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Old 07-29-2009, 01:07 AM   #991
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anyones want to buy 235mm Extension Kit for the Genx10.
$25 shipped. thanks

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Old 07-30-2009, 02:51 PM   #992
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Has anyone seen this kit, looks like a cross between pan/touring wondering if the low profile will allow for some high downforce bodies?

http://tigermothracing.com/products_10.html
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Old 07-30-2009, 03:21 PM   #993
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Quote:
Originally Posted by espresso1967 View Post
Has anyone seen this kit, looks like a cross between pan/touring wondering if the low profile will allow for some high downforce bodies?

http://tigermothracing.com/products_10.html

Its all touring car in my mind. It has some very interesting features to the car (carbon, foam sandwich foam), but the suspension design has a high unsprung weight mass. Interesting to see how one of this would perform.


But lets get back to pancars...

My 10.5 GenX (235 trim), was the fastest car at the IROCC Speedweekend! Faster then even the 1/10 nitro cars. I will admit though that it was being driven by a more experienced driver, as i couldnt make the race myself.


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Old 07-30-2009, 08:00 PM   #994
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ok i disagree with 98.99% with your oval knowledge...

again when you put a lap on petey or ulbrik on any track i'll listen to your theories...

what you are doing would be like saying well at my local track on saturday night i found that jimmy johnson is doing it all wrong ..just because the other 42 drivers do it that way doesn't me a thing....

i have been oval racing since 1986 i'm not the fastest or the slowest..i do know bannanas from oranges...you have bannanas
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Old 07-30-2009, 09:20 PM   #995
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There we go. Another non specific useless post. When I start one of these threads, I am not declaring that I am the expert on the subject. It is merely a place where people can contribute knowlege about the subject. Many do. So far your contribution is zip, nil, zero. This includes your posts on threads I participated in Hobby talk. That is unless you count insults. Here you shine. Go somwhere else. I am sorry I asked for help over on your empire. Your screen name is insulting. Take it with you.
It is really not that hard to drive a pan car around in a circle. Oval suits it very well. You can tune out all of its ill traits. That does not mean a better solid axle oval car does not exist.
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Old 07-31-2009, 10:08 AM   #996
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Quote:
Originally Posted by espresso1967 View Post
Has anyone seen this kit, looks like a cross between pan/touring wondering if the low profile will allow for some high downforce bodies?

http://tigermothracing.com/products_10.html
It looks interesting, but is not a pan car: Pan cars have "live" rear axle with the motor and axle on a pod so all unsprung. This is a defining characteristic. This one is a single chassis with the motor connected to front and rear diffs by two belts (one being really long. )

the shock system is interesting - I do think it's over-complicated though. I see these bellcrank systems and wonder why they don't just add a lever to the pivot and compress the shocks directly instead of transferring the force from the pivot to the bellcrank and then to the shock. . . seems heavy and bulky.

It DOES look cool though! I wonder how it works.
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Old 07-31-2009, 10:15 AM   #997
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MOTHER FOCAR View Post
ok i disagree with 98.99% with your oval knowledge...

again when you put a lap on petey or ulbrik on any track i'll listen to your theories...

what you are doing would be like saying well at my local track on saturday night i found that jimmy johnson is doing it all wrong ..just because the other 42 drivers do it that way doesn't me a thing....

i have been oval racing since 1986 i'm not the fastest or the slowest..i do know bannanas from oranges...you have bannanas
Actually, you have the situations reversed. You are saying that THIS is the way that it's done because that's the way it's always been done and the way everyone else is doing it.

If you'll look at what we're talking about, here, it's about breaking that mold, which has been stagnant for years. You're still running king-pin front suspension (inverted strut) which is not old, it's ancient. All you're doing is making it as efficient as it can be - polishing, boring, reaming, cleaning. . . What we're talking about here is redesigning it into something better - independent dampened suspension is superior to an inverted strut design (or Indycar would be running them. . .)

Oval pan cars are still running a pivoting solid-link (via T-Bar or pivot-ball) rear pod, again which is ancient. John has figured out how to make a modified 4-link (a 3 link. . .) not only work but work FAR better.

It's all about mechanical grip - which you aren't even considering. You just want to take what you have now and live with it - which is fine.

But stop trolling those who want to make it better. Stop trolling those who are creating a better pan car.

Cheerios.
M
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Old 07-31-2009, 12:19 PM   #998
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Now, if only we could convince a manufacturer to release a better pan car, my jealously of these custom-made rides could be satiated.

