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Old 03-04-2008, 08:43 AM   #1
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Default Thick Vs thinner chassis?

If you have the suspension set right (example, setup stiff for foams indoors on carpet) how much of a difference will you notice in a thinner and thicker chassis?

Ok, I know that depends on your overall skill, but how much would a regular A main club racer notice?

Also, is a thinner chassis better suited to outdoor racing?

Had a look around on the forum but couldnt find anything that really helped explain it.

tia
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Old 03-04-2008, 08:55 AM   #2
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Also, is a thinner chassis better suited to outdoor racing?

tia
Not exactly, there are some Schumacher guys running thick chassis in asphalt with great results
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Old 03-04-2008, 09:07 AM   #3
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Not exactly, there are some Schumacher guys running thick chassis in asphalt with great results
and some of us are running the flexible decks on foams. i guess our car's that good. maybe, but i don't think it matters quite as much as folks think. the chassis flex just needs to be incorporated into the setup. most of these guys that go faster with stiffer decks just didn't have the setup right to begin with. granted, my experience is entirely with foam tires, but the philosophy should hold up pretty well on rubber tires. cyrul and others get it done on rubbers with stiff decks while the rest run flexible cars.

looking at the trends, stiff is for foams/carpet, and flexible is commonly used rubber/outdoors. trends are just that. it's not a make or break issue, but if you need setup help, you might want to run your car the way the faster guys at your track are running them.

as far as noticing a difference goes, you might. i haven't noticed it much on foams, but it should be a bit more exaggerated on rubber tires.

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Old 03-04-2008, 09:34 AM   #4
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thanks for the insight

Ive found myself a good rubber indoor setup on a ta05, (thick double deck 3racing graphite chassis) that should transfer over quite well outdoors too (so I have been told), but I hope to be using a car with a thinner chassis in a month or two, (kit spec 415msxx) so hence my question
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Old 03-04-2008, 10:15 AM   #5
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I have rubber tire only experience and have always run a thin 2.0mm chassis, but I recently just started running a thicker 2.5mm chassis and like it a lot. I feel that the thicker chassis made the car more consistent from run to run. I also found that the stiffer the chassis is you will feel the adjustments you make will make a bigger difference or feel.

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Old 03-04-2008, 10:33 AM   #6
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I have rubber tire only experience and have always run a thin 2.0mm chassis, but I recently just started running a thicker 2.5mm chassis and like it a lot. I feel that the thicker chassis made the car more consistent from run to run. I also found that the stiffer the chassis is you will feel the adjustments you make will make a bigger difference or feel.

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Old 03-04-2008, 10:41 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by teammidget lilB View Post
I have rubber tire only experience and have always run a thin 2.0mm chassis, but I recently just started running a thicker 2.5mm chassis and like it a lot. I feel that the thicker chassis made the car more consistent from run to run. I also found that the stiffer the chassis is you will feel the adjustments you make will make a bigger difference or feel.

Bryan aka Hollywood
Ditto....I have always been a believer of running as thick of a chassis you can get away with and let the suspension & geometry of the car DO what it's SUPPOSED to DO. We don't run on bumpy basketball courts, so I feel no need to run noodle graphite chassis.
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Old 03-04-2008, 11:25 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by tc3team View Post
thanks for the insight

Ive found myself a good rubber indoor setup on a ta05, (thick double deck 3racing graphite chassis) that should transfer over quite well outdoors too (so I have been told), but I hope to be using a car with a thinner chassis in a month or two, (kit spec 415msxx) so hence my question
Hi Chris,

To answer your question, I personally can't drive the 415 MSX (and its related cousins MRE and MSXX) on carpet with the standard chassis and top deck. The main reason is that the top deck is too short and only lets the front of the car flex, which in turn makes the car very inconsistent for me, I just can't drive them. Put a stiffer top deck and chassis and the car was awesome.

Now on tarmac I used the tamiyas as per kit, they work really really well as the lower grip doesn't make the car flex as much. Same racing conditions as you as I'm in the UK. For your MSXX outdoors I'd start with the kit setup with minor alterations: no roll bars, blue springs all round, 35W all round and 3 holes pistons, spool and locked centre pulleys. I assume you're gonna run stock or 19T still, in which case I'd go for 1.5 rear toe instead of the 3 of the kit.
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Old 03-04-2008, 05:04 PM   #9
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a thicker chassis will have less chance of pulling a screw through in a bad wreck.

I have two Xray t2's. One has a 3.0 mm chassis and the other a 2.0 mm chassis. I run the 2mm outdoors and the 3.0mm on carpet. Sometimes, I just run the 2mm chassis with a solid 3.0mm upper deck and it feels the same as the multiflex chassis locked down.

My multi-felx chassis, just sit in the box unused.

