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Old 07-17-2003, 03:38 AM   #61
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Default TB01 or TA04

for onroad, i would choose the TA04R. i think it has the most hopups for the money - ball diffs, aluminum threaded shocks, full ball bearings, universals, molded graphite chassis (not sure on this), graphite upper brace, aluminum motor heatsink, nice rims, belted tires & molded inserts. you dont have to add much for it to be race worthy. in our lhs, the TA04R is about twice as expensive as the TB01. but to equal the TA04R's equipment would mean buying lots of hopups - in the end, the TB01 will be more expensive than the TA04R.

however, if you will be running in dirty tracks, the TB01 has the advantage of a sealed drivetrain. In our local asphalt track (very deteriorated and unmaintained), where we run rally every week, a TA04R or any other open belt driven car will have pebbles stuck in its gears and pulleys. hope this helps
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Old 07-17-2003, 07:22 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally posted by blixelX
just wanna check out what is mod motor... coz i was thought that those motors come with the chassis is called stock motor and those selling outside with lower turns are mod motors... then read some threads that said that those 23T oso a stock motors...
Ok, quick history lesson here...

Mabuchi RS540SH kit motor is a 27turn, 0 degree timing motor.
(more +ve timing gives more power for the same motor, but sucks more current)

Any "ROAR Stock" (ROAR is an American RC racing association) motor is 27turn with 24 degree FIXED timing, with bushings. Newer motors are Rebuildable ie you can take them apart for servicing, but you cannot change parts or the timing without making it very obvious.

Then you have the Japan-stock... a pretty recent invention, they are 23turn fixed timing. However Japan does not allow rebuildable motors for racing! You can buy rebuildable 23turn stockers, but they are illegal for Japan stock racing. Japan also requires stick batteries *only*, and they must be commercially-manufactured ones, not DIY.

Anything that is outside of that... is "Modified".
Most mods will allow timing change, most run ballbearings.
All mods should allow disassembly for servicing.

Roughly speaking...

16+ turn = mild Mod
10-15 turn = pretty hot Mod
under 10 turn = super hot Mod
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Old 07-17-2003, 07:32 PM   #63
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thz WC... may try to get 23T motor, since many ppl using it and very good review on it... may get a tamiya for first try coz using tamiya chassis... haha... which 1 is good?? type R, T, S, SS??
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Old 07-17-2003, 07:54 PM   #64
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Default Re: TB01 or TA04

Quote:
Originally posted by marvi
....aluminum threaded shocks,
....full ball bearings, universals,
....molded graphite chassis (not sure on this)
04R Chassis is a tub with carbon impregnated, like Tamiya's carbon-reinforced wheels. nb there are two versions - the later one has 6 slots for the battery to sit into.

Shocks... the earlier TA04Rs had "TRF shocks" (58276 HKS TRB001 Altezza, 58282 TA04-R Chassis Kit, 58291 HKS CLK).
The latest one (58297 RaybrigNSX 2002) has the fluorine-coated ones.
Tamiya's alloy shocks are the best in the business!

04R has full ball bearings... but they're all only metal-shielded.
The TA04PRO comes with full set of Tamiya's blue-sealed ones.


Quote:
in our lhs, the TA04R is about twice as expensive as the TB01. but to equal the TA04R's equipment would mean buying lots of hopups...B]


That is always the case...

For my runner, I made the move to 04 with the PRO before the 04R came out. It has gradually collected most of the hopups to R spec. Would have saved some $$$ by just getting a 04R and putting a carbon chassis on that, but too late for that - no regrets anyway. TA04 is a great chassis design.

There is also the TA04-TRF with everything you could want...

... and very soon, there's also TRF's TA04R Tuned Chassis Kit!!



Quote:
...buying lots of hopups - in the end, the TB01 will be more expensive than the TA04R.
Unfortunately, all the hopups wil still not make a TB01 perform as well as a TA04. The TB01 is pretty heavy for a serious racecar, it is very toughly built to take hard knocks. I also find it harder to work on. TA04 has the "long arm suspension" as standard, which is very adjustable.


