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Old 03-25-2008, 03:13 PM   #31
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On topic.. why not let 12th scale run 7.4 if a lipo can be manufactured with 4 cell dimensions? Is it the speed will be beyond controllable?
Yes, especially without the added weight of the 540 sized motor in the pod.

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It certainly would have less headaches of sometimes needing receiver packs or special electronics. The other method though, which still could benefit from the same manufacturing of a 4 cell 7.4. Parallel output. So that 3000+ would be 6000mah+ at 3.7 volts. Of course, that gets into even greater needs for low voltage electronics.
Receiver pack, as used in 1/12 for years

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Still.. I think its a possible solution that would benefit from this proposed lipo form factor without having to make the manufacturer retool another setup.
What your proposing would be a big redesign for 1/12 cars. Especially the 380 motors. Most organizations have just begun to adopt brushless and lipo, this is a lot to swallow. At a club level, why not try it if they will let you?

I think this will all shake itself out soon, especially if batteries start to fall into line with traditional rechargeable voltage per cell.
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Old 03-30-2008, 12:02 PM   #32
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Most organizations have just begun to adopt brushless and lipo, this is a lot to swallow. At a club level, why not try it if they will let you?
I do, in a smaller scale. But for you big guys, your kinda SOL since no Lipo manufacturer has taking the initiative to try/test this shorter formation in a hard pack.
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Old 03-30-2008, 06:37 PM   #33
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You know the 1/14 scale recoil looks pretty good with a 380 motor.

I know the 1:12 have a history of sub-c batteries and brushed motors. In order to step forward with a standard battry and suitable motor winding for that battery pack a drastic change is needed.

I know 380 motors have been used in 1:12 cars with limited positive results. Those cars were not designed for 380 motors so limited results should be expected.

What is unkowns is how would a pan car designed around the 380 motor and smaller mini sized batteries would perform. IMO the 18th scale Scalpel is not designed aroud the 380motor and 2/3 batteries, the car was desinged to fit the equipment. IMO the car needs to be just a tade bit bigger in all dimensions to make the most of the batteries and motor.
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Old 03-30-2008, 06:39 PM   #34
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Maybe MaxAmps could do some importing of LiPO's in a 4-cell size.

Heck I would very happy if they import LiFePO4 cells in a 4-cell size. Just a little more voltage than a 4-cell pack, but not quite the full load of a 7.4 pack.
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Old 03-30-2008, 06:47 PM   #35
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you dont have to worry about lipo weight or an unbalanced car (left to right)for a losi jrxs type r because the battery is in the center of the chassis. same with and an e4.
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Old 03-30-2008, 06:59 PM   #36
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WRONG!. How much silly weight are you guys adding to them to get the cars to balance left to right and make minimum spec? Does that make any sense?
Makes perfect sence. Most all the TC chassis, electronics, batteries, and weight standards, are designed to work with "todays" designs. All the different manufacturers would need to collectively redesign their parts to a different chassis layout. That at best will take some time. Lipo's have just begun being accepted by racers, and so we are in a transition period. Some of the things you posted likely will come, but for now...we're playing the hand that we were dealt.
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Old 03-30-2008, 09:59 PM   #37
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Just think on cars like my Xray T2's, sure I have to add weight now but later when the rules are changed, I just remove that weight.

Brushless escs will get smaller, maybe 10 ~ 15g less in a year or two less
I'll just swap out my servo for a shortie style or karbonite gears, 10 ~ 15 grams less
That micro RX will may shave another gram or two less.
Going to a Novak Light motor saves me another 17g
So i just found 50g to save on the electronics side to help with that lighter LiPO pack.

So just guessing, but dropping the Min weight by 100g in 2009 shouldn't be that extreme. If you want to make min weight and don't have the cash for uber tiny electronics, well go with a smaller LiPO pack like a 3200mah. That is the beauty of LiPO...it is scaleable!
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Old 04-02-2008, 12:45 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by trailranger View Post
Just think on cars like my Xray T2's, sure I have to add weight now but later when the rules are changed, I just remove that weight.

