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Old 04-13-2010, 04:50 AM   #1156
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Originally Posted by cannon View Post
Pablo and Dragonfart .. some of the funniest selective posting I have seen

You left a few details out. Like:

9/10 ESC in 17.5 were Tekin. And the Wave driver was using a Mamba?

Similar results in 21.5

At least 4/10 in 10.5 were running Tekin so not that slow (individual lap times shows almost the same)

And Mod? ... you forgot to mention it was slower than the 10.5 class

Troy .. hope Darren is feeling better
Ahhh... Always a pleasure to have the Fisher doing some fishing on the Team Wave thread. I'll bite.

Why are you trying to defend Tekin? We never said anything negative about your precious Tekins! Everyone know's Tekin have been the ESC to beat for some time in Spec racing. We just said that with half a day of testing we were as fast, as everyone at the event could see, and in the 10.5 we won. Yes the Team Wave driver beat the Tekins and the LRP's.

As for mod, how many Tekins were in that field?? Oh thats right none, because everyone knows that Tekins will thermal after 2mins when running mod.

As for Darren not running his Team Wave in 17.5, I can understand why as we only got the new firmware a couple of days before the event. He was very ill, as you pointed out, and just didn't have the time to test enough. The little bit of testing Troy did with a 17.5 motor did prove Team wave will be fast in 17.5 too.

One thing we can all be sure of, Max won't stop making the Team Wave the best ESC money can buy. And the best part is, you don't need too much money either. Compare the cost of a RB-S or RB50 against a RS or RSpro+hotwire+laptop....

All I can say is I still have a big smile on my face after a very successful weekend of racing. Can't wait for the next round which will be at my home track!!
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Old 04-13-2010, 04:54 AM   #1157
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Originally Posted by cannon View Post
Pablo and Dragonfart .. some of the funniest selective posting I have seen

You left a few details out. Like:

9/10 ESC in 17.5 were Tekin. And the Wave driver was using a Mamba?

Similar results in 21.5

At least 4/10 in 10.5 were running Tekin so not that slow (individual lap times shows almost the same)

And Mod? ... you forgot to mention it was slower than the 10.5 class

Troy .. hope Darren is feeling better
As I was the only one with the beta software it would have been hard for anyone else to match the tekins/lrp with their RB's. The other drivers with MMP are using them for testing so we can develop the RB software. As one had a new car to learn and the other needs help with everything still we left their MMP in. They both have already pulled them out and put in their RB-S and RB30 speedies as that is already better than what they used.

Everyone at home is sick except me (lucky me) but Darren looked better yesterday when I got home.
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Old 04-13-2010, 05:40 AM   #1158
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As for mod, how many Tekins were in that field?? Oh thats right none, because everyone knows that Tekins will thermal after 2mins when running mod.

!!
Yes true ..... it is a dead class. When 10.5 are faster why would anyone bother. And that is exactly what happened

AS for thermalling so quick ... I think you need to check with the American drivers. They know how to do Mod with a Tekin
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Old 04-13-2010, 08:46 AM   #1159
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Originally Posted by cannon View Post
Yes true ..... it is a dead class. When 10.5 are faster why would anyone bother. And that is exactly what happened

AS for thermalling so quick ... I think you need to check with the American drivers. They know how to do Mod with a Tekin
Everybody has left MOD because the cars could not handle the power and the costs are to high, whe have solved the problem, whe run stock motors that's cheaper ????
With all the thing's I see at this moment with the coocked motors and the ever incraesing speed I think that the opposite is reached to keep cost and speed low.
In a few month's you buy a ESC for 30usd and 300usd for the software.
It is not that i will complain against the stock situation because the best overal set-up will win the race as ever but dont come to me and say that mod racing is more expensive and have less wear on the car then mod racing.

Pablo, gongrats that you have this good result with the TW esc that's fore shore.
Keep smiling, I am not because I was one of the fellows who buyed a RB50 in december 2008 and it stopped working, it is repaired after that the same thing happend again, this is why i quit with TW RB50, but in the meantime things changed very rapidly, while Team Wave keeping the support high it could be a winner, in the right hands.

Ed

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Old 04-13-2010, 10:54 AM   #1160
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Hello,

I ran my RB-S at the weekend with a SP V2 10.5 motor, approximately 6 FDR. Single turbo (I think, number 1 on setting 3, it goes 1 - Single Turbo, 2 - Twin Turbo, 3 - Off, Right?) with timeshift 2.

