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Old 09-22-2003, 01:18 PM   #31
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Originally posted by che
I would like to see a single shaft car with the drive line (shaft), lowered further down than the TC3. Cut an opening in the chassis and have the shaft site 'into the chassis, almost level with bottom of the chassis. Then you could put a low center brace down the middle to stiffen it, or center mount your batteries (like Joel mentioned) on top of the shaft.

I know the beveled gearing to the diffs would be difficult to re-work, but this would make a LC of gravity car with lots of mounting options for electrics and batteries.
Agian, good thoughts, however totally impossible, you need to mount the spur to the shaft, which means either raise the chassis 15mm or use a spur that is less than 4mm in diameter. Otherwise take a Tamiya TL01 drivetrain and turn it on it's side...... However I don't think anyone would concider a "top shelf" tourer based on the TL01 drivetrain........either way it is impossible, however you are just like Joel and "looking outside the box"... too bad soo many TC manufacturers don't try the same...... Let's see who isn't afraid to try new things...... Schumacher, Losi, Kyosho, Corally, and RC Labs....... HMMMMM....... Does anyone remember 5-7 years ago when there where 70 TC's in the touring mag and only 3-4 looked alike... now it's probably less than 25-30 and $90 look alike!!!
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Old 09-22-2003, 01:27 PM   #32
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i think we should use the TC3 shaft down the middle..with the evo 3 or Sd diff cases, with R2 Diffs and Xray Pivot ball suspension arms, and evo 3 steering linkage. this would be an interesting car indeed...I know its copieing the other cars...just combineing their strong points.

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Old 09-22-2003, 01:28 PM   #33
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shaft drive down the bottom center line with the batteries in the center with a direct drive rear end !and laid down shocks!
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Old 09-22-2003, 01:35 PM   #34
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Default Does the world need another TC3???

As I stated before.... but nobody seemed to read.... ALL shaft tourers will basically be TC3 clones. You can flip the motor and batteries all you want... it will still be the same due to the inherant traits of the shaft!! Try as you might you can't beat physics....

As was stated earlier he wants to reuse the drivetrain, and suspension... BUT make a car that is different from the origional..... Shaft cars can't be that much different from the origional!!


WHY belts?!?!?!?
So you guys may not be totally enthusiastic about belt cars, but you can take the origional drive train, mix and match diffs, pulleys, and belts to get what you want!! making a totally different car! Not to mention battery pack style (in-line, 2+4,3+3, 5+1 if you want!) Place the cells anywhere you want (6 down 1 side, saddles midship, saddles post motor, ect.) The motor can also go just about anywhere on the chassis........
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Old 09-22-2003, 01:42 PM   #35
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its not a tc3 clone you have to think its virtually impossible to get a belt down low over and under and the shocks laying down would get rid of the shock towers up in the air
besides we all know that the shaft is more effeciant just because you dont like it doesnt mean everybody else should follow
i have had just about every belt drive touring car out there and for performance and maintanence shaft beats out belt every time.
granted shaft sound like a vacumm cleaner but hey if i could be world champion with a hoover so be it!
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Old 09-22-2003, 01:51 PM   #36
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Post Finally my idea!!!!

I wish to mix the RC Labs 7.0 even, with the Losi XXX-S, and 414M2!!

OK start with the RC Labs chassis layout, cells saddled rear, motor midship. With the M2 suspension and geometry (tough as nails, and works well too, Mixed with the Entire drivetrain from the XXX-S.

To accomidate the saddles rearward and midship layout the motor must be centralized (crossways in the chassis) so instead of having the belt from the top of the rear pulley wrap around the layshaft pulley the belt will need to come from the bottom of the front pulley to the layshaft pulley giving you clearance for the motor.

BTW: the entire drive train will be exposed.

Just imagine!!!



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SWEET!!!! SWEET!!!!
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Old 09-22-2003, 01:55 PM   #37
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center of gravity seems a bit high there impact we've been talkng about bringing the wieght down low all those cars seem to have the wieght up there!.
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Old 09-22-2003, 02:00 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally posted by speedxl
its not a tc3 clone you have to think its virtually impossible to get a belt down low over and under and the shocks laying down would get rid of the shock towers up in the air
besides we all know that the shaft is more effeciant just because you dont like it doesnt mean everybody else should follow
i have had just about every belt drive touring car out there and for performance and maintanence shaft beats out belt every time.
granted shaft sound like a vacumm cleaner but hey if i could be world champion with a hoover so be it!
Shaft drive is more efficient?? Please explain.. we don't really need to ague this out here(it has been done millions of times before), but just because a few think shaft cars are more efficient doesn't make it the "golden rule".... Please explain in an e-mail to me how shaft cars are more efficient when they have to change spinning momentum from one direction to 90deg.....

I never said I don't like shaft cars I SAID any shaft car you design will be a TC3 clone.....

