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Old 01-05-2010, 04:32 PM   #10096
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Originally Posted by nitrobeast View Post
At my local indoor track fast lap in 17.5 is 10.7xx and 13.5 is 10.4xx. Before the new software and the same guys 17.5 was 10.8xx and 13.5 was 10.5xx. Are we really going that much faster? Or are we being fooled because of the straight away speed? This was done by two national winning drivers. I would bet that if this was on a decent sized outdoor track the gap would be larger. I for one am all for this new software but can see someone getting into the hobby having a hard time dealing with it and getting discouraged. Maybe one day the new "stock" class will be 21.5.
I'm glad someone finally said it. 21.5 should be the new Stock class.

Here at our local track we are just now starting to average around 30 1/12th 17.5 entries on race day. We have worked real hard to support new drivers and build interest in 1/12th. There was a push to have a 13.5 class but we where able to keep it 17.5 mostly due the smallish size of the track and all of the new 1/12th racers. With the introduction of V203, we where forced to make a change this past weekend.

There will now be two classes. 1/12th 17.5 Sportsman and 1/12th 17.5. If you want to run V203, Black Diamond, Mamba or the speed control/software of the week, you have to run in the 1/12th 17.5 class. All other Tekin software versions other than V203, will run in the Sportsman class. While we did not want to split up the class, this was the only fair way to do it to keep interest in the class and allow all types of hardware/software to race.
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Old 01-05-2010, 04:33 PM   #10097
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Spec classes……
It is a problem for spec classes and 17.5 has gotten way too fast. We are not sure of the answer yet, but many are talking about it. We think the answer is in the motor not the esc but we are still listening and learning. I think we all agree we need a slower stock class and there should not be more than a car length difference in power on good setups.

Banned…..
If we learned anything recently is speed trumps everything else. When things are equal then size, features, support, and price matter, and we shine in those areas. We would rather have the new software be banned than be behind.

I think Scotty made the right decision for the Novak race. 17.5 is pre-Vegas speeds which was already too fast for stock, but the field was pretty even. VTA is trying to find slower speeds and keep it fair and took a shot. In 13.5 we are going to let em roll. We are in the game in all 3 classes and cannot complain.

Setup info….
Sorry for the lack of specific information. There really is not a single answer for each setup and we are honestly learning with you. We just knew it was fast and half the fun is finding the sweet spot for your style and track. We have provided good base line setups to start from. We expect everyone to push the limits because that is what racers do.

We will be making some easy buttons with starting points for different setups. Even then you will need proper gearing to get it right which will take some track time and testing and varies with track size and car type. To me that is the difference between a toy and a hobby. It takes a little experience and time to get it right.

We are also gathering our team driver setups and they will be posted on the website. We are fortunate enough to have an incredible team of people that are very helpful. We try to have an approachable person in each major race area.

To clarify again since it gets buried quickly…

Boost and Turbo are 2 separate features. They can overlap, but are independent in how they are applied.

Boost timing is added in between the rpm engagement points you select.

Turbo is added based on time and a ramp rate. It is meant as a short term, rarely used NOS blast. It can also overlap boost and just adds to it.

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Old 01-05-2010, 04:44 PM   #10098
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crashby View Post
I'm glad someone finally said it. 21.5 should be the new Stock class.

Here at our local track we are just now starting to average around 30 1/12th 17.5 entries on race day. We have worked real hard to support new drivers and build interest in 1/12th. There was a push to have a 13.5 class but we where able to keep it 17.5 mostly due the smallish size of the track and all of the new 1/12th racers. With the introduction of V203, we where forced to make a change this past weekend.

There will now be two classes. 1/12th 17.5 Sportsman and 1/12th 17.5. If you want to run V203, Black Diamond, Mamba or the speed control/software of the week, you have to run in the 1/12th 17.5 class. All other Tekin software versions other than V203, will run in the Sportsman class. While we did not want to split up the class, this was the only fair way to do it to keep interest in the class and allow all types of hardware/software to race.
we are kinda doing the same thing. we are breaking the class based on skill set as opposed to software versions. we just don't want to have to police software. it is up to our race director to make the judgement call as to which class a racer will be in. and it give a chance for a racer to move up based on performance and a racer to move down based on skill set of other drivers.
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Old 01-05-2010, 04:56 PM   #10099
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At our track, we have a resort after each qualifier. It usually places like skilled drivers together. But, sometimes a better driver has a bad run or DNF and ends up lower in the next run (but they usually make it up). The other thing that can be a pain is that you might not have as much time between rounds depending on how you end up from the resort.
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Old 01-05-2010, 05:15 PM   #10100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lochness42 View Post
Just to correct this statement - new GM is using same case as older one. Just have separated caps. Of course it has completely new internals.

