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Old 06-16-2008, 04:07 PM   #106
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Rocksmith;

Thanks! Well spoken.

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Old 06-16-2008, 04:16 PM   #107
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dale,
what do you think will be the biggest changes on the asphalt R9-F (besides bigger wheel wells)?

-Kyle
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Old 06-16-2008, 04:33 PM   #108
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dale,
what do you think will be the biggest changes on the asphalt R9-F (besides bigger wheel wells)?

-Kyle
I would imagine one main change would be a front lip.
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Old 06-16-2008, 04:45 PM   #109
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Kyle;

KHoff7 pretty much nailed the biggest visual difference - a large splitter added to the front valance. The trunk area has subtle changes as well.

jag88:

Regarding the info you want about slatted/slotted wings - I haven't forgot about you. I just need to sit at my computer long enough to get my thoughts into words. I tend to intentionally avoid my computer when I'm trying to meet a deadline with a project. Doesn't seem to be enough hours in the day. Sorry again for my procrastinating.

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Old 06-16-2008, 04:49 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by daleepp View Post
Kyle;

KHoff7 pretty much nailed the biggest visual difference - a large splitter added to the front valance. The trunk area has subtle changes as well.

jag88:

Regarding the info you want about slatted/slotted wings - I haven't forgot about you. I just need to sit at my computer long enough to get my thoughts into words. I tend to intentionally avoid my computer when I'm trying to meet a deadline with a project. Doesn't seem to be enough hours in the day. Sorry again for my procrastinating.

Dale - Protoform

Real quick question reguarding the slats...well two really but they only require yes or no answers. First is opening the slats beneficial on a asphalt rubber car? And the other is if i open the slats on a asphalt rubber car will this provide a better effect than using the actually high downforce asphalt wing you sell?
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Old 06-16-2008, 04:57 PM   #111
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To all in this forum, I was just voicing an opinion that I and many others have regarding this class. It started out with realistic bodies and wheels and now has turned into something completely different. You guys complain about how attendance of these races has gone down the tubes, well, think about it, you have cars that don't look like anything being raced in full scale. No matter how fast or great handling they may be, they won't attract new people to the class, or generate any kind of excitement with their unreal liveries. When there were realistic bodies with real looking livery, the classes were almost always full. That's what TC used to be about, scale R/C racing, and it was successful. Now, at my local track, we don't even have a TC class anymore because no one wants to race something that can be raced at the pan car level. USVTA got me back into TC and I hope that the TC rules start reflecting the spirit of USVTA rules including aesthetics for wheels, tires, and bodies. USVTA is taking off alot better than TC is. That should tell you something.
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Old 06-16-2008, 05:05 PM   #112
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ok, its fine that you have an oppinion, but the PROTOform R9-F body thread is not the place to voice it, making your oppinion nearly irrelevent.

open a new thread or post in in the usvta thread and you'll get more positive responses.

I personally got into racing toy cars because of the speed and the badass look of low slung touring cars and blinding fast pace set by 1/12th scale pan cars.

'nuff said.

cant wait to get the R9-F asphalt.
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Old 06-16-2008, 06:57 PM   #113
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As much as I love realistic looking body racing such as F1, Mchassis, etc... must say this R9-F looks great... can't wait to buy one.
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Old 06-16-2008, 07:47 PM   #114
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We had one running in Expert class at our local Hobbytown races last Friday. The guy had an awesome paint job, and it sure stood out going around the track. This was with rubber tires on a tiny asphalt parking lot track, so I'm sure it wasn't optimum. I applaud any sleek looking new body that comes along (especially if it works)...
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Old 06-16-2008, 08:31 PM   #115
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Originally Posted by KHoff7 View Post
I would imagine one main change would be a front lip.
What does the front lip do aerodynamically? B/C they certainly seem to make the bodies a lot less durable.
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Old 06-16-2008, 08:33 PM   #116
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What does the front lip do aerodynamically? B/C they certainly seem to make the bodies a lot less durable.
Front lip: down force = traction = more steering
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Old 06-16-2008, 08:58 PM   #117
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Front lip: down force = traction = more steering
Dale, if there is a way to get that same downforce without the front lip that gets my vote .
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Old 06-17-2008, 02:13 AM   #118
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Originally Posted by tallyrc View Post
realistic bodies are cool and all, but bodies that don't work are just no fun to drive..
Just to throw my 2p in here... isn't that was suspension tuning is for? To adjust the car for traction, aero, etc.? I know being on track is the fun part of racing, but there must be some tuning geeks who like to adjust one chassis/body combo for different conditions, instead of slapping a whole new body on...but of course they're in the minority, because otherwise the rules would require a more realistic body.

