R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-07-2008, 08:43 AM   #1
Tech Adept
 
machead2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 220
Trader Rating: 53 (100%+)
Default Favouritism and biasness at Tamiya Asian Championship Final?

If you break the R&R and get caught red handed, which of the following should apply :

1) Penalised for the offense, or
2) Let off with a warning and results still valid.

I am a law abiding citizen, if I break the rules/laws, I will have to pay the price for the offense...but at TAC finals, its a different story all together.

If your country is a major market for Tamiya, then you can bend the rules...if you are a small market....Sorry, you just have to bend over and take anything that shoved into you!!!

Last edited by machead2; 09-07-2008 at 09:49 AM.
machead2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 09:20 AM   #2
Tech Initiate
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 26
Default Sad Day

I was at there observing the race. It is sad day for such an event to be marred by these events. I wonder if the Tamiya officials are putting thru a message saying, it is ok to cheat, it is ok to be caught, better still, we will close one eye.

I think our locally organized club races have more integrity than this TAC finals.

If Tamiya Japan is watching this thread, please ask your representative, why the double standard.

It is a very sad day for RC indeed.
teamB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 10:18 AM   #3
Tech Elite
 
Tommi Makkinen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Somewhere... still racing...
Posts: 4,698
Trader Rating: 28 (89%+)
Default

would it be all right if you can elaborate a bit as to the nature of your observation? what was the violation in this case and who might have been the guilty party?
__________________
Racing is in my blood
Tommi Makkinen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 10:22 AM   #4
Tech Regular
 
MOTHER FOCAR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 320
Talking

blah blah blah it's just like the olympics!! those girls were 10 years old...heck one even fell and still scored higher than the usa girl who didn't fall! the whole western side of the world bends the rules for themselves! why would a little toy car race be any different?
__________________
speedpassion,schumacher usa,smc,moffre racing,prs ,orc and team epic!
MOTHER FOCAR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 10:43 AM   #5
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Georgetown, Penang, Malaysia
Posts: 241
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by machead2 View Post
If your country is a major market for Tamiya, then you can bend the rules...if you are a small market....Sorry, you just have to bend over and take anything that shoved into you!!!
Errr .... when you've cooled off, can I .... like have the Tamiya part # of the tool used for the above purpose ? Is it under OP(option part) or SP(spare part) ?
If you're going to get somemore, please get me 1 too. I prefer the #84xxx 'Black Limited Edition Items' one, asian size please. Thanks bro.
tan guan hup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 04:34 PM   #6
Tech Addict
 
tomkelley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Detroit, Michigan USA
Posts: 592
Default

i heard the Tamiya rules in Japan are so strict that you must use only Tamiya screws (Tamiya USA turns a blind eye to this thank goodness). Imagine that you'd have to go through all your pit boxes to make sure you didn't have any screws that were out of line.
__________________
Detroit Radio Control Car Club
www.drccc.org
tomkelley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 07:37 PM   #7
Tech Champion
 
nexxus's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 8,097
Trader Rating: 302 (100%+)
Default

It's a toy car race, not the end of the world. Way I see it if people need to cheat to get their toy car to finish ahead of mine, let them have it. Some people only live for racing their toys.
__________________
A800 / A800X Awesomatix

Don't worry about what I'm doing.
Worry about why you're worried about what I'm doing.

"Ego is the anesthesia that deadens the pain of stupidity."

nexxus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 07:47 PM   #8
Registered User
 
UltegraSTI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,171
Trader Rating: 20 (100%+)
Default

where's that text graphic of the guy scratchin his head

R
UltegraSTI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 08:06 PM   #9
Tech Apprentice
 
bulldog2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 73
Default

Hi All,

I was one of the M Chassis racer in yesterday finals and we couldnt even make it to the top 10 and we were in the top 20 as we just could not match the speed the other competitors were doing.

We followed the rules which says no modification to motor,brush or spring to enchance the ability of motor.

no matter what you do legally speaking you cannot get any rpm's 17 k above
but during the final day of racing there was a rule put out ad hoc stating that the lighly tune motor cannot exceed 18000 rpm or not will be disqualified
Somehow after lunch we came back and the new ruling again came in as lightly tune motor cannot exceed 18500 rpm's or disqulification would imply.(rumour has it that some drivers had 18+ rpm's on thier motors)

My much more motor checker shows my rpm's at 16500 and another at 15800 so I guess Tamiya makes louzy motor's or it was just mine was inferior as lighly tune can have 18500 rpm's your guess is as good as mine...

