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-   -   And then there were 4 (Roar Approved Stock Brushless) (https://www.rctech.net/forum/electric-road/213710-then-there-were-4-roar-approved-stock-brushless.html)

DustinR 03-24-2008 09:10 AM

And then there were 4 (Roar Approved Stock Brushless)
 
So now ROAR has approved 4 Stock and Super Stock Brushless Motors.

Novak
LRP
Losi
Hacker

All in both 13.5 (super stock) and 17.5 (stock).

The debate is:

Will there be one of the above approved motors that will be dominate or faster in the class. (ie. as there is several ROAR approved stock motors but everyone runs the C027)

timmay70 03-24-2008 09:20 AM

There is no debate here. There will always be a perceived 'faster' motor no matter what you do, even within the same brand. Someone will figure out how to get reliable dyno numbers from brushless motors. As with all spec classes, people will always search out the best of the best and use it. You will have sponsored stock racers using certian equipment they are sponsored with claiming that it is faster than the rest, to help promote thier sponsor. The only thing that has changed is there is one more component that racers will promote when racing.

dodgeguy 03-24-2008 09:39 AM

The motors have a conditional approval at the moment. They will not be legal after 5/31/08. Unless they pass the new inductance specs.

It will not be so much as a motor war but a software one. The new Novak software that has variable timing gives any motor an advantage. You can see it on the track and feel the difference how the cars acceleration is. Yeah you can change the timing on the Speed Passion GT. But a variable algorithm will equal better power out of the corners and more top speed.

PitNamedGordie 03-24-2008 09:42 AM


Originally Posted by DustinR (Post 4289910)
So now ROAR has approved 4 Stock and Super Stock Brushless Motors.

Novak
LRP
Losi
Hacker

All in both 13.5 (super stock) and 17.5 (stock).

The debate is:

Will there be one of the above approved motors that will be dominate or faster in the class. (ie. as there is several ROAR approved stock motors but everyone runs the C027)

What's also interesting is that the biggest brushed stock motor maker isn't on that list yet. :confused:

I'd like to see a mixture but it seems like Novak has just been ahead of the pack in brushless in general. I have to give it to them...they have their act together. There will be a good 8 companies competing for this space. I hope the motors are fairly even...that would be best for all of us.

ottoman 03-24-2008 10:08 AM


Originally Posted by PitNamedGordie (Post 4289988)
What's also interesting is that the biggest brushed stock motor maker isn't on that list yet. :confused:

I doubt anyone has sold more 13.5 and 17.5 motors than Novak... so who would be the "biggest" ?

JamesArluck 03-24-2008 10:12 AM


Originally Posted by ottoman (Post 4290050)
I doubt anyone has sold more 13.5 and 17.5 motors than Novak... so who would be the "biggest" ?

He said the biggest BRUSHED stock motor maker, meaning Trinity.

PitNamedGordie 03-24-2008 10:14 AM


Originally Posted by ottoman (Post 4290050)
I doubt anyone has sold more 13.5 and 17.5 motors than Novak... so who would be the "biggest" ?

The biggest "brushed" stock maker...Trinity. They have fallen off of the brushless stock map. Not sure if they were ever on it to be honest. Novak is by far the leader in brushless racing.

or8ital 03-24-2008 10:16 AM

I would guess Trinity is working a deal to either buy or sign exclusive distribution for some brushless company now.

syndr0me 03-24-2008 10:23 AM


Originally Posted by or8ital (Post 4290064)
I would guess Trinity is working a deal to either buy or sign exclusive distribution for some brushless company now.

I wonder where Losi's motors are sourced? Are they Feigao, or some mysterious 5th manufacturer? The new Orion's are a question mark, too.

Ferrarimk13 03-24-2008 03:14 PM

yeah, what happened with the orions?

andrewdoherty 03-24-2008 03:35 PM


Originally Posted by dodgeguy (Post 4289981)
The motors have a conditional approval at the moment. They will not be legal after 5/31/08. Unless they pass the new inductance specs.

It will not be so much as a motor war but a software one. The new Novak software that has variable timing gives any motor an advantage. You can see it on the track and feel the difference how the cars acceleration is. Yeah you can change the timing on the Speed Passion GT. But a variable algorithm will equal better power out of the corners and more top speed.

Yes you can change the static timing on the GT, but if I am not mistaken, the GT also adjusts the timing in real time as you accelerate. This is an advantage of starting off under sensored operation, and then moving to sensorless operation, (which allows for the timing adjustment) once things get going . . .

Chris08527 03-24-2008 03:56 PM

what about the the 10.5's???
are they now paperweights . . .lol

adamge 03-24-2008 04:18 PM

A sensored ESC can vary motor timing, Andrew. The only reason not to is to make the firmware design quicker and cheaper.

syndr0me 03-24-2008 05:17 PM

What's this talk of Novak developing a variable timing algorithm? It sounds kind of neat. I wonder if they'll disengage the sensors at high RPM too?

party_wagon 03-24-2008 05:35 PM

If you can tell a diference in these motors on the track then you shouldn't be running stock. Mod racers don't start off running 6turn mods, they start w/ 15 turn mods & work their way up to those wicked fast motors.

jiml 03-24-2008 06:01 PM


Originally Posted by syndr0me (Post 4291185)
What's this talk of Novak developing a variable timing algorithm? It sounds kind of neat. I wonder if they'll disengage the sensors at high RPM too?

Are we talking RC cars or starships?:eek:

dodgeguy 03-24-2008 08:49 PM


Originally Posted by syndr0me (Post 4291185)
What's this talk of Novak developing a variable timing algorithm? It sounds kind of neat. I wonder if they'll disengage the sensors at high RPM too?

I do not think disengaging the sensor as you put it would increase performance. The timing is advanced at high RPM's. So it does take a different gearing in the car. This is suppose to be a running change on the GTB.

syndr0me 03-24-2008 09:01 PM


Originally Posted by dodgeguy (Post 4292127)
I do not think disengaging the sensor as you put it would increase performance. The timing is advanced at high RPM's. So it does take a different gearing in the car. This is suppose to be a running change on the GTB.

I believe the GM ESC's will disengage the sensors at certain RPM's, since supposedly sensorless is more efficient at high RPM? That's how I understand it, anyway. If true, I could envision a scenario where the sensors are used for low RPM and startup, and then back EMF used when the motor is really spinning. It's all beyond my realm of knowledge, though. Perhaps one of Novak's keen engineers can comment further.


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