I know this is offsubject, but in oval racing the trend is to make the chassis flex with larger cutouts and laterial cuts and lengthwise cuts. I guess it helps or they wouldn't be doing it.

I personally like having a soild piece of graphite I can mount my electronics on. Just sucks that the double sided tape is exposed to picking up debris on the underside of a chassis. If a chassis needs flex, make a cut, not a cutout.
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Old 03-05-2008, 01:31 AM   #10
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Hi Chris,

To answer your question, I personally can't drive the 415 MSX (and its related cousins MRE and MSXX) on carpet with the standard chassis and top deck. The main reason is that the top deck is too short and only lets the front of the car flex, which in turn makes the car very inconsistent for me, I just can't drive them. Put a stiffer top deck and chassis and the car was awesome.

Now on tarmac I used the tamiyas as per kit, they work really really well as the lower grip doesn't make the car flex as much. Same racing conditions as you as I'm in the UK. For your MSXX outdoors I'd start with the kit setup with minor alterations: no roll bars, blue springs all round, 35W all round and 3 holes pistons, spool and locked centre pulleys. I assume you're gonna run stock or 19T still, in which case I'd go for 1.5 rear toe instead of the 3 of the kit.
Thanks, thats useful to know, ive always found the thicker chassis on my ta05 to work really well indoors on rubber, so that would add up as it has quite a long 2 piece upper deck.

However, outdoors I have found 3degree rear toe in really helps the car on the infield outdoors on the ta05 (my local track is Eastbourne), and it has worked equally as well on a tight indoor track on foams (Horsham).

Yes, usually I race stock, and occasional 19t, and although I couldnt find a good setup for 19t outdoors, I think that was mostly due to setup and tyres not being right (I used vtec 24s).

I'll see how it goes, thanks for the setup
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Old 03-05-2008, 01:45 AM   #11
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a thicker chassis will have less chance of pulling a screw through in a bad wreck.

I have two Xray t2's. One has a 3.0 mm chassis and the other a 2.0 mm chassis. I run the 2mm outdoors and the 3.0mm on carpet. Sometimes, I just run the 2mm chassis with a solid 3.0mm upper deck and it feels the same as the multiflex chassis locked down.

My multi-felx chassis, just sit in the box unused.

I know this is offsubject, but in oval racing the trend is to make the chassis flex with larger cutouts and laterial cuts and lengthwise cuts. I guess it helps or they wouldn't be doing it.

I personally like having a soild piece of graphite I can mount my electronics on. Just sucks that the double sided tape is exposed to picking up debris on the underside of a chassis. If a chassis needs flex, make a cut, not a cutout.
I have had zero knowledge of racing xrays, but yes point taken- in a bad wreck the thicker chassis should come out not as bad, it is a safer option to stop screws pulling through when the chassis is that bit thicker. Luckily ive not been in a wreck bad enough to encounter that though, yet!

Ive had my esc partly pulled off the chassis in a big wreck, and I would agree it would help if you had a chassis with no cut outs underneath to attach it to and prevent the dust getting onto the tape and working it loose in time, its no big deal though, a new bit of d/s tape and its job done until it finally gives up again.
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Old 03-05-2008, 04:07 AM   #12
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From my experience across more than 10 different chassis (onroad) is that more flex makes the car easier to drive, hides setup flaws better, and tends to be slower in the middle of the corner.... Stiff makes the car twitchy, generally more difficult to drive especially when your setup needs work or you bump something, and provides more mid corner speed.

If you have the option (like xray) I would say start stiff and soften it up only if you can't get it to behave. As said above setup changes tend to have a greater effect when only the suspension moves.
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Old 03-05-2008, 04:35 AM   #13
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Useful info there Dragonfire...

Sometimes outdoors ive felt that the car is a bit vauge on the handling on a low grip track and that was with the ta05 (on the thick chassis), despite the feeling the suspension was set to an ideal level, so I do think chassis flex (with a thinner bottom deck) will help turn in, but its not something I am too clued up about, maybe a bit more offset on the wheel choice could aid stability and turn in

Ive raced for about 13 years so I know a lot of the basic stuff, but there is always something new to learn out on the track, its a challenge for sure!

I think the main reason I am not racing anything faster than stock most of the time is not really knowing how to set the car up to help cope with faster corning speeds, that for me feels like my weak area.

I know the tyres are the main thing, but chassis setup can be just as important I guess - and difficult to get right when you are looking for more from the car by knowing what to change...

One of my bad qualities over 13 years or so has been adapting my racing to the car and not making enough changes to see if it helps or hinders me. Because of this, I like the precision that a snappy/twitchy car handles so on foams on hard shocks I have precision, but I can also race a car that rolls into the corners gently if that makes sense.

In a way, thats a good thing but sometimes the latter is not always the fastest way around the track, and when you are moulding yourself around the car....
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