Enjoy the TB01 for what it is... try resist putting on too many eye-candy options on it and save the $$$ towards your next car. My TB01 (NSX2000) only has bearings on it (ok, it comes standard with the aluminium shaft & plastic gears - save 130g!!). It really does not need anything more.

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Old 07-17-2003, 09:13 PM   #65
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saw 72T and 88T spur gears that for TB01... r these really suitable for tb01?? from the manual it just show 61T, 58T, & 55T, whats the pinion size will fit the 72T and 88T spur gear??
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Old 07-17-2003, 10:06 PM   #66
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The original spur gears are 0.6 pitch, whilst the 78 and 88 tooth spur gears are 0.4 pitch. The latter are smoother running (but not suitable for rally as they can get chewed up quickly from vibrations and dirt and stones getting stuck in the spur gear). To switch from 0.6 to 0.4, you are going to need new pinion gears too which are also 0.4 (or 64 pitch).
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Old 07-17-2003, 11:40 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally posted by KiwiKid
The original spur gears are 0.6 pitch, whilst the 78 and 88 tooth spur gears are 0.4 pitch. The latter are smoother running (but not suitable for rally as they can get chewed up quickly from vibrations and dirt and stones getting stuck in the spur gear). To switch from 0.6 to 0.4, you are going to need new pinion gears too which are also 0.4 (or 64 pitch).
is the gear ratio formula for 0.4 pitch same as the 0.6 pitch??

any1 try the 0.4 pitch spur gear and pinion on a TB01 b4?? how many T pinion is suitable for a 0.4 pitch 78T spur gear??

will it (0.4 pitch) run smoother than 0.6 pitch spur gear?? when using 0.4 pitch, will it consumes more power (battery drains faster)?
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Old 07-18-2003, 12:16 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally posted by blixelX
is the gear ratio formula for 0.4 pitch same as the 0.6 pitch??
Yup.

The actual numbers might change, but we all know 10/2 = 15/3

Quote:
any1 try the 0.4 pitch spur gear and pinion on a TB01 b4??
The 0.4 gears are known as TB Evo I/II spurs.
They can be used on the TB01 only if you get the alloy motor mount.
The plastic motor mount with A/B/C/D will not support 0.4 gears.

Quote:
will it (0.4 pitch) run smoother than 0.6 pitch spur gear?? when using 0.4 pitch, will it consumes more power (battery drains faster)? [/B]
Bigger gear teeth run noisier... so the 0.4 will run more quietly than 0.6 gears.

It should use/lose LESS energy (noise = energy).
But I doubt if you will notice the difference.

However, 0.4 gears have smaller teeth (= more fragile to stones etc) and where the gears are, they will be damned difficult to get the mesh right. Smaller teeth make proper meshing even more important, and harder.

Don't forget that you have to lose the A/B/C/D system to adjust gearmesh, and it will be totally up to you. Too tight or too lose will both destroy the gears.


Personally, don't bother with 0.4 gears - larger gears work just fine for me. Even on TA04PRO/EvoIII, can convert them to larger teeth gear rather than stick with the tiny fragile 0.4 gears.
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Old 07-18-2003, 01:18 AM   #69
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thz WC... ur explaination is very clear... nice... learnt something today...

yah, i noticed that belt may use a bigger pinion and spur gear compared to shaft... am i correct??
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Old 07-18-2003, 01:54 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally posted by blixelX
yah, i noticed that belt may use a bigger pinion and spur gear compared to shaft... am i correct??
Belt cars usually have the layshaft up top so yeah, there's usually more room for a bigger spur. Whereas the TBs put their spur on the centre shaft, so you haven't got much space to play with.

(I say 'usually', have run a older Yokomo YR4M2 whose layshaft is in front of the motor...)

