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Old 10-02-2008, 05:26 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by blazeblazucki View Post
There is also a temperature issue when racing on lipos ,, more power = higher temperature of tires more wear , les grip etc.

Lipos are a good idea but only when racing with motor limit and longer race time.
there´s no temperature issue running lipo, why do you say so?
and if you want a stock class there´s no need you have already plenty of them 27T, 13.5T, 10.5T.
Why limit the mod class (doesn´t that mean modified), so keep it as it is (mod).

if you can´t run a 3.5T run a lower one as somebody told, but let who has ability to run a 3,5T, be able to have that otpion.
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Old 10-02-2008, 06:23 PM   #32
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I agree with a lot of thing I have seen here concerning witch motor to use with Lipo. I think a stock class with a 9,5 or 10,5t motor would be a success Luic. We had our 1st Stock National Camp. with some new people and also with some oldies.

In modifies I know what motor should I use with a Lipo and it was never in my mind a 2,5 or 3,5t or equivalent in delta to race with. The problem is those who presume that using a 2,5 is an advantage and believe it, there are people thinking on that! Some of those people that I know who are thinking jumping to modified, have difficult to go inline in a straight with his stock TC. The problem is not only for him when he hit a wall and destroy his car but when he hit someone’s car and ruined his race.

I agree too that a motor limit could easily be cheated. I would like to see a battery substitute for the modified class 5 cell Nimh, for example the A123 6,6v 4600 mAh cells, but never 7,4 batteries.

I was too in Collegno in 2006 and I remember as well those A finals, with esc’s and motors stopping in a queue, resulting in the EFRA decision to reduce to 5 cells.

rcpoint, that Tamiya driver you are referring is Jilles, Toni?
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Old 10-02-2008, 07:33 PM   #33
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My friends. I see a lot of people remembering Collegno, Italy, 2006.

You must be honest, by that time the majority of people were using brushed motors.

For some reasons that I believe some people have already exposed here in RcTech (if I can recall i believe i have said it too with some simple calculations) brushed motor with just a few turns, hot weather, powerful batteries and last but not least, weak ESC, are just an accident waiting to happen.

Nowadays people run brushless motors, they can easily take more abuse in terms of power, as they are much more efficient. And the maker of those ESC claim there equipment is much stronger now.

A lot of people is already using lipos with brushless motor in very powerful combinations with very good results.

What are you afraid of?

ROAR has made the use of those batteries possible for some time now.

Is important for us in Europe listen for what north american drivers have to say about that, don't you think so?

Last edited by PDM; 10-05-2008 at 08:04 AM.
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Old 10-02-2008, 07:53 PM   #34
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... Some of those people that I know who are thinking jumping to modified, have difficult to go inline in a straight with his stock TC.
What a hell of an argument.

Possibly some drivers are like you say. But you know some others are not.
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Old 10-02-2008, 08:42 PM   #35
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Sorry if I repeat something but after reading 1/2 way through the 1st page I have a few things to say...

We recently switched to lipo/6cell only in australia. This was voted on by the clubs affiliated with our governing body. So in other words the drivers choose this.

People will always bolt in more power than they can handle. This is a fact of either 5 or 6 cell. This is just how some people are think more motor is faster.

Mod usually has less crashing because the drivers are generally better. But ultimatley its the driver who pays if he crashes so why should it bother someone else?

Yes parts will wear quicker.. But this will be offset by the fact that I don't need to buy new packs for every major meet. Current nimhs are good for 1 moth tops at mod level. If you don't know this you either don't race mod or are too slow to notice.

That is my opinion...

And last thing... Fact...

Chassis layout will change to suit lipo packs. Where will this leave the 5cell boys?
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Old 10-03-2008, 07:31 AM   #36
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>
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Last edited by MSB; 10-03-2008 at 09:14 AM.
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Old 10-03-2008, 07:33 AM   #37
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My friends. I see a lot of people remembering Collegno, Italy, 2006.

You must be honest, by that time people were using brushed motors.

...
What a hell of a statement! WRONG! In that worlds brushless motors and esc was already in use.

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Old 10-03-2008, 12:37 PM   #38
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Thanks for the help, Miguel.

I'll change to "the majority of people were using..." as soon as RcTech gets back to the normal speed. Quite slow today.

(Done)

Last edited by PDM; 10-05-2008 at 08:05 AM.
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Old 10-03-2008, 01:29 PM   #39
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I think most forget that in Europe whe dont use foam tires.

And with todays rubber tires drivers just cant go any faster. Tires dont provide necesery level of grip.

Some one accused me of not letting people have a choice, or being unable to handle 2,5 turn motors. . Why do you think so many racers quit from touring cars and move to GT class or 12 class? is 12 class slower? Its just a matter of having comparable level of power to grip.