BTW, how do you guys figure it is fair to call John's new car a 3 link?
http://www.rctech.net/forum/6085963-post957.html
I count 4 links. Why not just call it a 4 link car?
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Old 08-02-2009, 09:26 PM   #999
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Speaking of the 3-link. It is probably better to call it a 3- trailing link with Panhard bar solid axle rear end. It seems that the hot rod press in the states refers to it as just a 3 link and the more common dragster setup a four link. Both require an additional member to control sideways movement that could be called a link (Panhard bar) or it could be something more complex like a Watts link (really two links and a centered bellcrank)

Next Generation Pro 10 (Wide Pan)
The above link in Adamges post goes to a few shots of what I have been calling the next generation pan car. The goal here was to get equivalent performance to my more custom wide pan, but to use bolt together factory parts. The testing lately has been to see If I have the same performance. One difference is the horizontal links are mounted farther forward on the leading edge of the pod. This lets the car use the standard lower pod plate. A second difference is the shocks lower mounts are a bit farther forward as well. The have moved away from the axle a little (not so good) but they have also move outward which is beneficial. I am satified that I cannot tell the difference in peformance. The difference between a 3-link, however, and a standard pan rear end with this same motor is dramatic. There is a lot more mechanical traction with the three link. When the car accelerates the antisquat comes up hard against the mass of the car which it is trying to lift. There is no center shock damping this important reaction out.
The front end is working as good as any I have made. Better than the sliding kinkpin strut suspension. It is in a very reproducible state now. Maybe a kit. Same for the rear. I'll see.

Gear Stripping
I and at least one other guy who reported the problem to me are stripping the spur gear out using this pod and powerful motors. I have made some progress now that may eliminate the problem. First get the thick upper pod plate. Use Steel screws, steel washers and loctite on this top plate and the rear X brace. Use steel screws with loctite under the head on the pod bottom plate. Use steel screws on that long standoff at the front of the pod plate. Put a steel washer on top. Now I find that with the pod stiff the motor still moves when force is put on the can to squeezed the rear of the can into the axle. The gear strips on brakes. The mounting is a bit mushy. This is caused by the new bevels the manufacturers put on the can and by the graphite top plate the motor screw needs to bear on. Use an oversize washer at top. Makes sure the motor screw is steel and long enough to completely engage the motor aluminum endbell threads. Now tighten the crap out of it. That is what really stiffens the motor mounting up.

Motor and Battery
I had two good five minute runs with no shutdowns in 98F heat. The 40 C Thunderpower 5000 mA-h battery is truly outstanding in the heat and with high drain. It only was 119 F after the run with no puffiness evident at the seam. In contrast the 6000 mA-h SMC pack was all swelled up but not that much hotter than the thunderpower. Capacities are actually only about 300 mA-h apart as the SMC is rated high and the Thunder Power low on capacity.
I used a X12 LRP with an internal fan. Motor temps were a little high at the end of the run. An extra external fan like the Integy model with heatsink will probably fix this. No desoldering!!!

Gear was 12/87. New gear is similar at 93/13 but will use the bigger pinion for better braking.

PRC shortie bumper and Nerfwings for the Gen X 10
Doug has released a price list for these two new parts. $12.95 for the shortie graphite bumper, and $19.95 for a pair of Nerf wings. The Nerf wing will fit either side of the car. Here is another pic. We have made some improvements over this model. There are now four body post holes to better adapt to different type of body posts and different shoulders on the bodies. Fit is improved at the side. First orders have been shipped.

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Click that first photo a second time to get a jumbo detailed shot. Note that little red stick on wire guide. That is a relatively new CRC product. Comes in a pack of several in two colors with some wire ties.
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CRC Battle Axe, GenXPro 10, 1/10th pan, Brushless, Lipo,4c, Road, Oval,TipsandTricks-next-generation-wide-pan.jpg   CRC Battle Axe, GenXPro 10, 1/10th pan, Brushless, Lipo,4c, Road, Oval,TipsandTricks-nerf-wing-shortie-bumper.jpg  
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Last edited by John Stranahan; 08-02-2009 at 11:41 PM. Reason: Price corrected in red
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Old 08-02-2009, 10:14 PM   #1000
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It should be noted that the nerf wing price is per pair.
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Old 08-03-2009, 10:10 AM   #1001
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamge View Post
Now, if only we could convince a manufacturer to release a better pan car, my jealously of these custom-made rides could be satiated.

BTW, how do you guys figure it is fair to call John's new car a 3 link?
http://www.rctech.net/forum/6085963-post957.html
I count 4 links. Why not just call it a 4 link car?
When people talk about the number of links, the panhard bar does not count (the lateral link) - so a hot-rod 4-link is actually 5. They only count the "suspension" links and the panhard bar is there for lateral stability.
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Old 08-03-2009, 10:31 AM   #1002
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Boomer, I see. I flat out disagree with that nomenclature, but I'm going against generations of custom here and that will never succeed. I disagree because the forth link does exactly what the others do: stiffly support a force along its length while allowing itself to rotate freely in one axis. AKA a link.
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Old 08-04-2009, 12:18 PM   #1003
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I agree with you. Was talking with a buddy about it, who knows hotrod suspension, and he kept correcting me, and we argued about it for quite some time. . .

But trying to buck convention never works. LOL
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Old 08-04-2009, 07:07 PM   #1004
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I just bought a used genx 10 . My track runs them with a 13.5 & single cell lipo . Are you guys just modding the stock lipo tray or is there a special tray for single cell lipo ?. I would also like to know what are the common spare parts i should have on hand ?.

Last edited by hippie; 08-04-2009 at 08:27 PM.
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Old 08-04-2009, 09:02 PM   #1005
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In the process of building my first pan car, a GenX10. I got the first frontend slotted capture insert in, but I can't get the second one to start threading. I put it in at an angle, feel it tighten up, but this one pops out instead of threading in. The first one tightened up and then threaded in. Taking a break to let my fingers recover. Could use some moral support ;>
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