First, the car was a rocket on the infield, felt like a mod, almost too fast. However it laboured a little down the straight.

I would like to sacrifice some infield rip for some top end but I did not want to gear up since the motor was already close to cooking, didnt have a temp gun but I could feel it was real hot.

Any ideas?

Thanks in advance

Neal
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:10 PM   #1161
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Hello,

I ran my RB-S at the weekend with a SP V2 10.5 motor, approximately 6 FDR. Single turbo (I think, number 1 on setting 3, it goes 1 - Single Turbo, 2 - Twin Turbo, 3 - Off, Right?) with timeshift 2.

First, the car was a rocket on the infield, felt like a mod, almost too fast. However it laboured a little down the straight.

I would like to sacrifice some infield rip for some top end but I did not want to gear up since the motor was already close to cooking, didnt have a temp gun but I could feel it was real hot.

Any ideas?

Thanks in advance

Neal
When it comes to top end down the straights the problem you just described is the reason why we are developing better firmware.

The SP motor is a torque type motor and therefore has lots of bottom end with limited top end. The best solution for you is to try a motor that offers you more RPM. The best choice for that right now would be the Duo 2. A Duo 1 or Novak (SS or Ballistic) will also offer more top end that your current setup. Note that you will more than likely need to reduce your gearing (higher FDR) with these motors.
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:20 PM   #1162
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When it comes to top end down the straights the problem you just described is the reason why we are developing better firmware.

The SP motor is a torque type motor and therefore has lots of bottom end with limited top end. The best solution for you is to try a motor that offers you more RPM. The best choice for that right now would be the Duo 2. A Duo 1 or Novak (SS or Ballistic) will also offer more top end that your current setup. Note that you will more than likely need to reduce your gearing (higher FDR) with these motors.
Thanks Dragonfire, I look forward to the new firmware, sounds good.

Can you confirm the order of the turbo settings on the RB-S please? I am using the RB-50 program card so the settings dont match.

Thanks

Neal
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:30 PM   #1163
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Thanks Dragonfire, I look forward to the new firmware, sounds good.

Can you confirm the order of the turbo settings on the RB-S please? I am using the RB-50 program card so the settings dont match.

Thanks

Neal
Yes no problem....

Setting 3 is turbo...

1 = Turbo 1
2 = Turbo 2 (twin turbo)
3 = off

When we used this software the turbo selection was based on how much you use full throttle (or turbo). As turbo generates lots of heat if you hold full throttle all the time like 17.5 or 21.5 then turbo 2 only works on small tight tracks where you are turning all the time. In all other situations you just use turbo 1. We have tried no turbo once and tall gearing which was great on very open track but you just lack power (well it felt bad compared to normal but still went ok) in the infield.

Just to tease you one version of software we tested had turbo up to 9! It was feed in slowly to produce speed rather than power but once it got going it was crazy powerful! Too bad it got too hot...
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Old 04-13-2010, 03:54 PM   #1164
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Yes no problem....

Setting 3 is turbo...

1 = Turbo 1
2 = Turbo 2 (twin turbo)
3 = off

When we used this software the turbo selection was based on how much you use full throttle (or turbo). As turbo generates lots of heat if you hold full throttle all the time like 17.5 or 21.5 then turbo 2 only works on small tight tracks where you are turning all the time. In all other situations you just use turbo 1. We have tried no turbo once and tall gearing which was great on very open track but you just lack power (well it felt bad compared to normal but still went ok) in the infield.

Just to tease you one version of software we tested had turbo up to 9! It was feed in slowly to produce speed rather than power but once it got going it was crazy powerful! Too bad it got too hot...
Thanks again,

maybe I can pick your brain one last time, is the timeshift function just a way to add static timing to the motor, like turning the endbell? And turbo is a kind of dynamic timing, to increase mid range torque. Meaning there is no 'second gear' like with a Tekin, or the new SP supercharger software?

If thats true then from my testing, if the new firmware has a 'second gear' then it will be crazy good.

I know I've asked these question before but I still can't get my head around exactly what the speedo is doing.

Regards

Neal
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Old 04-13-2010, 05:55 PM   #1165
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I hope the new firmware comes out very soon. I run my RB30 in the 17.5 oval class and I am getting beat by 4 or 5 laps in a 4 minute run by the Tekins and Mambas. I know its not the car b/c the track owner let me borrow his Tekin for the rest of the day this past weekend and I almost got TQ. I was thinking about jumping ship but guess I will give it a few weeks to see how the new firmware comes along.
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Old 04-13-2010, 09:48 PM   #1166
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Originally Posted by Redwood View Post
Hello,

I ran my RB-S at the weekend with a SP V2 10.5 motor, approximately 6 FDR. Single turbo (I think, number 1 on setting 3, it goes 1 - Single Turbo, 2 - Twin Turbo, 3 - Off, Right?) with timeshift 2.

