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Old 11-30-2009, 03:17 PM   #8356
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What I don't understand is why everyone is moaning about it. Sort it out with track design. Tighten up your infield, and put a chicane in the straight - that'll allow the best drivers to win, not the speedo.
This would make the difference even bigger!
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Old 11-30-2009, 04:26 PM   #8357
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Whilst I take the point about driving style, the performance of the AE BD is not something explained by timing and rpm optimisation. At the IIC, the CRC guys were clearly faster on the straights by enough margin to make the others (including Hupo Honigl - no mean driver!) look slow on the straight, no matter what Tekin threw at their speedos.

If this were a timing issue, then the Tekin guys would have equalled the AE BD during the week. Since they couldn't, it seems to me that AE have come up with something else. I hope Tekin will close the gap, but I think eventually it will prove to be new hardware.

What I don't understand is why everyone is moaning about it. Sort it out with track design. Tighten up your infield, and put a chicane in the straight - that'll allow the best drivers to win, not the speedo.
Yes, the performance is perfectly explained by optimized timing. Here's a good comparison:
The RS with v200 is like a 3 speed transmission. You have 3 timing sets that are each optimal at a given rpm (not including the ramp up time for turbo).
The AE BD could be considered a CVT (without the friction losses usually associated with an actual cvt). Proper programing will produce the maximum amount of torque at any rpm.
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Old 11-30-2009, 04:37 PM   #8358
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Originally Posted by MikeXray View Post
You tell that to previous IIC, Birds, Reedy champs, that they are .5 off pace because of thier car setup, or line, it's NOT the case this time, it's like having a 13.5 motor in a 17.5 class.
Ran this weekend 1/12th 1s and a 13.5 with a 2007 LRP was the exact speed as a 17.5 with a Tekin esc. Not cool at all.

They should run in the same class so all the driving skills mentioned above come back into play. Same speed=same class.
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Old 11-30-2009, 05:14 PM   #8359
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Ran this weekend 1/12th 1s and a 13.5 with a 2007 LRP was the exact speed as a 17.5 with a Tekin esc. Not cool at all.

They should run in the same class so all the driving skills mentioned above come back into play. Same speed=same class.
Then hope you don't go up against a 17.5 car with an AE speedo, u'll think he has a 10.5. lol.
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Old 11-30-2009, 05:17 PM   #8360
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Then hope you don't go up against a 17.5 car with an AE speedo, u'll think he has a 10.5. lol.
not true,i ran against one last week and we where going back and forth for the tq spot, it came down to driver error for tq
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Old 11-30-2009, 05:48 PM   #8361
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not true,i ran against one last week and we where going back and forth for the tq spot, it came down to driver error for tq
Was it someone you usually run close with?
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Old 11-30-2009, 06:59 PM   #8362
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i just got back in to onroad and he is one of the fast guys,we were running times that were the same as 13.5's
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:08 AM   #8363
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Originally Posted by mikky32 View Post
The brake problem is a motor problem. I have the speedpassion the LRP X11 and the Tekin.
I have the same problem with the Speedpassion. The Tekin is by far the fastest motor that I have.
It has no braking problems.

One advice. set your Turbo delay higher. Set it around 0,8 to 0,9sec.
The 0,2 to 0,5 is much to low.
You will notes more infield power when you higher the Turbo delay.

Try to gear heavier and set your Boost on 12.
Turbo on max
Turbo delay 0,8sec
Brake with a lower Boost on the speedpassion is better.
Just try it.
Motor temp of the speedpassion of 70 a 75C is better. It has more power in the infield than.

My best lap times came with a lower Boost and a heavier gearing.
The brakes were also better with this setup.

As you get the Tekin motor, gear it light. Not light light but very light.
I had it geared 6,3FDR wile the LRP drivers were geared 5,2 to 5,7 with a SPX and 4,7 with a LRP TC.
Boost 15
Motor timing 8 to 10
Turbo max
Turbo delay 0,7sec
6.3FDR


i've tried this setup and the improvement was significant. i went from 20 to 10 boost... and geared up two teeth on the pinion from 27 to 29 (30 does not fit).. Temperature was still around 60C.... so I could push it harder... the turbo entering was noticeable.. so i guess i could make it a bit earlier... from 0.7 put it back to 0.5... i'd still like more breaks if possible

that's until the new tekin pod arrives

thanks for your tips mikky.

g
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:25 AM   #8364
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i've tried this setup and the improvement was significant. i went from 20 to 10 boost... and geared up two teeth on the pinion from 27 to 29 (30 does not fit).. Temperature was still around 60C.... so I could push it harder... the turbo entering was noticeable.. so i guess i could make it a bit earlier... from 0.7 put it back to 0.5... i'd still like more breaks if possible

that's until the new tekin pod arrives

thanks for your tips mikky.

g
The Speedpassion motor has weak brakes. With an other motor this will improve.
I found that with a lower Boost, the motor has a bit more braking power.

