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Old 07-01-2003, 09:39 PM   #271
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Quote:
Originally posted by BullFrog
On the promotions part- have you ever tried to get TV or newspaper coverage of a race.The TV guys are a joke 99% of the time. And the newspaper won't come out. That's the way it is here because of one club that messed it up for everyone.This includes when we held a Nationals here and No one came out to cover the race.Because this is football country don't even try coverage during the season.
The outlets will never pick up the event if releases and contact isnt made prior/post to the event.

Besides general interest tv/print there are other outlets that like to carry special interest stories. There is more leg work needed to set those outlets. But if it is interesting and fresh, they will bite.

If it wasnt for TeamOrion press machine it would be difficult find out what is going on industry wide. There are enough fan sites to syndicate releases to get the word out about events and results. I agree with a results release going out after events.

There was a comment earlier about non-ROAR events gaining more prestiege and focus. I would agree. They do because the folks that run and promote those races do so on such a large scale that people feel like they either need to be part or it or they are missing something. They know how to create an event.
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Old 07-01-2003, 10:13 PM   #272
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kraig
Lets make a suggestion to ROAR about tech tools. Have them foot the bill to have them built for each type of chassis, sedan, oval, 1/12th, etc. When the host track has the event they are shipped the tools with full instructions on how to use them and then after the event they are shipped back to ROAR. This way you have the same tools at every event and would limit the complaints. Thoughts on this?
Sorry Kraig, that sounds WAAAAAY too much like a common sense approach- not gonna happen. As you may know, I work for the City of Memphis, and I see a very comon trend in thinking between ROAR and Memphis. Anything that sounds like common sense will be thrown out the window...
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Old 07-01-2003, 10:17 PM   #273
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lol jason
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Old 07-01-2003, 11:46 PM   #274
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I think the absolute best thing that the R/C circuit here in the US could come up with would be a "National Tour" system comprising of most/many major events in the US, including nationals and other major races.

The tour would be in addition to whatever else was going on at the events; in other words, drivers competing at the ROAR Nats are still there for the ROAR Nats, earning tour credit is just an added bonus.

The tour would provide a way of both crowning a REAL champion (among many qualifying events, sanctioned or non) and providing accurate driver rankings across the country. Take 2003 for example: Blackstock won the Carpet Nats, Baker won the Reedy Race, Pavidis won the paved Nats. Who is #1? No clue.

The tour would be sanctioning-body independent, since driver rankings would be scaled based on each individual event. In other words, it doesn't matter if the rules were different at event A and event B, because all you are looking at is how a driver did at a particular event versus the other drivers in attendence. This would allow such a tour to include ALL of the major events.

A sample electric touring car season could begin in October with, say, Octoberfast in Minnesota, and continue through the ROAR Nationals in the summer. Events like:

October: Octoberfast
November: Cleveland Indoor Champs
January: Novak US TC Champs
February: Snowbird Nationals
March: ROAR Carpet Nats
May: Reedy Race
July: ROAR Paved Nats

And then of course filling in the rest of the schedule with other big events around the country.

Such a tour could be operated on a nearly cost-free basis by an independent third party (say, R/C Tech ). As long as participating events are willing to submit comprehensive results, the tour operator simply has to compile the standings and provide easy access to them.

If it proved to be popular and picked up sponsorship (e.g. the [insert company name here] National Tour) then some form of rewards (trophies at the very least) could be offered down the road.

Ultimately, though, I think the best part of such a system would be (a) driver rankings, and (b) a real, undisputed national champion.