Brushless escs will get smaller, maybe 10 ~ 15g less in a year or two less
I'll just swap out my servo for a shortie style or karbonite gears, 10 ~ 15 grams less
That micro RX will may shave another gram or two less.
Going to a Novak Light motor saves me another 17g
So i just found 50g to save on the electronics side to help with that lighter LiPO pack.

So just guessing, but dropping the Min weight by 100g in 2009 shouldn't be that extreme. If you want to make min weight and don't have the cash for uber tiny electronics, well go with a smaller LiPO pack like a 3200mah. That is the beauty of LiPO...it is scaleable!
without changing the x2, 416, etc layout, adding a lighter or shorter can bushless motor is way to go. I found using a lighter servo do help a lot too. the goal is to move more weight toward the center point without sacrifice performance. looking forward to see some big bore can (more than 36mm diameter) motors with minor mod to the chassis.

shorter can, same weight
normal can, lighter weight
shortest can, heavy weight


Here's what I would use, but in need of a 5mm shaft pinion to make such setup works.
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXLWZ4&P=7
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Old 04-02-2008, 10:09 AM   #39
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Zen

Do you want my Trinity N-60 motor? I have a pretty much new N-60 motor for sale on Hobby talk.
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Old 04-09-2008, 11:01 AM   #40
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The next generation of sedans will look more like the HPI Pro2, Tamiya 414, Schumacher SST, Yokomo YR-4M and Xray T1. Saddle pack Lipo, motor in the middle, servo on one side speedo and rx on the other...perfect balance, no added weight, no compromises to suspension geometry or weight distribution.
I'd thinking about this long ago and today I digout my dusted T1FK04 and see if Orion3200 (137.5 x 46.7 x 20.5+2.5 mm) can fit into one side.

Result: NO FIT. The front-rear bulkhead is like 5mm too short for 137.5mm Orion3200. If we can just length the wheel base 10mm, we should able to get T1FK04 fit all ROAR-legal LiPO on oneside.

Or... we can remove the motor-front-post of T1FK04 to free some more room for LiPO, but I frankly dont know how that gonna affect the structure of chassis, so... no go for me (unless I get a spare in dirty cheap price...)
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Old 04-09-2008, 11:52 AM   #41
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The FK04 with a saddle pack is what he was speaking of. I see what you mean with the stick pack. The saddle pack layout on a FK04 would be great.
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Old 04-09-2008, 11:52 AM   #42
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I'd thinking about this long ago and today I digout my dusted T1FK04 and see if Orion3200 (137.5 x 46.7 x 20.5+2.5 mm) can fit into one side.

Result: NO FIT. The front-rear bulkhead is like 5mm too short for 137.5mm Orion3200. If we can just length the wheel base 10mm, we should able to get T1FK04 fit all ROAR-legal LiPO on oneside.

Or... we can remove the motor-front-post of T1FK04 to free some more room for LiPO, but I frankly dont know how that gonna affect the structure of chassis, so... no go for me (unless I get a spare in dirty cheap price...)
I think Adrian was talking about using Sadle pack lipos........ Imo it will be legal soon enough...
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Old 04-09-2008, 07:38 PM   #43
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Ar I must short-out on reading... DOH!

I personally dont like saddle at all as it's so hard to use (with fear of shorting the pack). But maybe hardcase Lipo saddle would be easier to use, never try yet.

However, since it's possible to have LiPo on oneside, elect/servo on the other, motor in center line, and have a right-left balance. Why using saddle instead of stick?
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Old 04-09-2008, 08:02 PM   #44
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Because the lipo packs are so light. It is much easier to balance a car using saddle packs. Symetrical cells left and right and a centered motor will make it so the rest of the electronics can be used to counterbalance eachother.
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Old 04-09-2008, 09:05 PM   #45
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Servo+rx+esc+amb is still like 50-100g lighter than LiPo, so my idea is place LiPo on right hand side, elect on left hand, and maybe shim motor outward a bit to counter the weight, IF I can find a way to fit LiPo into T1FK04...
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