And whats most important if you let everything free in a car, the gap between
team drivers and privateers would be bigger than it is. ( see Formula one.. smaller teams cant stand competition )

Efra is organization , which should make this sport in a reach of everybody.

At this time in my opinion we should rather put more pressure on the quality of nimh cells.
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Old 10-03-2008, 01:31 PM   #40
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I'm not so sure Mod with LiPo would be a great idea in Europe. I mean it would be great fun for some top guys - i know i'd enjoy it, but i am not sure it would be so good for the racers as a whole.

The last Euros had 150 entries, when the link to the heat list was posted up here, many people from the US said they couldn't believe how many people there were running mod in Europe. From what i understand, mod is basically finished in the US?? or is this not true??

What do the top guys think about running 6 cell at the worlds?? bearing in mind it is now only US really running 6 cell. Well, i spoke to someone that i'd considder one of those to contend with at Worlds, and he thought it was crazy - nothing would last - electronics, cars, tyres etc. I don't see LiPo improving this situation.

Last Season in UK, one of the HB team ran LiPo in practice for one of our mod nationals. Me and Andy Moore stood watching - it was crazy fast, we were both just laughting. Far faster than our own 5 cell cars. No real surprise there.

So, i'm not convinced it would be such a good thing at this time. Don't get me wrong, LiPo is cool, i run it at small indoor club every week with 10.5. It's great, so easy to race with for the night. This isn't mod though.
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Old 10-03-2008, 01:49 PM   #41
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HMMM??
after reading the last 2 pages I see a 'trend' among the "Mod' class in Europe
2.5 B/L?? on rubber tires?? and your worried about the added voltage of the 7.4 lipo??

Come on, this is one reason the 'privateer' has left the building, if he can't afford 20 good nimh packs hes out in the cold!!
2 lipos and hes ready to rumble!!!

heck yes more voltage =more speed
drop back to a 5.5 then
what do I always hear from the 'fast guyz'
"Slower is Faster"??

at a club level [yes stock] our racers have embraced lipos as a lower overall cost of racing
10.5/19t rubber tire [asphalt] ALL use lipos

all you can do is try it, see where it goes

Thankx, Bill
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Old 10-03-2008, 02:35 PM   #42
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What a hell of a statement! WRONG! In that worlds brushless motors and esc was already in use.

Sorry, but i see eight brushed 7 x 1 motors and only two brushless motors!!!

Not so very WRONG though!!

greetz,

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Old 10-03-2008, 04:09 PM   #43
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Bill, yeah there is a trend - people are actually racing mod, at least at National/European level. When we were still running 6 cell (and brushless was just starting to appear) numbers were on a downward trend.

I don't think people are running 2.5 on 5 cell now, no one can make runtime - at least in UK anyway.

Yeah sure, LiPo would be fun, and i'd run it with mod for sure. Suspect we'd run 4 turn maybe, same as i think the guys did at RCS at worlds warm up.

I just think many of the lesser drivers (and i don't mean that in a nasty way) would be put off even trying it - they'd effectively be scard of it. Just my view.
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Old 10-03-2008, 04:17 PM   #44
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Bill, yeah there is a trend - people are actually racing mod, at least at National/European level. When we were still running 6 cell (and brushless was just starting to appear) numbers were on a downward trend.

I don't think people are running 2.5 on 5 cell now, no one can make runtime - at least in UK anyway.

Yeah sure, LiPo would be fun, and i'd run it with mod for sure. Suspect we'd run 4 turn maybe, same as i think the guys did at RCS at worlds warm up.

I just think many of the lesser drivers (and i don't mean that in a nasty way) would be put off even trying it - they'd effectively be scard of it. Just my view.
Why would they be scared? If Lipo and 4T BL is too fast for them, they can try a 4.5 or 5.5...no need to force anyone to run 3 or 4T motors? They can start with 5.5 and as they get better move up...what's wrong with that?

But think of all the advantages of running Lipo Less maintanance and equipment and more practice time per track day, which will help people get better with set up and driver because they can spend more time on the track running their cars and refining their skills.
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Old 10-03-2008, 04:23 PM   #45
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I know all about the advantages, like i said i run LiPo for 10,5 at club. I think some of those advantages will go away once LiPo becomes more competition orientated - but that's a whole different discussion, and hey i could be wrong!!

You're totally right in theory. In practice, it won't happen IMHO. The drivers will look at what the top guys run, and will decide they have to run same. They'll either do that, and break stuff, or decide they don't want to go down that road and not even try. It happend with 6 cell brushed mod. People stopped racing it rather than fit a 10 turn.
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