Unfortunately, for bigger spur, you need bigger pinions to get the same high gearing ratios...


With TA04, the only spur available in AV is the 87t... which is pretty big and no good if you want any ratio higher than ~6:1. For that you gotta use 3rd party gears, and the TA04 is good in that it can directly accept "industry standard" spurs.



Do note there are metric & imperial standards...

--- 0.4 & 0.6 "module" gears are Metric.

--- 48dp & 64dp "pitch" are Imperial.

They should not be intermixed, you'll cause meshing problems.
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Old 07-18-2003, 02:00 AM   #71
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Quote:
Originally posted by WC
Belt cars usually have the layshaft up top so yeah, there's usually more room for a bigger spur. Whereas the TBs put their spur on the centre shaft, so you haven't got much space to play with.

(I say 'usually', have run a older Yokomo YR4M2 whose layshaft is in front of the motor...)

Unfortunately, for bigger spur, you need bigger pinions to get the same high gearing ratios...


With TA04, the only spur available in AV is the 87t... which is pretty big and no good if you want any ratio higher than ~6:1. For that you gotta use 3rd party gears, and the TA04 is good in that it can directly accept "industry standard" spurs.



Do note there are metric & imperial standards...

--- 0.4 & 0.6 "module" gears are Metric.

--- 48dp & 64dp "pitch" are Imperial.

They should not be intermixed, you'll cause meshing problems.
hehe... although not that understand (need times to digest it), anyway, thz a lot....

man, get prepared, sure hav lots of question to ask u in the future... haha...lol... thz man...
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Old 07-18-2003, 08:40 PM   #72
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hey man, any reccomendation for a tamiya type R in a tb01?? whats the gear ratio should be used? any hop up should be added to make it more stable??
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Old 07-18-2003, 11:53 PM   #73
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Personally, I don't recommend using a Type R in a TB-01. Last time I tried one of these motors, it burnt out after 6 runs. If you have already bought one, I suggest keeping the ratio between 6 to 6.5. I have found the Type T to be the most durable.
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Old 07-20-2003, 06:08 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally posted by KiwiKid
Personally, I don't recommend using a Type R in a TB-01. Last time I tried one of these motors, it burnt out after 6 runs. If you have already bought one, I suggest keeping the ratio between 6 to 6.5. I have found the Type T to be the most durable.
hi... thz... anyway, i bought already, and using gear ratio 7... quite fast for me to control currently... it likes a big diff from the stock silver can motor...

yah, just knew that there r brushes in the motor, how i know when the brushes need to be replace? do i need to take it out and check monthly or weekly? can i notice without un-screw the motor?
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Old 07-20-2003, 08:36 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally posted by blixelX
how i know when the brushes need to be replace? do i need to take it out and check monthly or weekly? can i notice without un-screw the motor?
You can remove the brushes by unclipping the brush spring, then pulling the brush out by its pigtail wire. Original brushes are usually pretty hard, so they'll last you quite a while but its handy to buy a spare pair for comparisons.

Don't bother changing unless your motor performance has dropped a lot, or maybe the brush is more than 30-40% gone (ie only 60-70% remaining). If your brush turns *blue* it means it is overheated, but this shouldn't happen unless you've overgeared it badly and really cooked it.

You should check the brushes every so often, maybe every 10-20 packs? Check both brushes, not just 1. You probably have to take motor out of the car, most cars don't have enough space around motor and TB01 is one of worst for that.



Personally... don't worry too much about the brushes, they'll look after themselves.

Worry more about Lubrication.

Yeah, you need to keep those motor bushings OILed!!
Every 2-3 runs, you should oil the bushings.
Use a thin oil, like your mum's Singer sewing machine oil.
You can buy "special" bushing oil too, but who's kidding who?
(Do NOT use silicone shock oil as lubrication.)

Next time you're at Hobby Shop, ask also about "Motor Spray".
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