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Old 11-29-2011, 03:09 PM   #21361
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Originally Posted by slsspark View Post
I am looking for a starting point for rollout for 13.5 blinky and timing WGT 36'x70' tight-technical track. I am using a revtech 13.5 I would guess blinky timing @ full+ and for boosted 1-2 notches over the 0 mark would you use 6-8k and the lowest or next to lowest rpm in the esc? Any other recommendations would be appreciated.
If you are running "Blinky mode", there is no ramping RPM value to set. You can only adjust the motor timing on the can. Take a look at either the RC10r thread or the CRC WGT thread for rollout suggestions as I recall it discussed frequently.
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Old 11-29-2011, 03:26 PM   #21362
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no one but teamdrivers?

Funny - Randy posted almost at the exact same time haha. You know, it almost makes sense to have a "beta" section @ teamtekin.com's download page to eliminate any possible question. We see this all the time in the software world. If your daring enough to run the latest (bleeding edge) release, then you take the risks on. But at least no one will cry foul when there is a question of a limited "test" release in the wild during big races. Pretty simple really!
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Old 11-29-2011, 03:32 PM   #21363
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It's not simple though. Apple was sued and lost when people wanted their jail broken phones warranted. Apple said no, supreme court said yes.

We have a racing team that tests the latest and greatest software and hardware, under contract with confidentiality agreements intact. We do not use our customers for any testing, even if they wanted to and volunteered.
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Old 11-29-2011, 03:42 PM   #21364
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It's not simple though. Apple was sued and lost when people wanted their jail broken phones warranted. Apple said no, supreme court said yes.

We have a racing team that tests the latest and greatest software and hardware, under contract with confidentiality agreements intact. We do not use our customers for any testing, even if they wanted to and volunteered.
understood, unfortunately with this model your customers will always question what advantage your "team drivers" have over them during big races. Also the reason most software companies use beta programs is to thoroughly test their products before hitting the shelves. I have no clue how many team drivers tekin has, but lets say its 100. Can 100 users thoroughly test and report bugs and glitches better than say 5000? This model has been proven time and time again.

I do understand the warranty factor, but can loading a different firmware release fry your esc? If so, maybe that's another issue.
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Old 11-29-2011, 03:47 PM   #21365
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Originally Posted by I.T.Guy View Post
understood, unfortunately with this model your customers will always question what advantage your "team drivers" have over them during big races. Also the reason most software companies use beta programs is to thoroughly test their products before hitting the shelves. I have no clue how many team drivers tekin has, but lets say its 100. Can 100 users thoroughly test and report bugs and glitches better than say 5000? This model has been proven time and time again.

I do understand the warranty factor, but can loading a different firmware release fry your esc? If so, maybe that's another issue.
Yes, certain releases of software can fry things in certain combinations, especially if things like drive frequencies, boost ramps, current limits, and other things are pushed near or beyond the envelope. Often parts of things like this are left with higher than max normal adjustments in teh Beta release to testers to help figure out where the mean failure is for a particular setting (or if a particular line of programming or feature even has merit or value to the end user), so that a safety margin can be spec'd for the general public release.

History has shown that the grossly untrained will invariably break the weakest link, and then invariably blame the software guy for their own lack of understanding (you're the IT Guy, how many trouble calls do you field that are user error? ). I'm with Tekin on this one, limit your liability by testing as close to in-house as possible. THAT model has brought us stable updates that are easy to understand and that the common fool has to work hard enough to destroy things with that it's obviously his own fault.

Nightmare scenario: Joe Cool gets his foot in the door Beta testing ESC software, and it slips from his hands (accidently or intentionally, doesn't matter). Now it's 'general release' before being finished, and it has a flaw or performance envelope test that causes motors to burn up in certain combinations, thus exposing Tekin to liability to persons (and here's the key part) WITHOUT their consent and understanding in writing. Following that damage to the brand name is someone willing to file a class action suit whereby Tekin has to replace/refurbish the ESC and all motors allegedly burned up by the software. That's the 'writing on the wall' if you will about the Supreme Court decision about the Iphones.

With a limited test team, they can also easily tag software releasese, if necessary, to certain users or types of racers so that if anything does make it out, they know 100% who did it!

You and I, Joe Consumer, then has to pay by way of increased prices to pay the settlement for Joe Cool's mistake. No thanks.