Can you change your spur gear?
Use a smaller one, than you can gear heavier.
With a motor temp of 70C to 75C you will see that the motor will go even better.
Don't let the motor get to hot. It can not handle that.
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Old 12-01-2009, 01:31 PM   #8365
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Yes, the performance is perfectly explained by optimized timing. Here's a good comparison:
The RS with v200 is like a 3 speed transmission. You have 3 timing sets that are each optimal at a given rpm (not including the ramp up time for turbo).
The AE BD could be considered a CVT (without the friction losses usually associated with an actual cvt). Proper programing will produce the maximum amount of torque at any rpm.
Not sure I understand your explanation. When I observed the AE BD speedo in the CRC cars in LV, the advantage was clearly down the straight. On the infield there was much less difference.

I understand that if the timing is applied all the way through the rev range, it would be like a CVT, and that would help in the infield. But, if the Tekin is applying (say) 45 deg timing at full speed, and the AE BD is doing the same, then why is the AE BD powered car faster in a straight line? Are you saying the AE BD applies more timing? If so, how do they overcome the heat issues with so much more timing? I don't think this is a timing issue alone.

Tekin say they will release new software that closes some of the gap. I think the reason they cannot close all of the gap is that the AE BD is doing something else, and that something else is related to the hardware. Can you explain your theory more, please?
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Old 12-01-2009, 01:39 PM   #8366
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hey guys,i've been through the last 80 to 100 pages looking at info, i would really like some help on gearing my tc5 ..... i'm running a losi 17.5 b/l with a rs esc. the losi motor will not allow timing changes on the can so all my setting are in the esc i have 25 on boost and 20 on turbo . my track has a 120ft straight and is semi techinal infield. i need gearing recommendation
i run rubber tires in tc class indoor asphalt. thks 4 your support!
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Old 12-01-2009, 01:43 PM   #8367
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hey guys,i've been through the last 80 to 100 pages looking at info, i would really like some help on gearing my tc5 ..... i'm running a losi 17.5 b/l with a rs esc. the losi motor will not allow timing changes on the can so all my setting are in the esc i have 25 on boost and 20 on turbo . my track has a 120ft straight and is semi techinal infield. i need gearing recommendation
i run rubber tires in tc class indoor asphalt. thks 4 your support!
I ran around 5.2 fdr with that motor on about same size outdoor track
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Old 12-01-2009, 02:23 PM   #8368
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Originally Posted by SlowerOne View Post
Not sure I understand your explanation. When I observed the AE BD speedo in the CRC cars in LV, the advantage was clearly down the straight. On the infield there was much less difference.

I understand that if the timing is applied all the way through the rev range, it would be like a CVT, and that would help in the infield. But, if the Tekin is applying (say) 45 deg timing at full speed, and the AE BD is doing the same, then why is the AE BD powered car faster in a straight line? Are you saying the AE BD applies more timing? If so, how do they overcome the heat issues with so much more timing? I don't think this is a timing issue alone.

Tekin say they will release new software that closes some of the gap. I think the reason they cannot close all of the gap is that the AE BD is doing something else, and that something else is related to the hardware. Can you explain your theory more, please?
As far as I know, the AE BD has only been comparatively observed in a closed course scenario. Because you are on a track with limited time to accelerate, the esc that more accurately applies the "correct" timing while under acceleration will accelerate harder and thus be faster on the straight. On the infield you are usually limited by your left/right traction as to how fast you can go and that comes down to car setup. Also, your speed is fairly constant and setting the correct boost timing in the tekin will provide a very close approximation to the optimum timing for most of the infield. $1000 says (not making any official bets ) that if you take a tekin and BD to a drag strip and set the tekin timing to the same timing the BD applies when at top speed you will have two cars hitting the same top speed. However, the BD will reach this top speed sooner than the tekin with the current v200 software.
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Old 12-01-2009, 02:24 PM   #8369
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I would like to personally thank Team Tekin driver Ken Miller. He really put a lot of time into trying to get my Tekin set-up to work for me. He also had a good showing qualifying 11th. I am sure he would have made the show with the BD, but he chose to put all his eggs in the Tekin basket and ride it out. That is hard core loyalty...
Again Ken, Thanks for your help,
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Old 12-01-2009, 02:31 PM   #8370
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Originally Posted by Krio View Post
As far as I know, the AE BD has only been comparatively observed in a closed course scenario. Because you are on a track with limited time to accelerate, the esc that more accurately applies the "correct" timing while under acceleration will accelerate harder and thus be faster on the straight. On the infield you are usually limited by your left/right traction as to how fast you can go and that comes down to car setup. Also, your speed is fairly constant and setting the correct boost timing in the tekin will provide a very close approximation to the optimum timing for most of the infield. $1000 says (not making any official bets ) that if you take a tekin and BD to a drag strip and set the tekin timing to the same timing the BD applies when at top speed you will have two cars hitting the same top speed. However, the BD will reach this top speed sooner than the tekin with the current v200 software.

Variable timing by monitoring amps draw can make the turbo function more effective and that's what might AE have.
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