I'm really looking forward to test new software before next round of ETS. I didn't have much luck with setting up Tekin and version 200.
l hope that the new speedo wil be more reliable tkan than the old one

What was your setup with the v3 motor? I now it must be geared quit heavy. It's than a lot faster than geared light.
Boost on 10 is working good with the v200.

I'm going to race the last ETS from this series.

Jim, the first time i used the Tekin it was also a learning proces but after a wile you learn the speedo and you find faster and faster a good setup. Now it's again a learning proces but because every body from the team and also not team members are shairing there setups, i believe that many drivers will soon learn the new software.
I can say that you and your team did a gread job.
Thank's for the great service and wonderfull product's.

I start to understand the speedo now and i believe that i will soon find my setups as fast as i did before.

Smart to make 2 17,5 classes.
Maybe an idee for ad my club. The v203is way to fast for a beginner and this way other cheap speedo's can also win a race.

Sorry for my English but on my phone I don't have a program that checks my words if i wrote right.
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Old 01-05-2010, 05:19 PM   #10101
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http://www.liverc.com/view_result_fi...ns_Listing.xml

Take a look at these qualifying times from this past Sunday at Trackside after V203 was released. Over half of the 17.5 A main has a Tekin RS with V203. Then look at the 13.5 times from qualifying, I believe only 1 driver was using an RS.

Maybe the disparity has something to do with the size of the tracks being run on, maybe not. There are 4 facilities within 4 hours from me, that have straights as long as 100', I would be interested to see if they are seeing the same things we are here.
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Old 01-05-2010, 05:56 PM   #10102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ercwhtsd View Post
http://www.liverc.com/view_result_fi...ns_Listing.xml

Take a look at these qualifying times from this past Sunday at Trackside after V203 was released. Over half of the 17.5 A main has a Tekin RS with V203. Then look at the 13.5 times from qualifying, I believe only 1 driver was using an RS.

Maybe the disparity has something to do with the size of the tracks being run on, maybe not. There are 4 facilities within 4 hours from me, that have straights as long as 100', I would be interested to see if they are seeing the same things we are here.
I checked that out and wondered what was going on...

For those who don't want to click:

Race# 3 13.5 Rubber (A Main) Minute Race Round4
Qualifier Car# Driver Name Laps/Time Freq
1 1 Johnson, Brad 25/5:00.300 2.4ghz
2 2 Koch, Brian 25/5:05.906 Brown
3 3 Goop 25/5:12.288
4 4 Pepe, Ken 24/5:07.011 2.4ghz
5 5 Nelson, Mike 24/5:08.086 2.4ghz
6 6 Jodarski, Mike 23/5:03.831 2.4ghz
7 7 Schneeweis, Er 23/5:10.822 2.4ghz


Race# 5 17.5 Brushless (A Main) Minute Race Round4

Qualifier Car# Driver Name Laps/Time Freq
1 1 Stampfel, Nick 25/5:09.708 2.4ghz
2 2 Murphy, Rich 24/5:03.103 2.4ghz
3 3 Jodarski Jason 24/5:04.225 2.4ghz
4 4 Jodarski, Mike 24/5:08.262 2.4ghz
5 5 Albrecht, Jeremy 24/5:11.490 74
6 6 Spencer, Darrald 24/5:13.613 2.4ghz
7 7 Boucher, Andy 23/5:01.490 73
8 8 Hageman, Marty 23/5:12.639 RC03
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Old 01-05-2010, 05:56 PM   #10103
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who would ban this version? roar?





Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamTekin View Post
Spec classes……
It is a problem for spec classes and 17.5 has gotten way too fast. We are not sure of the answer yet, but many are talking about it. We think the answer is in the motor not the esc but we are still listening and learning. I think we all agree we need a slower stock class and there should not be more than a car length difference in power on good setups.

Banned…..
If we learned anything recently is speed trumps everything else. When things are equal then size, features, support, and price matter, and we shine in those areas. We would rather have the new software be banned than be behind.