BTW: if you want the absolute lowest C/G shaft car go find a Tenth Tech Predator.......
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Old 09-22-2003, 02:11 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally posted by speedxl
center of gravity seems a bit high there impact we've been talkng about bringing the wieght down low all those cars seem to have the wieght up there!.
You my freind are obnoxious, I have listened to all of you guys ideas about these shaft cars, yet you can't even use you imagination as to how my chassis idea
would actually work!! and be cool at the same time!! NOBODY has done used my chassis layout as a total yet... that makes it a step ahead.... beside all of the major weighty components are setting low on those chassis' and I am not saying use ALL the parts from each, it is all deopendant on how you mount them..... Shocks and shock towers are 1 thing you have to sacrifice C/G wise to get a car that handles well....

Quick RC physics lesson, you just can't throw shocks on at just any level or angle and expect the car to work!! There is a reason that most cars with cantelever shock suffer from poor handling, if any idiot could do it we would all have them on our cars....
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Old 09-22-2003, 02:33 PM   #40
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I owned an RC Lab Seven Even (original version) and liked the center mounted design (well balanced). I also like the fact that it used the same bulkheads, blocks, carriers and arms front and rear. They also had some great (tough) delrin arms.

This idea keeps the spare parts required to a minimum, which is very good.

I have also seen some very smooth, efficient XXS machines out there too.

Edward you may want to look at something like this in a little more detail.

...good idea...
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Old 09-22-2003, 02:47 PM   #41
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The only way to drop the center shaft lower would be to use a 3 gear setup... You'd have to work out all your ratio's based on 3 gears though... The idler gear would be a bit on the large side, most likely...
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Old 09-22-2003, 03:16 PM   #42
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No, it's not the only way. Think of real rear-wheel driven cars. The prop-shaft is usually offset from the driveshaft height. This however would lead to using non straight-cut gears.
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Old 09-22-2003, 03:26 PM   #43
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I think the shaft driven idea is good. There is alot less rotating mass. But the belt driven cars are more forgiving when you are driving them real hard on carpet. The one thing that I have found is you really have to wheel TC3 or carpet when running Mod but the belt cars are a little easier to drive when running Mod. I think this has to do with the belts giving just a little to the high bite of carpet. But on the other hand for the most part shaft driven cars have a smoother drive train but you can make a belted car have just as smooth as a drive train it just takes more work.

Impact,
Quit being so one sided and telling everyone that what they are saying wont work. You never know until you try. THat is why this is a brain storm to get all the pros and cons of different drivetrains and chassis designs. If it doesnt work than you start over. But I do agree that any shaft car will basically be a modified TC3.
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Old 09-22-2003, 03:33 PM   #44
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impact without getting personal dont be calling me names you dont know me and i dont know you i think you will be barking up the wrong tree! first of all the drive shaft going at 90deg angle dont mean crap if the method of transfering the mechanical leverage is done correctly as associated has done via the type of gears and the material used belts flop around and have excesive whip lash also suffer from poor free spin due to the eneffeciancy of the parasitc drag fron the rubber and the binding effect of the fibers used to keep the damn thing from pulling apart, with a prop shaft car you can set lash which can be set and as for a belt a tensioner is what you would be used which needs tension(drag) to keep it from skipping, just because we play or talk on these chat rooms doesnt mean we wont find out who we are please be advised i didnt insult you! if you cant handle criticism then turn your computor off and dont post anything here, i disscused in a proper foremat what the threads stipulates building a prototype and all i posted was in reply to someone elses idea i am sure we can call you of sorts of names and say you idea sucks but we havent i am giving you an educated statement on cars that dont perform well and as we know its a compliment when everybody starts building a car that ressembles the tc3 (yokomo, hpi) i wont say tamyia because they had it first
and these are all world champion cars. go figure shafts must be that good! comments without insults are appreciated! dude!
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Old 09-22-2003, 03:38 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally posted by speedxl
impact without getting personal dont be calling me names you dont know me and i dont know you i think you will be barking up the wrong tree! first of all the drive shaft going at 90deg angle dont mean crap if the method of transfering the mechanical leverage is done correctly as associated has done via the type of gears and the material used belts flop around and have excesive whip lash also suffer from poor free spin due to the eneffeciancy of the parasitc drag fron the rubber and the binding effect of the fibers used to keep the damn thing from pulling apart, with a prop shaft car you can set lash which can be set and as for a belt a tensioner is what you would be used which needs tension(drag) to keep it from skipping, just because we play or talk on these chat rooms doesnt mean we wont find out who we are please be advised i didnt insult you! if you cant handle criticism then turn your computor off and dont post anything here, i disscused in a proper foremat what the threads stipulates building a prototype and all i posted was in reply to someone elses idea i am sure we can call you of sorts of names and say you idea sucks but we havent i am giving you an educated statement on cars that dont perform well and as we know its a compliment when everybody starts building a car that ressembles the tc3 (yokomo, hpi) i wont say tamyia because they had it first
and these are all world champion cars. go figure shafts must be that good! comments without insults are appreciated! dude!
Well said!

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