perfer Li-Po's over "round cells" and 2 cells are way too fast in that car. As for T-Bars.... I know some ppl love 'em but... they are fading fast ! That fiberglass center section is best suited for billiard table smooth tracks , and last I checked .. billiard tables are far too small for 1/12th racing. Almost every car has gone to the non t-bar style and as for those that havnt well... time for a new design! And as for the matchers? If they havnt started doing lithium whatever .... perhaps they should have closed their doors long ago. Time chames things and things change the times.
Either S**t or get off the pot. Every class out there in every country is trying to slow the cars down, weather you like it or not. 5 cells for this 4 for that... I think it overdue actually. Things have gotten out of hand and I for one dont want to see R/C racing go down like Slot cars did! I hope I have made my point a bit more clear.
Clear sure. But how much slower do U want 1/12 scales to be. They use to use 6cell's, now 4. Now people want 1 cell Lipo's. The only electric onroad class that has survived the test of time without dying is about to. But ROAR has the final say, so I'll just wait and see what they do.
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:23 PM   #474
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And for the speed thing, go run mod for a bit and see if a 4.5 is too fast.

It's about racing and if the class you're running is too slow then run a faster class.
I prefer mod. I have a 4.5 and about TEN 6t mod motors. I run stock at my LHS because nobody wants to race mod. The faster the better, but I have whats needed to adapt if I have too.
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:28 PM   #475
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I understand completely. My thing is if the 2 can't coexist wht make it. And my main thing was and still is what major race organization is making their races cheaper and easier on the racers. Not Nascar, not the NHRA, not the IHRA. Safer yes. CHEAPER and EASIER NO
You're comparing apples to oranges. Nobody's worrying about the expense of RC racing at the national or world level. Look at SCCA and NASA, for example, which are the two major sanctioning bodies for amateur club racing in the US. There is constant work to reduce the costs of racing and to keep speeds reasonable for the weekend warrior.

Even then, you're wrong. Look at Formula 1, far and away the most expensive racing in the world. There is constant, year-round, 24/7 debate over costs and legions of people whose sole purpose in life is to figure out how to control and reduce those costs. Continuing with the F1 analogy, there is a similar effort underway to try and make it more feasible for new teams to enter the game. So, in a nutshell, CHEAPER AND EASIER YES.
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:30 PM   #476
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Clear sure. But how much slower do U want 1/12 scales to be. They use to use 6cell's, now 4. Now people want 1 cell Lipo's. The only electric onroad class that has survived the test of time without dying is about to. But ROAR has the final say, so I'll just wait and see what they do.
All the same crying happened when the 6-cell to 4-cell switch came about.

You don't survive the test of time by operating with blinders on, refusing to acknowledge what's going on around you. You adapt and evolve in an intelligent, well thought-out way.
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:39 PM   #477
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You're comparing apples to oranges. Nobody's worrying about the expense of RC racing at the national or world level. Look at SCCA and NASA, for example, which are the two major sanctioning bodies for amateur club racing in the US. There is constant work to reduce the costs of racing and to keep speeds reasonable for the weekend warrior.

Even then, you're wrong. Look at Formula 1, far and away the most expensive racing in the world. There is constant, year-round, 24/7 debate over costs and legions of people whose sole purpose in life is to figure out how to control and reduce those costs. Continuing with the F1 analogy, there is a similar effort underway to try and make it more feasible for new teams to enter the game. So, in a nutshell, CHEAPER AND EASIER YES.
RC has Spec class and those TT01's which are slow and cheap. U want new racers in our hobby get them in there. Why mess with a formula thats worked for years. All these new classes are killing our Hobby more than the speed.

I started racing in 1990 and it was Stock for newbies and Mod for vet's. Now we have Stock, Super Stock, Spec, Mod, VTA, RCGT. U want 1 cell Lipo's make it Spec. Give a choice like in 10th scale. Since Spec is CHEAPER AND EASIER. That way U have cost control for newbies in 12th scale and if they want to go faster they can.
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:43 PM   #478
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All the same crying happened when the 6-cell to 4-cell switch came about.

You don't survive the test of time by operating with blinders on, refusing to acknowledge what's going on around you. You adapt and evolve in an intelligent, well thought-out way.
I guess we live in too different times. I don't remember any crying.
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:46 PM   #479
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I prefer mod. I have a 4.5 and about TEN 6t mod motors. I run stock at my LHS because nobody wants to race mod. The faster the better, but I have whats needed to adapt if I have too.
There's a reason why nobody wants to race you. It's way too fast for the vast majority of people out there. It's probably too fast for you, no offense. I only say that because when I go to national races, there are about 3 or 4 guys actually driving the cars, and the rest of the A main is just hanging on. Not to mention, 10.5 is like .2 slower on the hot lap than mod. Ray Darroch's 10.5 1/12 time at the last ROAR nats would have TQ'd mod 1/12 for the first 2 or 3 rounds if I remember right. That should tell you how hard the cars are to drive.
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:46 PM   #480
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Clear sure. But how much slower do U want 1/12 scales to be. They use to use 6cell's, now 4. Now people want 1 cell Lipo's. The only electric onroad class that has survived the test of time without dying is about to. But ROAR has the final say, so I'll just wait and see what they do.
12th is one of the classes that's had change over the years and that's part of the reason that it is still around. Tons of limits have been placed on 12th and many of them have been to reduce the speed of the cars to keep speeds reasonable. For the most part, the changes came one at a time and didn't totally change the class.

Bottom line is that we need to have new racers in 12th to have a future. At the moment that's not happening.
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