In light of the major manufacturers not having had any real trouble with things melting down (or other problems), I'd say that they've got a pretty robust process in place for testing.
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Old 11-29-2011, 06:50 PM   #21366
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If you are running "Blinky mode", there is no ramping RPM value to set. You can only adjust the motor timing on the can. Take a look at either the RC10r thread or the CRC WGT thread for rollout suggestions as I recall it discussed frequently.
I am looking for both blinky and boost. and I would think that a rollout would be fairly specific to the ESC and timing/boost combos, if it were blinky only I would think that the rollout would be kind of "generic" by motor manuf/model, not so much ESC.

Last edited by slsspark; 11-29-2011 at 07:07 PM.
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Old 11-29-2011, 07:40 PM   #21367
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Anyone have setup for reedy sonic 17.5 boosted.
I would like to know also. Specifically Hara's RS settings at the iic
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Old 11-29-2011, 08:36 PM   #21368
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Hara's 17.5 SS or Super Stock settings. He was Fdr's at 6.3
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Tekin RS ESC sensored-atsushi-hara-17.5-ss-tc-setup.png  
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Old 11-29-2011, 08:42 PM   #21369
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Originally Posted by I.T.Guy View Post
understood, unfortunately with this model your customers will always question what advantage your "team drivers" have over them during big races. Also the reason most software companies use beta programs is to thoroughly test their products before hitting the shelves. I have no clue how many team drivers tekin has, but lets say its 100. Can 100 users thoroughly test and report bugs and glitches better than say 5000? This model has been proven time and time again.

I do understand the warranty factor, but can loading a different firmware release fry your esc? If so, maybe that's another issue.
Actually those 100 (probably more like 20) drivers can more reliably test and provide feedback than 5000 random racers. Its more important to get feedback from people who can run the same laps for 6-10 mins straight and take out the driver and setup variable that many normal racers try and fix with esc settings.
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Old 11-29-2011, 11:30 PM   #21370
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Hara's 17.5 SS or Super Stock settings. He was Fdr's at 6.3
Randy with your setup sheet you posted what kind of motor temps did you see. Also I was taking a look at his TCX iic 2011 setup sheet on petitrc. If im not mistaken he was geared up at 5.69fdr 108 spur 37pinion. Also the pictures on his Sonic motor has his timing set at the last mark. lol im confused

Last edited by goots; 11-29-2011 at 11:44 PM.
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Old 11-30-2011, 01:17 AM   #21371
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Randy with your setup sheet you posted what kind of motor temps did you see. Also I was taking a look at his TCX iic 2011 setup sheet on petitrc. If im not mistaken he was geared up at 5.69fdr 108 spur 37pinion. Also the pictures on his Sonic motor has his timing set at the last mark. lol im confused
Sorry but I don't think most team drivers give their true setups. Some might but not all.
I'm guessing that's why theirs discreptencies.
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Old 11-30-2011, 01:57 AM   #21372
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Sorry but I don't think most team drivers give their true setups. Some might but not all.
I'm guessing that's why theirs discreptencies.
Thats true, but... Im still confused as what I should use as a reference for the 17.5 sonic motor. Boost, turbo, and gearing on the setup sheet sounds right. But the rpm range has me confused. Can someone school me on having such a narrow start and end rpm range for the Sonic motor and the characteristics of the Sonic motor itself.

Im currently running a d3 with a more broader RS rpm range (hara iic 2010 RS setup for starting reference)
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Old 11-30-2011, 02:22 AM   #21373
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The narrow rpm range will kick the boost in faster . I don't have any experiance with the reedy motor yet sorry.
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Old 11-30-2011, 09:12 AM   #21374
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Originally Posted by goots View Post
Randy with your setup sheet you posted what kind of motor temps did you see. Also I was taking a look at his TCX iic 2011 setup sheet on petitrc. If im not mistaken he was geared up at 5.69fdr 108 spur 37pinion. Also the pictures on his Sonic motor has his timing set at the last mark. lol im confused
Hara did try gearing as low as 5.7 at one point but after watching the car and talking to him he went with my suggestion and went back towards the 6's. I take notes when I'm at larger races and working with team drivers. I track each run and note any changes we make both to esc and the car.

This gearing may not work at your home track. IF it's not the IIC 2011 layout I'd say you'll have to find your own gearing but my suggested range is a suitable starting point. Oh yeah..you have to drive like Atsushi also
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Old 11-30-2011, 09:13 AM   #21375
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Sorry but I don't think most team drivers give their true setups. Some might but not all.
I'm guessing that's why theirs discreptencies.
This is also not true, at least with Tekin. All of our drivers know up front that they will share their setups with the public after the event is over. Part of being on our team. Believe it or not..your call.
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