Obviously there are plenty of things that would need to be worked out (e.g. how the ranking/points systems would work) but it doesn't seem too difficult to me. I participate in other sports that use similar systems -- as well as pro/amateur designations -- that really work to generate a ton of interest in competition at higher levels.
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Old 07-02-2003, 01:39 AM   #275
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I have a great way for ROAR to come up with some money, stop sending me that magazine that I do not read anyway. Put the money towards the tech boxes.
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Old 07-02-2003, 05:08 AM   #276
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Just how do you think the ROAR nationals got started.I will tell you- There was no nationals in the early 80's.No national champions.ROAR decided to do a three race series callled the American Classic(still got the decal sheet). It went to three sites during the year with the Red Lobster Classic in Melbourne,Florida, being the first. ROAR realized the the attendance fell down by the third race. So they went to just one race- the nationals the following year.It tihink this was 1985 with the first 1/12th nationals in Orlando in 1986 - just ask Rick Hohwart when he won his first 1/12th championship.I also won the winning motor (I gave it back and he sent a copy, which I still have).So we tried that and I can tell you no one will want the last few races because the turn out will be low.The same think happened in our state series racing. If you didn't have a chance to win or move up attendance fell down. We made the last race of the season go for points in the next season.
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Old 07-02-2003, 07:27 AM   #277
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Old 07-02-2003, 08:09 AM   #278
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I agree on the larger non-ROAR affiliated events becoming more recognized. I went to the Snowbirds this year as giddy as a schoolboy on his first day to junior high with peachfuzz on his upperlip. The only reason i was going to goto the ROAR Nats was to catch up with some of my ol' racin buddies that were going to be there. I wasnt even concerned about trying to get a trophy... or competing in the event. I havent been a ROAR member for well over 4 years... and honestly have no reason to be one. Why pay for sanctioning... that doesnt meet the needs of the people? There are many track owners that are hungry enough for this sport, that will, and do put on races of a caliber that exceeds ROAR expectation. The turnout at the NATS was most likely slack due to ROAR affiliation... not the Track itself. I mean... who wants a trophy from an event that the people KNOW isnt going to be supported by the sanctioning body? In the world of real scale racing, I doubt very seriously that Jeff Gordon... or any other well known NASCAR racer for that fact... would be willing to bust out all the good stuff on an event that wasnt well attended by other racers/factories and had no recognition... (other than a pat on the back and a trophy chic for the sleeper in the back of the car hauler.) With that said... i think it is the support of the teams that use these races as a venue to promote their product (what wins on Sunday sells on Monday) that will make or break an organization like ROAR. True, Losi and Associated as well as other companies help sponsor a race like the NATS... but i think the older ways of support arent going to work as they used too. Hell... whats so hard about tossing a few bucks and a banner for the driverstand?! Technology has changed so fast in this hobby, that all the big names need to find a way to help support ROAR (or any other sanctioning body) at tracks and other events to ensure the race results are fair. We all know that coverage of these events is important in promotion of the product. If the people become disgusted and dont attend the events... then what race will there be to cover in RC CAR ACTION? Noone will care what car wins or what setup Joe Shcmoe had to work on that left hand hairpin at the bottom of the straight. Im not here to proclaim RC Armageddon... but the growth of this sport has been tremendous in the past 10 years i have raced... i would sure hate to see it suffer or even die out (anyone remember the luge competitions on ESPN?.......anyone?) due to our own lack of concern or interest for varying reasons. It could happen... and we would all be left at home on Sunday trimmin the lawn, or planting those petunias for our wives. DAMN THAT!

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Old 07-02-2003, 08:13 AM   #279
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MikeD... by the way... congrats on your winnings. Kilruf (Jimmy) sorry you didnt have good luck at the race... im sure you will have better luck next time! And of course... Associated ALL THE WAY!
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Old 07-02-2003, 08:32 AM   #280
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as for the issue of attendence at this and other ROAR-sanctioned events; one of the main reasons i chose to attend this event- my first on-road nats and my first nats in three years- was primarily b/c of a handout, PREASSEMBLED tire for all the sedan classes, PLUS the limitation of two sets total for qualifying. i think that my attendence, in addition to that of others for this reason, reflects ROAR rule changes having the desired effect. i am happy to see that a similar handout/control tire rule at the national event in the other popular electric class-off road. although not preassembled- there is still the insert issue-it does limit the quantity of (practice) tires a racer has to bring to such an event. i think ROAR does address the needs and wants of its membership; albeit sometimes slowly...




futureal- i think what it is you are suggesting-some sort of nat'l 'tour'-already has a role model in frosty's r/c pro series...?
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Old 07-02-2003, 09:29 AM   #281
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Quote:
Originally posted by BullFrog
So we tried that and I can tell you no one will want the last few races because the turn out will be low.The same think happened in our state series racing. If you didn't have a chance to win or move up attendance fell down. We made the last race of the season go for points in the next season.
That's sort of missing the point, though. I agree that creating a brand new series with new events and all that is not going to fly, especially with all the choices that are out there right now.

But to create a national series out of established events (granted, some more than others) that is more for bragging (or sponsor bragging) rights than anything else, could work.