I think Scotty made the right decision for the Novak race. 17.5 is pre-Vegas speeds which was already too fast for stock, but the field was pretty even. VTA is trying to find slower speeds and keep it fair and took a shot. In 13.5 we are going to let em roll. We are in the game in all 3 classes and cannot complain.

Setup info….
Sorry for the lack of specific information. There really is not a single answer for each setup and we are honestly learning with you. We just knew it was fast and half the fun is finding the sweet spot for your style and track. We have provided good base line setups to start from. We expect everyone to push the limits because that is what racers do.

We will be making some easy buttons with starting points for different setups. Even then you will need proper gearing to get it right which will take some track time and testing and varies with track size and car type. To me that is the difference between a toy and a hobby. It takes a little experience and time to get it right.

We are also gathering our team driver setups and they will be posted on the website. We are fortunate enough to have an incredible team of people that are very helpful. We try to have an approachable person in each major race area.

To clarify again since it gets buried quickly…

Boost and Turbo are 2 separate features. They can overlap, but are independent in how they are applied.

Boost timing is added in between the rpm engagement points you select.

Turbo is added based on time and a ramp rate. It is meant as a short term, rarely used NOS blast. It can also overlap boost and just adds to it.

Tekin Prez
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Old 01-05-2010, 06:10 PM   #10104
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5 5 Albrecht, Jeremy 24/5:11.490 74

Wasn't he the past mechanic for James Stewart?
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Old 01-05-2010, 06:55 PM   #10105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBORAT View Post
hey mark, this document you wrote was awesome. this helped me a lot when i started out with my rs pro when i got it about a month and a half ago. do you plan to update it once you get hold of the v203?
Thanks! I just posted an update of the doc to

http://rcfaq.weebly.com/tekin-rs--hotwire.html

It explains the new download process, documents the three new settings (both how they are exposed through HotWire and what they do), gives new setup guidance, and provides four new sample setups (two TC, two 1/12th.)

In the interest of keeping the sample setups reasonably compact, I've laid them out like this (using Randy's 13.5 TC setup as the example):

motor timing = 0
boost = 45, boost ramp = 3500 – 12,500 RPM
turbo = 10, turbo ramp = 1, turbo delay = 0.5
FDR = 7.04

I hope this format makes sense to everybody.

--mark
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:04 PM   #10106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat McCracken View Post
what if you have the novak ballistic 17.5 it come with 30 deg of timing in it
so u can't set the endbell at 0. can you still set the boost at 50 or 55
What everybody but Novak calls zero isn't Novak's zero, so you can set your Novak to what everybody else calls zero and then safely run 55 boost if you want. A Ballistic "-3" is about what everybody else calls zero. See section 8.1 of the document at

http://rcfaq.weebly.com/tekin-rs--hotwire.html

for details.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:40 PM   #10107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkBrown View Post
Thanks! I just posted an update of the doc to http://rcfaq.weebly.com/tekin-rs--hotwire.html
Thanks for the superb doc. It answers all of my questions including the question I had about the Ballistic motor timing. Huge wealth of info here.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:57 PM   #10108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkBrown View Post
What everybody but Novak calls zero isn't Novak's zero, so you can set your Novak to what everybody else calls zero and then safely run 55 boost if you want. A Ballistic "-3" is about what everybody else calls zero. See section 8.1 of the document at

http://rcfaq.weebly.com/tekin-rs--hotwire.html

for details.
Here's the link to the document that explains orange's timing, although it seems like they are just calibrating each sensor electrically, not using some proprietary measurement.

http://www.teamnovak.com/tech_info/i...tes/index.html
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Old 01-05-2010, 08:23 PM   #10109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smoke81 View Post
Well it appears for 17.5 v203 won't be allowed at the novak race.. Does anyone have a good place to start for 17.5 duo on v200 on what I would assume is close to a 100ft straightaway.
look at what we did in Vegas. the duo will require a higher fdr (smaller pinion) than the speed passion v3 17.5. I'd start with a 5.2 fdr to be safe. don't forget to run a fan too. the older software is fast but I'd HIGHLY recommend a 25x25x15mm high cfm fan.

http://www.teamtekin.com/team/images...ndoutsetup.pdf

edit - in 17.5 I always run a duo v1 w/o motor timing.... but I really like middle hole timing for 13.5t
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Old 01-05-2010, 08:53 PM   #10110
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Mark- Great document!!!!
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