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Old 06-18-2009, 10:07 AM   #1306
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Got my first race last night with the r5. What a twitchy, inconsistant mess. Yes first time out and no clue what makes this car tick but I struggled pretty much all night. HP was one issue but mostly the way to touchy oversteer in the first 2 mins and the push the last 4 mins killed me.

My second qual was pretty good handling wise. Smooth but turned everywhere and was consistant the whole 8mins. If it drives like that all the time I would be happy. A couple bobbles by me and down pretty bad on hp put me 3 laps off the pace. Yuk, hate being there.

For the main I went up a few teeth and got close on the hp but by then my front tires were too thin to work so back to the dump truck for the last 4 mins. Finished where I started at 4th.

The setup is still pretty stock. Have to pick up some side springs to play with.
The biggest problem I have right now is how touchy the steering is right around center. I mean nasty. -15% expo didnt help and any more made the steering to notchy. How can I calm it down? Sevo is flat and the tie rods are straight when looking down on the car. Moving the servo back to get a little angle would make it more touchy around center, correct?

DK
I would play with the caster and or upper arm angle. Most of the time now we are using 5 dgr. uppr arm mounts. Too soft rear springs will also make the car very "nosey" if the grip is good.
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Old 06-18-2009, 10:08 AM   #1307
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That servos all the way forward? If not , isn't that the direction you would want to go???
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Old 06-18-2009, 10:43 AM   #1308
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I would play with the caster and or upper arm angle. Most of the time now we are using 5 dgr. uppr arm mounts. Too soft rear springs will also make the car very "nosey" if the grip is good.
5 deg mount. 6 degs caster. .018 spring. Silver side spring. Was thinking about shimming the upper arm mount to lower the roll center. Ultimatley I have a lot of testing infront of me.

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That servos all the way forward? If not , isn't that the direction you would want to go???
Yep, servo is full forward witch leaves a straight tie rod.

DK
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Old 06-18-2009, 04:36 PM   #1309
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5 deg mount. 6 degs caster. .018 spring. Silver side spring. Was thinking about shimming the upper arm mount to lower the roll center. Ultimatley I have a lot of testing infront of me.


Yep, servo is full forward witch leaves a straight tie rod.

DK
The first thing your going to want to do is switch the springs. I have been running a 12r5 all winter and dispite liking alot of steering I have been unable to get the .18's to work. I have had great luck with the BMI .22's which are similar to the AE .20's however do now suffer from compacting in a bad crash. I think you will find this small change will have a huge effect.
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Old 06-18-2009, 05:10 PM   #1310
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The first thing your going to want to do is switch the springs. I have been running a 12r5 all winter and dispite liking alot of steering I have been unable to get the .18's to work. I have had great luck with the BMI .22's which are similar to the AE .20's however do now suffer from compacting in a bad crash. I think you will find this small change will have a huge effect.
LOL. Your the second to recommend the .020. I started with the .020's and found the .018's were better at the end of the run.

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Old 06-18-2009, 06:48 PM   #1311
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LOL. Your the second to recommend the .020. I started with the .020's and found the .018's were better at the end of the run.

DK
They might have felt better but they are contributing to your problem. Those springs have a REALLY bad habbit of being way to soft and causing the car to do weird things. The springs are a huge factor in your front end and the rest of your car will not be right if you are not running a front end setup that other people can tune. The springs should not be producing a drastically different feeling from the start of your run to the end as they do not change, that is a setup issue elsewhere that needs to be addressed before any real issues can be resolved.

That being said I think the first thing to try if you have them around is the .022's if you have any around. The next thing I would try is order some BMI springs, they are far more linear and make the car alot smoother, one set of .022's and a set of .024's should get you started.
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Old 06-18-2009, 07:30 PM   #1312
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They might have felt better but they are contributing to your problem. Those springs have a REALLY bad habbit of being way to soft and causing the car to do weird things. The springs are a huge factor in your front end and the rest of your car will not be right if you are not running a front end setup that other people can tune. The springs should not be producing a drastically different feeling from the start of your run to the end as they do not change, that is a setup issue elsewhere that needs to be addressed before any real issues can be resolved.