I had very high impression on japanese srutineering and QC (thats why they have Lexus)but at the end of it it was just so so...because...commercially THE SHOW MUST GO ON!!!

HOOOORAH!!!! FOR TAC.... and the winner's for TAC ...you know what you did in the last TAC and the next coming TAC's... Dont get caught!!!
bulldog2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 08:18 PM   #10
Tech Addict
 
tomkelley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Detroit, Michigan USA
Posts: 592
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bulldog2 View Post

I had very high impression on japanese srutineering and QC (thats why they have Lexus)but at the end of it it was just so so...
Thats all in perception, but in reality, now you know!!!
__________________
Detroit Radio Control Car Club
www.drccc.org
tomkelley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 08:59 PM   #11
Tech Addict
 
Vyger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Jackson, Mississippi
Posts: 549
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

As an observer of the Tamiya America finals I saw allot of people making accusations about others cheating. It's my understanding they did everything possible to make the racing as fair and far from controversy as possible. However, the winner of the mini class did read between the line of the rules and ran an overly stuffed tired in his mini. This gave him more roll out and made his car appear faster, so he was a person others where whispering about. I'm sure Tamiya will address this in the future to again try and make the racing as fair as possible. I wasn't at your race so I can't comment on what happened to you. But the point I'm trying to make is it isn't always motor. I'm very sad to hear there was something suspect going on. It's never a good thing when accusations are being flung, true or not.

Just my 2 cents.

Congrats to the winners and good luck in Japan at the Worlds!
Vyger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 09:24 PM   #12
Tech Elite
 
Tommi Makkinen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Somewhere... still racing...
Posts: 4,698
Trader Rating: 28 (89%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vyger View Post
As an observer of the Tamiya America finals I saw allot of people making accusations about others cheating. It's my understanding they did everything possible to make the racing as fair and far from controversy as possible. However, the winner of the mini class did read between the line of the rules and ran an overly stuffed tired in his mini. This gave him more roll out and made his car appear faster, so he was a person others where whispering about. I'm sure Tamiya will address this in the future to again try and make the racing as fair as possible. I wasn't at your race so I can't comment on what happened to you. But the point I'm trying to make is it isn't always motor. I'm very sad to hear there was something suspect going on. It's never a good thing when accusations are being flung, true or not.

Just my 2 cents.

Congrats to the winners and good luck in Japan at the Worlds!

ive heard of that trick for the mini tire... that has always been a grey area for rules especially since the Tamiya America website itself. has an article showing the racer how to do it... so in essence that article itself was the catalyst...
__________________
Racing is in my blood
Tommi Makkinen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 10:25 PM   #13
Tech Master
 
old-man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,112
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default Where is justice!?!?!?

The impression that most of us had was that TAC finals is a no nonsense, by the book type of event especially in the presence of several representatives from Tamiya Corporation Japan. How wrong we are.

The recent Tamiya Asia Championship (TAC) finals is the worst race I have ever witnessed. Rules were changed, bent on the fly and over ride, largely biased. In fact the Japanese representatives from Tamiya made it too obvious.

Several areas of such nature were;

1) Pre event inspection – This inspection was optional to the racers. Inspectors were unclear of their duties to advice racers if their cars are compliant and was performed rather haphazardly. No recording of any sort was witnessed.
2) Post race inspection – Some cars passed 3 runs(heats) and 3 inspections but failed inspection on the last run. The real irony was all none of the parts was changed since the first run. Furthermore the part in question is classified as General part which means the part can be used on any type of car.
3) Hand out motors – Any modifications for both Lightly tuned and Johnson silver cans were prohibited. This included no modification whatsoever to the brushes. The inspectors found some teams to have serrated the brushes and cut comm. that got away with only warnings including the guy who won the M-chassis class!
4) RPM Limits of hand out motors – This ruling was posted only on the third day of the event after running 4 heats. The first post was 18k RPM for lightly tuned motor. After the last heat of the event, the post was changed to 18.5k RPM. Why was it changed in the first place? Dynamic rules and bias at its best!!!
5) Traction compound – Though this was controlled item, I don’t think there was enforced. Bottles of the traction compound was allocated to each country. At the end of the day, some of the bottles were still almost full but some almost empty. The best part was those countries that had almost full bottles had tons of traction. Though this is debatable but it’s again obvious.
6) Marshalling – it was announced over and over again that if one were to miss marshalling duty, he shall be penalized 1 lap of his best run. This rule was not followed and honored(following a protest) despite evidence of no-show of himself or a representative for marshalling. The protest was made with evidence of a photograph of an empty marshal post. If the lap was taken of his best run(he only ran 2 out of the 3 mains) he would not be in contention for a podium win. At the end the offender was still made the winner of the Buggy class.