ROAR, for example, is still the biggest and most pretigious sanctioning body out there (IFMAR aside). No matter how badly ROAR screws up its National events, they are still going to have decent turn outs. Yes, this years paved nats were low, but there are other factors beyond what we've discussed. For example, you hold a Nats race in California, and it will fill up easily. Hold a Nats race at Trackside in Milwaukee and it will fill up simply because everybody knows Scotty will run an amazing race. And so on and so on. But a Nats race at a relatively unknown track in North Carolina? Turnout-wise, I think they did pretty well.
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Old 07-02-2003, 09:34 AM   #282
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Quote:
Originally posted by J.Filipow
futureal- i think what it is you are suggesting-some sort of nat'l 'tour'-already has a role model in frosty's r/c pro series...?
I think their series is a bit different. First, they have specific events laid out for the series, that are nothing but series races. Second, I think they pay out to the racers, don't they?

I don't think tossing money into the mix (at least not at this time) is going to help attract top talent. And while a couple "new' events could be created/added to such a series, I think it would really thrive and be carried on existing ones.

For a comparable model, take a look at the ATP Tour in professional tennis, or the PGA Tour in golf. Major championships are still major championships, but all player rankings and tour standings are based on all events involved. Players still want to win individual events -- The Masters, Wimbledon, etc. -- but at the end of the season, fans can look at the past year and see was on top, who won the most events, and so on.
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Old 07-02-2003, 10:01 AM   #283
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A national tour won't work - the US is too big of a country for the average racer to make more than one race. The pro guys will be the only ones who can make the majority of races, and with race teams holding off on signing up new guys (notice how Peak and X-Ray - among others - have signed up former drivers for other teams) they'll be hesitant to spend more money sending drivers to even more races, much less sponsoring a whole series.

A national series works in Britain, Switzerland, Germany and other countries because they are 1/20 the size of the US, or even smaller - a drive the length of nearly all European countries can be done in less than a day.

However, using an established set of races is a much better idea than trying to get tracks and sponsorship for a new set of races. What might work is letting the various race teams, magazines and R/C info sites know about the race series and get someone to pay for banners at each race and trophies at the end of the year, then set up a banquet at the last race to hand out the trophies. Get a major magazine to sponsor the series with trophies and coverage and you have the "insert r/c car mag title here National R/C Series", or whatever name you want to come up with.

You'd still have the problem of 99% of big race average drivers not being able to make more than one or two races, but you'd have the start of a race series. After a couple of years it could take off and more regular drivers might start making more of an effort to hit more races.

Just my 2 cents.
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Old 07-02-2003, 10:09 AM   #284
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Back in the "Golden Age of 1/12th scale" The US Triple Crown consisted of three races. The US Indoor Champs (Cleveland), The Winter Champs (Grand Rapids), and the Nationals (Detroit). All three were hotel races, and all three filled up in a matter of days. If you didn't mail your entry the day you received the form, you were outta luck.

Why were these three races so successful? Simple.... They were MAJOR EVENTS!! They weren't just big races, they were highly organized, incredibly fun, and well managed. They were part of a series, which shared the same rules, and points were tallied at the end of the season. There were no throwouts, so attendance was mandatory if you intended to do well in the "Crown". They drew the top competitors from around the country, and they were KILLER shows. I think the same thing could be done today.

The problem I see today is the lack of dedicated individuals to maintain the series. I'm not suggesting that I'm suitable for the job, and I beleive the USTC committee has dwindled down to one member. But if people step up we could get something going again.
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Old 07-02-2003, 10:21 AM   #285
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Quote:
Originally posted by Frank McKinney
However, using an established set of races is a much better idea than trying to get tracks and sponsorship for a new set of races. What might work is letting the various race teams, magazines and R/C info sites know about the race series and get someone to pay for banners at each race and trophies at the end of the year, then set up a banquet at the last race to hand out the trophies. Get a major magazine to sponsor the series with trophies and coverage and you have the "insert r/c car mag title here National R/C Series", or whatever name you want to come up with.

You'd still have the problem of 99% of big race average drivers not being able to make more than one or two races, but you'd have the start of a race series. After a couple of years it could take off and more regular drivers might start making more of an effort to hit more races.
Frank, yes, that's exactly what I had in mind. Existing races that wouldn't mind being part of a series that, if anything, would increase the interest/turnout they have.

The awards banquet could even be done in conjunction with another big event (RCX or Hobby Expo, for example), or at some other time/location likely to be easy for people to get to.

The amount of sponsorship necessary to get such a series off the ground would be minimal at first, I believe, other than the time that the coordinator(s) would be putting into it. The other possible roadblock would be getting some of these major events to agree to participate, although from my perspective, I don't see why any event organizer would *not* want to be part of something that could increase participation.

As I said a little while back, heck, maybe I'll get something going myself. I already have a somewhat captive audience here...
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