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Old 11-13-2002, 02:17 AM
  #1516  
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reflekt,
If you raise the suspension blocks as much as Surikarn, you have to cut some material from the arms....
I have done this and have had no problems.....
If you look closely at Surikarn's 414M, he has done it to the front and rear.....
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Old 11-13-2002, 02:20 AM
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Originally posted by TRF-Powered
reflekt,

don't cut away anything on the arm. just change the spacers! since you are looking for only 1mm difference between suspension blocks, try something smaller, like 2mm to 3 mm. it is good to set the chassis low and close to the ground but not too close. the way you have your car set up, i think you will be scratching the road every time you make a turn.

just change the spacer, buy the tamiya blue spacers, they give you many assorted sizes and you can set up your car better that way.
What you are suggesting is what the 414M WCR has stock....
Also raising the blocks does nothing for ride height, it just lowers the centre of gravity and changes roll centre for the better.
I have my 414M, as world spec, with a few changes obviously to adapt to my track, and it is awesome....

And there is no change in the ground scratching department....
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Old 11-13-2002, 12:16 PM
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awesome. thanx for the help rccarracer. so what do u suggest? the higher u raise the suspension blocks, less roll center right? what mm do u raise ur blocks. do u think mine is considered a bit too high? or should i just leave it the way it is.
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Old 11-13-2002, 01:42 PM
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What surface are you running on? I drive on soda or VHT traction surfaces, we usually raise the roll center no more than 4mm.

Last time I ran - FF: 0.7mm FR: 2mm RF: 3mm RR: 2mm.
Upper links were - F:1mm R: 5mm

With the upper links setup like that, it will make the car extremely aggressive, but gives you a lot more steering. If you find it too aggressive or hard to drive, increase the front upper link spacing.

Vic - I don't think you should focus on camber so much... Just use a base camber setup and work with the other adjustments from there. We simply run -1.5deg camber all 4 corners.
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Old 11-13-2002, 06:55 PM
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Originally posted by reflekt
awesome. thanx for the help rccarracer. so what do u suggest? the higher u raise the suspension blocks, less roll center right? what mm do u raise ur blocks. do u think mine is considered a bit too high? or should i just leave it the way it is.
That is what I'm running....
I have a very similar upper like spacing to Aurra, but I raise the front another 2mm.....
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Old 11-13-2002, 07:27 PM
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Hi Guys,

I'm looking for a 414M, but I have a quick question. Do they still sell 414M's in Japan? I'm thinking of getting one, but don't know if they still sell 'em. A coworker of mine bought one about 4 months ago while in Japan. He found it at a hobby shop. I'll even consider a used one, but it seems like no one is selling theirs. Thanks.
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Old 11-13-2002, 08:11 PM
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reflekt - I notice your pivot blocks aren't completely parrallel with the chassis. Have you shaved the side of the aluminum spacers to clear the bulkhead? Yes, when raising the pivot blocks that high, you will need to shave a portion of the arm to clear it.

Go on AIM... i'l IM you.

Denso - I'm not sure where you can find a 414M currently. But Speedtechrc.com sells the 414M2 for only $265 USD!
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Old 11-13-2002, 09:44 PM
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thanx for all the help guys. i'm gonna run my car setup similar to aurra's. except, like rccarracer, mine will be a millimeter higher. by lowering it i wont have to deal with shaving the arms. hehe. btw, i run at socal raceway in calif. it's smooth asphalt. peaches.
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Old 11-14-2002, 12:34 AM
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Aurra,

Thanks for the help!
I am running on carpet these days.
Can you help me what is this, I do not understand it.
Upper links were - F:1mm R: 5mm
One more question if you do not mind--I am using +0.5 toe-out in front Should I use -0.5 toe-in tom be more stable coming out of corners with speed?

Thanx
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Old 11-14-2002, 12:49 AM
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Originally posted by rccarracer
What you are suggesting is what the 414M WCR has stock....
Also raising the blocks does nothing for ride height, it just lowers the centre of gravity and changes roll centre for the better.
I have my 414M, as world spec, with a few changes obviously to adapt to my track, and it is awesome....

And there is no change in the ground scratching department....

Lowering the chassis by adding the spacer at the suspension blocks does have a limit. And it does have something to do with the ride height. Excessive spacers under the suspension block will put the chassis lower than what the damper can compensate. what I was suggesting was to achieve the difference of 1mm with smaller spacers.
yes the spacers were stock in WCR kits. but not in all the other M2 kits. and Tamiya did release those assorted spacers for people who wanna raise the suspension block.
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Old 11-14-2002, 01:02 AM
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hm ...... for more stearing reduce the front upper arm spacers on bulkhead??

i am running this setup now.... need more stearing on and off power and more coner speed while turning- less scrubbing of the wheel

heres my current setup and any ideas is welcomed

Front roll centre
FF:0.7 FR 0
RF:3 RR 2

running abt neg 1.5 front camber and rear neg 1

spacer for camber link on bulkhead:
front 0mm
rear 0mm

shortest wheelbase and dual one ways
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Old 11-14-2002, 01:12 AM
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forgot to add

using blue swaybars


reflekt: i think u have more then just 1 problem on the outdrives touching the wheels ....

the spacers u used mite not be suitable for raising the A arm holders.......

try loosening ALL the bulkhead screws ONLY .. i am pretty sure ur chasis will bend very badly .... because the shims u used is too big ...

try cutting of shaving it on one side- the side which will face the bulkhead.....

and insteed of using the 3-4mm front and 4-6mm in the rear u can try 2-3mm front and 4-5mm rear ........


btw ... does anyone know how to use this formula to calculate rollcentre ???

seems to keep gettin neg values
Attached Thumbnails TRF414M, 404x, 414, 414X-bodyroll.gif  
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Old 11-14-2002, 01:39 AM
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Could you define what those Xs and Ys represent first? also the subscripts used on those variables...

Last edited by rough512; 11-14-2002 at 02:20 AM.
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Old 11-14-2002, 02:34 AM
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Originally posted by Denso
Hi Guys,

I'm looking for a 414M, but I have a quick question. Do they still sell 414M's in Japan? I'm thinking of getting one, but don't know if they still sell 'em. A coworker of mine bought one about 4 months ago while in Japan. He found it at a hobby shop. I'll even consider a used one, but it seems like no one is selling theirs. Thanks.
I have one of my spare ones for sale if you are interested....
Basically it is mint, used chassis protector on lower deck (now removed) so everything is like new....
If your interested PM, sorry don't have pics at this time, but it is in perfect condition...
Also can include brand new lowerdeck at a much lower price then new.
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Old 11-14-2002, 02:40 AM
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Originally posted by TRF-Powered
Lowering the chassis by adding the spacer at the suspension blocks does have a limit. And it does have something to do with the ride height. Excessive spacers under the suspension block will put the chassis lower than what the damper can compensate. what I was suggesting was to achieve the difference of 1mm with smaller spacers.
yes the spacers were stock in WCR kits. but not in all the other M2 kits. and Tamiya did release those assorted spacers for people who wanna raise the suspension block.
True, but you will always have more travel then the ride height anyway.
I feel raising the blocks 5-6mm in the rear and 4-5mm in the front, gives the car a better roll centre then with 2-3mm.
The 1mm difference between the front and rear block only changes Anti-dive and Anti-squat.....
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