That being said I think the first thing to try if you have them around is the .022's if you have any around. The next thing I would try is order some BMI springs, they are far more linear and make the car alot smoother, one set of .022's and a set of .024's should get you started.
Very interesting. Thanks for the heads up. I had some one pm me and help me figure out what is going on and we have a pretty good guess that its my tires that are messing with me. First step is getting a new set, Magenta frt and pink rear, and go from there.

Yes I tried .022's. I have tried the BMI springs on my old car and really couldnt feel if they were more linear or smoother. Felt the same to me. They were a pain to shim and get in the wheel with out rubbing so will just stick to normal size springs. Do like that they are more robust though.

One thing I did notice with this car is you HAVE to run lube on the kingpins. I could get away with out it on my old crc but not this thing. I notice after the second run I have to clean and relube. Is this normal? Any way to make it last longer?

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Old 06-18-2009, 08:31 PM   #1313
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I have also gone to the BMI .22 springs as well. I have found that the first set of springs that came with the kit were bad and have collapsed. Then I went to my local hobbyshop to buy 2 more sets and bot sets did not even last me a month, so that is why I have gone with the BMI springs.
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Old 06-18-2009, 09:07 PM   #1314
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I was in the other camp on front springs, I found with the .18 front springs, my car stayed more consistent thru 8 minutes. I did replace them fairly often, didn't crash much either, which helps them last longer... I was running the Tbar 12R5 , but found the same results earlier with the link version... JEFF
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Old 06-18-2009, 09:10 PM   #1315
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John St Amant and others- Did you ever find any issue with the front end, where was the problem, which part staightened things out, etc... haven't followed this thread for awhile, just wondering what the latest was on this, one part bad, operator error, wrong assembly, etc... Just wanna know what to look out for, THANKS!
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Old 06-18-2009, 10:50 PM   #1316
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John St Amant and others- Did you ever find any issue with the front end, where was the problem, which part staightened things out, etc... haven't followed this thread for awhile, just wondering what the latest was on this, one part bad, operator error, wrong assembly, etc... Just wanna know what to look out for, THANKS!
Looks like the upper arm and the plastic heim joint with pivot ball were the culprit. the hole was not straight in the part but looked good during installation.
The only way to fix it was to get lucky and find ones that are right right out of the package. Looks like most if not all the new ones are good to go. You would be hard pressed to tell with out attempting assembly.
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Old 06-19-2009, 07:34 AM   #1317
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Couple other questions.

1) what front width are you guys running? Have seen a lot of answers with shims here and there but no hard numbers.

2) side spring preload. What is common practice? 1 turn then tweak from there? 2 turns? What is the effect of preloading the side springs? If I preload them will it feel like a stiffer spring with no preload?

3) Im running a GTB 4 cell speedo at the moment and am looking for more rip. On the LRP I know how to adjust the punch but can it be done on this speedo? Maybe the drive freq?

thanks
DK
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Old 06-19-2009, 02:24 PM   #1318
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Thanks for the info John on the front end, now we know what to look for, and it's a fairly easy fix!!
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Old 06-19-2009, 10:52 PM   #1319
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Thanks for the info John on the front end, now we know what to look for, and it's a fairly easy fix!!
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Old 06-22-2009, 03:08 PM   #1320
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Couple other questions.

1) what front width are you guys running? Have seen a lot of answers with shims here and there but no hard numbers.

2) side spring preload. What is common practice? 1 turn then tweak from there? 2 turns? What is the effect of preloading the side springs? If I preload them will it feel like a stiffer spring with no preload?

3) Im running a GTB 4 cell speedo at the moment and am looking for more rip. On the LRP I know how to adjust the punch but can it be done on this speedo? Maybe the drive freq?

thanks
DK
1. 164mm measured on the bottom of the tires, camber will make the top narrower.

2. Depends on track and driver preference, I normally set the car on a flat plate back the crews all the way out then run them in slowly until they start to touch. Then I adjust tweek from there. Some racers prefer to not have the springs touch at all. That is helpful when the grip is low.

3. I run LRP so I can't comment on that

Also for any one interested, I have given a full set up sheet for my R5 with 1s lipo to the webmaster at RC10.com. It should be up soon.
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