First, the car was a rocket on the infield, felt like a mod, almost too fast. However it laboured a little down the straight.

I would like to sacrifice some infield rip for some top end but I did not want to gear up since the motor was already close to cooking, didnt have a temp gun but I could feel it was real hot.

Any ideas?

Thanks in advance

Neal
Hi Neal. If you increase you Timeshift to say 4 you will soften the bottom end a bit and make it a little more driveable. For more top end in 10.5, try Twin Turbo. A higher timeshift will also make the transition onto twin turbo smoother. With these settings you will have to slightly increase your FDR.
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Old 04-13-2010, 10:25 PM   #1167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cannon View Post
Pablo and Dragonfart .. some of the funniest selective posting I have seen

You left a few details out. Like:

9/10 ESC in 17.5 were Tekin. And the Wave driver was using a Mamba?

Similar results in 21.5

At least 4/10 in 10.5 were running Tekin so not that slow (individual lap times shows almost the same)

And Mod? ... you forgot to mention it was slower than the 10.5 class

Troy .. hope Darren is feeling better
To be honest greg the minute i saw it go i wanted to put it in but with work and having a new car that was all put together in a couple of afternoons, and then the software turning up just after i finished installing and balancing all the weight in the car out i just didn't have time. barely had enough time to paint bodies!! I was doing a practice run inbetween painting a coat on!! And then that night started to feel horrible needless to say the next day. As everyone would have noticed when i was sleeping imn the bushes. Tried to make the third run but apparently i didn't have enough energy to push a corally plug in properly!!
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Old 04-14-2010, 01:08 AM   #1168
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Thanks again,

maybe I can pick your brain one last time, is the timeshift function just a way to add static timing to the motor, like turning the endbell? And turbo is a kind of dynamic timing, to increase mid range torque. Meaning there is no 'second gear' like with a Tekin, or the new SP supercharger software?

If thats true then from my testing, if the new firmware has a 'second gear' then it will be crazy good.

I know I've asked these question before but I still can't get my head around exactly what the speedo is doing.

Regards

Neal
From what i have been able to work out timeshift is a dynamic funtion adding timing as the motor spools. however this setup was created a long time ago and does not have the same range as some of the current timing ESCs on the market. The turbo funtion is all about generating more power everywhere by forcing more current through the motor.

2nd gear you see on some ESCs is actually a sign of poor setup. With a brushless motor low timing produces best performance at low RPM but more timing works better up high. Setups that suddenly accelerate half way down the straight do so because the timing was feed on incorrectly. When you setup a timing advancing system correctly it smoothly and constantly accelerates the length of the straight. Anyone with 2nd gear effect is giving away power down the straight and all the fast guys I have seen do not have this. The beta software I am playing with advances timing to give you constant acceleration all the way up the straight. The new turbo setup is now designed to just add to the top end on the straights so no one ever goes past you. This is a completly different setup to the current turbo system that is on the ESCs at the moment.
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Old 04-14-2010, 07:40 AM   #1169
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Mr Dragonfly,

I very much appreciate you and the other TW guys taking the time to explain the workings of the tunable timing parameters on the RB series. Could you possibly ask TW to produce a more helpful instruction manual than they currently do as I am sure if they are changing the way the modes work with new firmware, everyone will get too confused and (probably me first!!) will cook all the electronics in the car!!

Regards

Chris
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Old 04-14-2010, 01:57 PM   #1170
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What a great and usefull thread!
Thanks to all teamwave test drivers and developers for posting informations here.

I have two RB-30 ESCs, one installed in rally car and another in touring car.

After flashing new firmware v1.3a in both ESCs I observe some strange behaviour.
When pulling throttle gently (from neutral to 5% cca), there are kicks and delays sometimes and even throttle gets disabled completly. Returning to neutral and waiting about half sec throttle gets in work again. I flashed 1.2a firmware back and everything works great, no such symptoms.

My question is... could it be caused by new firmware features for "reducing the chance of ESC failure after car crash or some abnormal scenario" or it's some kind of bug?

Thank you for answer.
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