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Old 07-27-2008, 05:10 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by timmay70 View Post
This is why I stated earlier that not all things are being taken into consideration in that equation; lighter cars will solve all mankind's problems.
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Originally Posted by trailranger View Post
I think this lighter going faster has overlooked a critical function of "Race Classes" and the fact that the motors can be "downgraded" to lower power and the speed.

I am just advocating that the extra mass(weight) is making the hobby cost more. With less mass is less need for power. Power COST MONEY.
That's for sure. another benefit of lower weight is the motor and ESC runs cooler and lasts longer. and when you don't have to service the motor after every race, the cost drops.
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Old 07-27-2008, 05:34 PM   #92
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A point was brought up about how "most people here arn't members of ROAR and don't regularly attend sactioned races".

While this may be true, club racers (like me) go to clubs which use the ROAR rules, therefore the roar rules not only affect guys who attend large races, but they also affect the competetive average joe as well.
I also have a question (im not trying to be a smartass, i promise).

What are the benefits of ADDING weight to the car?

i'm not talking about beefier parts, more flexible plastics, etc, but im talking about LEAD and STEEL and various other materials that are on the car ONLY FOR THE PURPOSE OF ADDING WEIGHT.

I have no problem adding a heat sink to my motor, a fan to my esc, a more durable aluminium part when needed, etc, but i do have a problem having to add hunks of lead and steal to godforsaken areas on my chassis that do nothing but add weight.

what is the reason we do this to our cars?

we don't run 4 minute heats anymore because of more advanced technolodgy, why can't this be similar to that situation?

-Kyle
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Old 07-27-2008, 08:26 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by a_main_attendee View Post
What are the benefits of ADDING weight to the car?

i'm not talking about beefier parts, more flexible plastics, etc, but im talking about LEAD and STEEL and various other materials that are on the car ONLY FOR THE PURPOSE OF ADDING WEIGHT.

I have no problem adding a heat sink to my motor, a fan to my esc, a more durable aluminium part when needed, etc, but i do have a problem having to add hunks of lead and steal to godforsaken areas on my chassis that do nothing but add weight.

what is the reason we do this to our cars?

-Kyle
Because most TC chassis are designed to balance out left and right with NiMh batteries that are 15oz or so in weight. So even if you decide to ignore the min weight requirements, your TC will handle like crap with off balance weight from Lside to Rside unless you balance it. There is very limited space to shift electronics around to re-distribute the weight, although some are getting more creative trying get closer to balance using their electronics.
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Last edited by Verndog; 07-27-2008 at 08:40 PM.
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Old 07-28-2008, 05:29 AM   #94
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using heavyweight parts to balance a car out..

hmm...

how about steel screws on the batt side and titanium screws on the electronics side? won't add a ton of weight but it would help out with fine tuning the balance.
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Old 07-28-2008, 05:59 AM   #95
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The more pressured manufacturers are to make their cars lighter, time cost $= higher priced kits.

The more time we spend moulding things to our liking, the less chance we have of actually enjoying it. Thats why the most basic classes of racing are enjoyed.

I raced stock, 6cell indoors last year with a car that weighed over 60/70gr more than the weigh limit, if anything the extra weight helped generate grip and didnt feel any slower down the straight than the rest of the guys nearing 1500gr, with the risk of their time not being allowed when its 5gr underweight

What are you hoping to achieve by having a lighter car? Will it make the racing more enjoyable?

At least with a brushless system you can see the benefit over a brushed motor.
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Old 07-28-2008, 12:41 PM   #96
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What do you disagree with? I asked a question. Nobody answered my question. I simply asked; How many people complaining that we need to lower weight actually attend National events, and what events were they or will they be within a year from today?
Well I for one am Chairman of a Club which also has a Winter series called Rug Racers, which is now into its 3rd year, and have been very fortunate to have Muchmore Racing UK be our sponsors for this year. Where I personally won this series last year in 19t 6 cell on the very last race on the very last round, and had my WCE at 1500 + grams. With regards to your question about who does what and when, I run at club level as well as UK national level, 4th on the grid in the A at WLRC, I also run in a series called STCC (Southern Touring Car Championships) also running to limit weight of 1500 grams but now run the Orion 3800 30c Lipo so need to add (depending on wheel and tire) anywhere between 160 to 190 grams of weight, so as you can see by what ive said, that im an avid racer, and not just a loon starting a thread to piss people off, its a genuine gripe, and seems to me that many people have agreed with what ive suggested, maybe not over night, but that was never my suggestion in the first place, and this year and prob next is a massive year for RC so if we can make the sport easier for people to have fun while still having serious racing then why not just make it easier for everyone concerned, instead of being a stick in the mud and old school tie, and help the sport move on instead of holding it back.
Cheers Malc
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Old 07-28-2008, 12:45 PM   #97
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To answer your question I nave been to 2 National events Roar 2005 Carpet 2007 birds and I will be attending 2009 birds, I'm in the Navy so I attend we I can. This is my opinion but once the weight is lowered you might see a jump in attendance at a national event from all the racers run nothing but lipo, the only racers still running Nimh batteries are the Sponsored guys, my .2$
Spot on dude, spot on
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Old 07-28-2008, 02:05 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by Verndog View Post
Because most TC chassis are designed to balance out left and right with NiMh batteries that are 15oz or so in weight. So even if you decide to ignore the min weight requirements, your TC will handle like crap with off balance weight from Lside to Rside unless you balance it. There is very limited space to shift electronics around to re-distribute the weight, although some are getting more creative trying get closer to balance using their electronics.
While I understand what your saying about balancing the car from left to right, then Y is it that Japan run 4 cell, how do they manage to balance the car if its designed for 6 cell and their weight limit is 1350 grams or am I missing something here
Malc
btw nice lipo balance plate, but with all due respect, why should we have to go through the hassle
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Old 07-28-2008, 02:13 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by TheCoolCanFanMan View Post
Well I for one am Chairman of a Club which also has a Winter series called Rug Racers, which is now into its 3rd year, and have been very fortunate to have Muchmore Racing UK be our sponsors for this year. Where I personally won this series last year in 19t 6 cell on the very last race on the very last round, and had my WCE at 1500 + grams. With regards to your question about who does what and when, I run at club level as well as UK national level, 4th on the grid in the A at WLRC, I also run in a series called STCC (Southern Touring Car Championships) also running to limit weight of 1500 grams but now run the Orion 3800 30c Lipo so need to add (depending on wheel and tire) anywhere between 160 to 190 grams of weight, so as you can see by what ive said, that im an avid racer, and not just a loon starting a thread to piss people off, its a genuine gripe, and seems to me that many people have agreed with what ive suggested, maybe not over night, but that was never my suggestion in the first place, and this year and prob next is a massive year for RC so if we can make the sport easier for people to have fun while still having serious racing then why not just make it easier for everyone concerned, instead of being a stick in the mud and old school tie, and help the sport move on instead of holding it back.
Cheers Malc
I don't see how reducing the weight makes things easier or more fun?
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Old 07-28-2008, 02:22 PM   #100
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While I understand what your saying about balancing the car from left to right, then Y is it that Japan run 4 cell, how do they manage to balance the car if its designed for 6 cell and their weight limit is 1350 grams or am I missing something here
Malc
btw nice lipo balance plate, but with all due respect, why should we have to go through the hassle
Running 4 or 5 cells on the battery side allows more room to move around electronics. With a full sized 6 cell pack you really cannot move your electronics around. Some of the lipos are ridiculously large and offer even less room.
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Old 07-28-2008, 03:16 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by Rick Hohwart View Post
I don't see how reducing the weight makes things easier or more fun?
Hi Rick,

