R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 08-28-2008, 09:06 AM   #1
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 5,360
Trader Rating: 38 (100%+)
Questions?? Traction alternatives to VHT or Soda/Sugar Water

Our local track faces a dilemma. Several of us would like to practice between race days in race conditions but VHT is too expensive to buy to practice with. We spray the track on race days with VHT, if we don't then the track is usually un-drivable. Its located next to a busy road so it gets a lot of dust on it. We cant use soda b/c it attracts bees when we have and the track owner is allergic. Are there cheaper alternatives to VHT that we could look at that wouldn't attract insects?

Its an asphalt parking lot track.
or8ital is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 09:10 AM   #2
Tech Addict
 
jdearhart's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Darlington, SC
Posts: 565
Trader Rating: 15 (100%+)
Default

What kind of surface is it? Concrete or asphalt?
jdearhart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 09:12 AM   #3
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 5,360
Trader Rating: 38 (100%+)
Default

asphalt parking lot track that is sealed yearly (except this year b/c we put the track up before they had a chance to seal it).
or8ital is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 09:38 AM   #4
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 183
Trader Rating: 9 (100%+)
Default

We use soda mixed with water at out track and I have never seen a bee yet that was attracted to it. The very few times I saw a bee it was by the garbage cans where people tossed there food or drinks in. I was very surprised they didn't come for the soda too. I say that you try to spray a section with soda mixed with water on a day you are not racing. Come back a hour or two later and see if any bees are around. Choose the soda with the highest sugar content for grip, generally grape or rootbeer.

Tony
under200 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 10:02 AM   #5
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 5,360
Trader Rating: 38 (100%+)
Default

We have tried it, we got bees.
or8ital is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 10:20 AM   #6
Tech Elite
 
Francis M.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Yorba Linda, CA
Posts: 4,719
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by or8ital View Post
Our local track faces a dilemma. Several of us would like to practice between race days in race conditions but VHT is too expensive to buy to practice with. We spray the track on race days with VHT, if we don't then the track is usually un-drivable. Its located next to a busy road so it gets a lot of dust on it. We cant use soda b/c it attracts bees when we have and the track owner is allergic. Are there cheaper alternatives to VHT that we could look at that wouldn't attract insects?

Its an asphalt parking lot track.

Have you tried just blowing off the track with a leaf blower for practice???
__________________
TQ-racing Yokomo BD7 Airtronics
Francis M. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 10:23 AM   #7
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 5,360
Trader Rating: 38 (100%+)
Default

I thought about that and didnt know if it would make it better or worse. Could try the leaf blower to see. Keep it on low power to keep from picking up all the stuff that gathers around the boards.
or8ital is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 10:39 AM   #8
Tech Addict
 
tomkelley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Detroit, Michigan USA
Posts: 592
Default

We've used a 8 horse blower, and sprayed water mixed with corn syrup (1 quart per 5 gallon bucket). Mix well it works decently with rubber tire on asphalt.

Molzer Mowery has a new track grip stuff. We used it with foam tires and it also worked well.

http://molzermoweryracing.com/sasrandd.htm
__________________
Detroit Radio Control Car Club
www.drccc.org
tomkelley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 11:05 AM   #9
Tech Addict
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 684
Trader Rating: 24 (96%+)
Default

I would try sugar water (corn syrup and water) vs. soda and see how that goes. Bees are attracted to sweet smells, and soda, especially grape soda puts out a sweet smell far and wide.

I know that we have bees all around our area, and when we grill out, the kids and I have soda cans. We have to watch and be sure a bee hasn't gone into the can before we pick it up and drink because they flock to the can and go right inside. My wife wont drink soda, she only drinks ice tea. Even though her ice tea has like 16lbs of sugar in it, her glass sits out in the open, and the bees dont even come near it, presumably because there is no sweet smell.

You may also try adding a bit of something bitter to the mixture, maybe something like vinegar? Or hell, You could always pay my wife to make you a huge vat of her ice tea.
__________________
AE TC5
DB12R
DB10R
Losi 8T
Kyosho RB5
http://www.kolorsbykropy.net
nemix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 11:48 AM   #10
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 5,360
Trader Rating: 38 (100%+)
Default

The MMR stuff is interesting but looks about the same cost as VHT. We pay $50 for 2.5 gal of the VHT mixture and that is $22 a gal of finished product.