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i think there is room in the hobby for both...
True, I just wish there were more room for a realistic-looking touring car class. I think the BRCA is possibly the closest the TC racing community has, because there are no 'slammed' bodyshells anywhere to be seen (but a spec motor club class with realistic bodies would be even cooler IMO - maybe that's the next thing after vintage racing).
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Old 06-17-2008, 07:49 AM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocksmith View Post
I am new to this forum but not new to the RC hobby/sport, whatever you want to call it. But it does amaze me that a thread where someone releases a new product turns into a pissin match about whether this is a hobby or a sport, who cares. It amuses me and I meet some nice people at the meets.
The point is someone has released a new product. Period!
It looks like a great body.
The questions we should be asking is, how does it perform?
Is there any documentable info as to its performance?
Does it compare to body "X" or "Y"?
How much is it?
And when can we see it on the store shelves?

This guy has spent hours on the design and production of this product and he deserves a lil respect. He is trying to further the rc industry and promote new people to get into it.
So please try to stay on topic and show some respect.

Maybe I feel this way because I myself am a manufactureer of parts for the rc industry and it is disturbing to me to have this happen to one of my threads. It makes me want to sell my machines and get out of it all together. I dont make a ton of money at it, I do it because I love the people that are affiliated with it and the time I spend outdoors enjoying life.

That being said, I like the looks of the body and will try one as soon as my DNA2 is torn up and you release the asphalt version.
Kudos bud!

So all you 10 year olds flame away.............

I was poking a little fun. It is called conversation. How many times do you wanna read "Great Body", "Looks Good", "Cant wait to get it"? After 3 posts no one stops in to read them anymore.

None of the questions you raise above are going to be answered for awhile because no one has had time to find out. So we can all be bored or we, with like interests, can have a little fun conversation while debating our differing opinions.

But then again what do you expect from a group of 10 year old pyromaniacs.

Thats a joke.
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Old 06-17-2008, 12:37 PM   #120
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Default Slatted/Slotted Wings

jag88;
Ok. I finally took some time to answer your question. btw: slatted, slotted = same thing.

Before I get into the slotted wing thing - we need to explain a few basics.
RC CAR WING: is it really? We call them wings because it sounds right and because they kinda look like the aero devices used on real racecars, however real racecars actually do use wings with an actual "wing profile". In order to be a genuine wing it needs to have a cross section profile that differs between the top surface and the bottom wing surface. http://library.thinkquest.org/2819/g...s/bernoull.jpg
Back in the 1700's a Swiss brainiac discovered a theory that applies perfectly to the understanding of how a "real" wing works. Bernoulli's Principle formulated by Daniel Bernoulli states that as the speed of a moving fluid (liquid, air or gas) increases, the pressure within the fluid decreases. Because of these pressure changes (at speed) "lift" is created on the top side of an airplane wing - and when inverted - downforce is created by a racecar wing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1m-sbGeCORk

Unfortunately, RC car guys have never perfected a practical and effective "wing" for rc cars. The wing would need to be very light, and very durable and very simple. This has always been the problem. Years ago a few oval racers used real wings - but they almost worked too well - and killed the efficiency of the battery run-time. The other problem is that clean airflow needs to flow across the bottom side of the wing for it to create downforce. There's simply too much turbulence close to the bodies of our rc cars for this to happen - especially given the fact that the wing needs to be down close to the trunk area of the body.

So - with that established, I hope we can agree with the fact that we are really dealing with air deflectors at best - not true wings. In fact, it's my belief that if the body is mounted correctly - nice and low, with small wheel openings - that the whole body becomes a sort of ground-effects device. The rear wing/deflector is simply changing the invisible airflow profile over the whole car. It definitely adds unwanted drag - but that's a necessary evil - especially when racing on asphalt.

So - what's all this have to do with slots in the wing? Well - in theory it simply adds a small amount of efficiency to just one component in an aero package that's for the most part very inefficient. Even when running the full "kick-up" height on the back edge of the wing there's a very small surface area that recieves pressure from the air flowing over the body. Air - just like liquid doesn't want to conform to sharp changes in direction. The lower portion of the wing "bucket" simply fills up with turbulent static "boundary layer" air - forcing the "laminar flow" over the top of the wing/deflector. By cutting those slots in the right area of the lexan, the turbulent, boundary layer of air can escape, thus allowing the laminar flow air layer to come into the wing/deflector in a lower location - and actually make contact with the "kick-up" portion of the wing. ( the P905B on-road body I re-released today has air reliefs below the kick-up too. http://www.pro-lineracing.com/p-587-p905b.aspx Same idea)

This is a way of mimicking what's done on the most sophisticated race cars in the world. Formula 1 cars. The current F1 rules only allow a 2 element rear wing - however years ago they would run as many as 5 elements - with small slots between them. The most rearward wing elements were almost verticle - so it would be impossible to say they were functioning as a "real" wing (as per Bernoulli's Principle) but were also relying on an air-deflecting type theory. These 5 element wings would not have worked at all without the "air relief" slots - nor would the current (2008) 2 element F1 wings work as well.

*NOTE: None of this is to be considered earth-shaking information for the RC racer. It might be worth a tenth of a second here or there. I'm just a bit of a nut for wanting to take the performance of RC racebodies to the next level. With the kind of amazing motors and batteries available now - the bodies have just got to work well. I'm also probably guilty of getting a bit (anal) carried away. That's just me.

Hope that answers your questions though. Sorry to get so "wordie" - I didn't know how to explain it any other way.


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