What pisses me off most is the law abiding racers are the victims and the ones that were MADE winners are the racers that were caught breaking the rules.

Where is the integrity, honor and principles of Tamiya?
old-man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2008, 11:21 PM   #14
Tech Elite
 
reenmachine's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Studio City, CA
Posts: 2,539
Trader Rating: 26 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by old-man View Post
What pisses me off most is the law abiding racers are the victims and the ones that were MADE winners are the racers that were caught breaking the rules.
You think you have it bad, we've had to deal with a President for 8 years that we got that way.
__________________
Pete Waydo
2010 Big Fat Turkey Race Mini Cooper AAA Main Champion
*** currently in stasis ***
reenmachine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2008, 04:34 AM   #15
Tech Adept
 
machead2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 220
Trader Rating: 53 (100%+)
Default

Posting this on behalf of a fellow TAC participant :

"There are a few casses that had been unraveled during this year’s TAC, among which are:

1. Lightly Tuned Motor for Mini Class –

Under the ruling Strictly No such modification is allowed. Yet during 3rd round heats, they we’re people being caught with modification done to the brush’s (cutting /serration /advance) and cutting of comm. Instead of instant Disqualification, they we’re given a warning & their heat result is still taken in. Only just before the 4th round of heats that only the ruling of disqualification would be enforced.

Just before the 5th round of qualifying, a new ruling was added stating that the motor must not exceed 18,000rpm. Immediately after the first group of mini class ran, the ruling had changed from 18,000rpm to 18,500rpm.

2. Illegal usage of parts -

As a general rule it is clearly stated if the parts used is not in the allocated parts list for that particular category then it is deem illegal.

Among which is, RC Touring Car Tuned Spring-Set Short (#53333) for stock class (TT-01) which had been used since the first day but only on the 3rd round of qualifying did they disqualify these drivers without any prior warnings. A meeting with team leaders we’re called at end of the day. It was at first said to be OK to use the spring, then the decision was overturned for the fact that some of the racers (who were disqualified) had just bought the legally required springs.

3. Traction Compound/Tire Additive –

This years ruling only allows the usage of a pre-determined traction compound/tire additive (Muchmore Red).

It was noted that since the start of the Championship during the team leaders meeting the usage of other brands of traction compound/tire additive. It was then base on trust that none of the team should be using any other traction compound/tire additive except for the pre-determined traction compound/tire additive (Muchmore Red). Until the final day, we can still smell the traction compound/tire additive in the air, let alone hearing some cars tires screech during cornering, while others are drifting away.

4. Penalties –

First time in my life to see the penalty box being vacant/never been used yet they we’re many major drama’s happening around the track. Im uncertain if their was even a race referee/jury to penalize these drivers

5. Turn Marshall -

As everyone knows, it is obligitory that all racer must act as a turn marshall after their run or look for a replacement or face the penalty of taking your best run out.

In the buggy class (DB-01), after two round’s of A-main a champion had been crowned as he won both rounds. He then decided to skip the third round, as it would not effect the results. Not only did he skip the final A-main round but also his marshaling duties. Thus, with only one run, that would strip him off his victory. Firstly agreed upon on the decision, just before the prize giving ceremony the result had been overturned and re-instated the victory back to him.

In all these cases, most of them is clear cut and deserves a direct disqualification.

Extracted from the general R&R;


TAMIYA ASIA-CUP 2008 MALAYSIA
RACE REGULATIONS
General

6 Only official tire performance enhancing material is allowed. Teamleaders can purchase the material sold at the shop beside circuit.

6-1 Drivers should be noted that extra inspections of tire inner, tire performance enhancing materials, motor and other parts may be made during races.

July 16, 2008

TAMIYA ASIA-CUP 2008 MALAYSIA
CAR REGULATIONS of Mini Chassis Class

6 Two 53983 Lightly-Tuned Motor 28T will be handed out to all drivers by the race organizer. Any attempt to modify or to influence the ability of the motor is not allowed.


July. 12, 2008
"

Last edited by machead2; 09-08-2008 at 05:31 AM.
machead2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Electric Touring / On-Road RC Screaming Wind Manila Racers 32167 05-02-2017 11:20 PM
Speed Secrets (SS) RedEnzo Malaysian R/C Racers 197 09-21-2013 06:23 AM
SECRET RECIPE OF CHEATING IN RC RACING RedEnzo Electric On-Road 44 09-25-2009 06:29 AM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 06:18 PM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net