I'll ask them about the sugar water. I was kind of thinking something similar to your idea. Grape soda with bee repellant mixed in.
or8ital is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 12:34 PM   #11
Tech Fanatic
 
scootr117's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: On a Stage or Stand somewhere
Posts: 939
Default

Goto JEGS in Columbus or mail order a gallon of VHT at like $35 and dilute it with washer fluid (Ethanol)$2 a gallon and just do the the sweeper and the slow sections of the infield.....Your on your own for a sprayer to ruin
Also at Fastraxx we used the cheapo grape soda everyweek and never had a bee problem BUT there is a documented shortage of bees [saw it on the news] this year......so our results aren't fully valid
__________________
Scooter EXperimental
RK Designs
CD SuperPro Motors
Mike Pulfer is my HERO....

Last edited by scootr117; 08-28-2008 at 12:38 PM. Reason: added more
scootr117 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 12:40 PM   #12
Tech Elite
 
yyhayyim's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Weston, FL
Posts: 3,424
Trader Rating: 26 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by or8ital View Post
The MMR stuff is interesting but looks about the same cost as VHT. We pay $50 for 2.5 gal of the VHT mixture and that is $22 a gal of finished product.

I'll ask them about the sugar water. I was kind of thinking something similar to your idea. Grape soda with bee repellant mixed in.
Ginger Ale will also work. Spray Ginger Ale on the track and its not as "sweet" as grape soda. BUt you should always blow the track off before spraying as well to get the best traction.
yyhayyim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 12:54 PM   #13
Tech Addict
 
MarkBrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 712
Trader Rating: 9 (100%+)
Default

Since your track stays set up from week to week you should consider using a vacuum instead of a blower. Ideally get a big one with four wheels that you push around just like one of the larger blowers, but you could test the idea with a good shop vac or two. That way you can vacuum the racing line without disturbing the crud that accumulates near the boards. If you haven't had rain since you put down VHT, a vacuuming might be all you need.

Another thing nobody has mentioned so far is that soda pop (or sugar water) does not work very well if the sun is not shining. The stuff may dry but the grip does not come up much.

At our track (Fantasy World in Tacoma, WA) we spray the soda pop using a four-wheeled tank sprayer with an electric pump and wide sprayer bar. Two passes will cover the driving lane. Once the stuff is laid down we use push brooms to get rid of puddles and work the stuff in. I've never noticed any insects being attracted to the track.
MarkBrown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2008, 02:16 PM   #14
Tech Elite
 
chicagokenji's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 4,210
Default

I've used dollar store maple syrup and it's obviously corn syrup.

Are you sure these are bees and not wasps?

I'd try the soda pop but mix in Clorox with the sugar water. Wasps and bees hate bleach. Clorox would be an inexpensive possible solution.
chicagokenji is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-29-2008, 03:19 PM   #15
Tech Fanatic
 
trailranger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Springfield, MO
Posts: 946
Default

I don't think you can beat blowing off the track and applying Grape or Strawberry Soda. $1 a bottle, and most parking lots only need about 5 bottles.

When compared to other sodas/colas grape will normally have 4g more sugars meaning more traction. So the flavor does not matter but Calories do!!

Adding bleach will keep the bugs away, but I strongly do not reccommend that. Bleach causes problems like over spray on clothes will damage.
Start with 1/2oz of PineSol or other safer agents that will keep the bugs out. If the bugs keep comming, add a little more.

My best discovery for awesome traction was mollasses. I found several jars of if for sale at $0.50 a jar and bought a few from an OverStock store. It more than surprized me for traction when combined 1/2 cup per 2L bottle of soda. Plus the darker mollasses gave the track the look of a blue-groove which help make consistant driving lines.

Even though soda is sticky it is not the critcial reason why is a great traction aid. Most of the time asphalt has tiny pits and cracks and the tire lifts dust from the pits and cracks as the car passes. The reason why soda works well is that it does a great job at absorbing the loose dust into the syrup and plugs the pits and cracks keeping the dust from being lifted up every pass. Crystal sugars can not absorb as many particles and when the water evaporates, the dust reappears. The less dust there is on the track the longer the soda application will last. So Blow off the TRACK.

Last edited by trailranger; 08-29-2008 at 06:46 PM.
trailranger is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Traction Compound Alternatives Rockin Johny Electric On-Road 23 07-22-2008 02:50 AM
Tips for preparing a track with sugar water RFrancis Electric On-Road 17 03-27-2008 12:48 PM
How much soda do you drink per day? JVT MTX3 Chat Lounge 78 06-26-2007 10:25 PM
Asphalt Traction - Sugar to Water Ratio A. Rhodes Electric On-Road 27 03-17-2007 03:43 AM
Water Sanding water based paint? Rowdy Racer Painting, Designs, Graphics and Photography 5 02-02-2004 08:07 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 09:00 PM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net