Just imagine you built your hi tech beatuful 1/12th car, took your time built it perfect. then you have to add a lot of weight just to meet the rules. It seems odd and no-one can tell you or me that in doing so it makes the car strong because it doesnt, is that not the point of the weight limit to stop guys making stupid light cars that will fall apart as soon as you clip them?
It works the same in reverse if you keep adding weight to a car it will likely do more damage not just to your car but the track markers the other cars and the ankles of any Marshall stupid enough to get in way.

forget NIMH v LIPO for a moment and consider why do we have a minimum weight limit. then ask yourself if it was introduced when you had no option but to run nimh or ni-cad. Then ask yourself if new guys to the hobby will see any sense at all when they buy there car to be told that they must add weight.
I think we need to make this class of racing better we must change with the times or drivers will look to classes that do not have these handicaps in place.

I think the only guys who want to keep it are the ones with limitless supplies of expensive best matched NIMHS. the average guy cannot match this. but the LIPO make it a much more level playing field as matching and specialist charging to near destruction is not nessecary to compete with those fast guys with the best latest cells.

So my message to those top ROAR guys is are you afraid of something?
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Old 07-28-2008, 03:16 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by Rick Hohwart View Post
I don't see how reducing the weight makes things easier or more fun?

Its a hassel to deal with let say your a RDX phi which is a pretty lite car to start with and its balanced now you have to rasie your weight to make it legal. Why make a lightweight car then throw a slab of weight for an outdated rule. At the end of the day RACERS just wanna have fun those same RACERS are the paying customer so you might not want to right them off
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Old 07-28-2008, 04:23 PM   #103
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Originally Posted by Rick Hohwart View Post
I don't see how reducing the weight makes things easier or more fun?
Plain and easy, less hassle with Lipo, no need to add crazy amounts of weight, therefor easier, and therefore more fun as the hassle has gone,
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Old 07-28-2008, 04:33 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by brit_bulldog View Post
Hi Rick,

Just imagine you built your hi tech beatuful 1/12th car, took your time built it perfect. then you have to add a lot of weight just to meet the rules. It seems odd and no-one can tell you or me that in doing so it makes the car strong because it doesnt, is that not the point of the weight limit to stop guys making stupid light cars that will fall apart as soon as you clip them?
It works the same in reverse if you keep adding weight to a car it will likely do more damage not just to your car but the track markers the other cars and the ankles of any Marshall stupid enough to get in way.

forget NIMH v LIPO for a moment and consider why do we have a minimum weight limit. then ask yourself if it was introduced when you had no option but to run nimh or ni-cad. Then ask yourself if new guys to the hobby will see any sense at all when they buy there car to be told that they must add weight.
I think we need to make this class of racing better we must change with the times or drivers will look to classes that do not have these handicaps in place.

I think the only guys who want to keep it are the ones with limitless supplies of expensive best matched NIMHS. the average guy cannot match this. but the LIPO make it a much more level playing field as matching and specialist charging to near destruction is not nessecary to compete with those fast guys with the best latest cells.

So my message to those top ROAR guys is are you afraid of something?
Couldn't of writen that as a script, even if I wanted to, well said Bulldog, who ever you are . To make a point about full sponsored guys, they have NIMHS given to them, and charge them at crazy amps to get the punch from them, then at the end of a national say, they then bin them, you can't do this with Lipo YET and thats why its a level playing field with Lipo's
Malc
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Old 07-28-2008, 04:56 PM   #105
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