R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 01-20-2008, 03:32 PM   #76
Registered User
 
UltegraSTI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,171
Trader Rating: 20 (100%+)
Default

looks like 'C' is the new 'voltage' in terms of marketing....here we go...

R
UltegraSTI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 03:35 PM   #77
Tech Addict
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: north-west Indiana
Posts: 747
Trader Rating: 18 (100%+)
Default

If most people could just get it through their heads that drivers win races this wouldn't be a problem. The fact is, that if you have to push the limits of your battery to keep up with a guy who doesn't, you need to work on something else. If everyone does it, it is pointless. Now everyone is risking harm to others and destroying their batteries. Stupid, idiotic, I could think of a few other words to put there. But if everyone just follows safe guidelines you would be right where you would if everyone didn't. So if you really think you need an edge, I got an idea for you, learn to drive your car better.
trilerian is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 03:37 PM   #78
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 793
Default

The higher the C, the better the performance. That is fact, not marketing. Inflating the C number is marketing.
Jack Rimer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 03:37 PM   #79
Tech Fanatic
 
Tornado_Racing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Anywhere there is racin'
Posts: 750
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by trilerian View Post
Well, this is real simple. As the tornado guy said you should not do this with other branded lipo batteries, then I will be influencing people that run at my track not to buy the smc lipo batteries.
Charging and conditioning works on all Lipo packs but I have no test results on the Lipos in regards to overcharging. My 2 5000 packs have held up well to overcharging for the past 3 months.
__________________
Tony Moffre
PRS Customer Service

PRS - Hyperdrive - EA Motorsports - Corally USA - Parma/Faskolor - SMC - Killer Koncepts - MSA - Finishline - IRS - Lunsford - Trinity - Guarantee Graphix - RC4Less
Tornado_Racing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 03:41 PM   #80
Company Representative
 
Danny/SMC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Elkton, VA
Posts: 3,097
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

trilerian: Your missing the point. Overcharging gives a huge performance increase but I agree it shouldn't be done.

Cycling your packs at high amp rates and getting rid of the memory effect does give a good advantage and is safe.

Just because we point out some potential issues with the use of Lipos in high end racing doesn't mean were idiots or we can't drive a car. The fact is that if you properly train your Lipos they will perform better. The Hype about Lipos is that you just keep it in your car and keep recharging it but the fact is that you can have more performance if you cycle/condition it.
Danny/SMC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 03:41 PM   #81
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 793
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by trilerian View Post
If most people could just get it through their heads that drivers win races this wouldn't be a problem. The fact is, that if you have to push the limits of your battery to keep up with a guy who doesn't, you need to work on something else. If everyone does it, it is pointless. Now everyone is risking harm to others and destroying their batteries. Stupid, idiotic, I could think of a few other words to put there. But if everyone just follows safe guidelines you would be right where you would if everyone didn't. So if you really think you need an edge, I got an idea for you, learn to drive your car better.
Here here.
Jack Rimer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 03:57 PM   #82
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 68
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tornado_Racing View Post
*****WARNING: The below info is for experienced racers only. SMC and EA Motorsports do not recommend the following procedures. They deem them UNSAFE and will not assume responsibility for personal injury or property damage.*****


1. Do not attempt to use the following info on any other Lipo packs other than SMC 4000/5000 packs.
2. The following will decrease the life of your pack by at least 3/4.
3. The more the following process is repeated the greater chances are for FIRE dangers.
4. D0 NOT leave your pit area while performing the following procedures.
5. If a FIRE is caused do not use water or conventional fire extinguishers. USE SAND and smother the fire out.
6. Due to mis-use the manufacturers warranty will be void.


CHARGING (CE Lipo updated GFX)
12000mah or 12 amps
2 cell 8.40 peak
(90-95 degree temps)
DO NOT hook up sensor leads

DISCHARGE (CE Updated Lipo GFX)
35 amp
2 cell 6.0 cut-off
(140-150 degree temps)
Hook up sensor leads

CONDITIONING (CE Updated Lipo GFX)
Cycle, Cycle, Cycle...............
Charge then discharge several times prior to racing.

Under high end racing conditions 2 packs are needed. Cycle the pack using the above info and do not delay in-between discharge and charging. When the pack is done discharging go directly into a charge. With the SMC packs 3-4 cycles will "top out" the pack. Many other Lipo packs took 7-10 cycles and still did not top out.

When you are done with your heat/qualifier dump the pack and go right back into a charge.

At the end of your main or day of racing dump the pack done and store without charge. More than 2 weeks do not discharge your pack.

RE-PEAKING

*****Again this is VERY dangerous and can cause serious personal injury.*****

After the pack has completed a normal charge, re-peak with your Lipo GFX on NIHM mode at 10 amps. Let the pack overcharge to 9.00 volts and then stop the GFX. DO NOT WALK AWAY during this process as the pack will catch fire if voltage exceeds 9.25.


*****WARNING: The above info is for experienced racers only. SMC and EA Motorsports do not recommend the above procedures. They deem them UNSAFE and will not assume responsibility for personal injury or property damage.*****
This is a JOKE...right? No one in their right mind would even dream up something this crazy.

If this is what it takes I am done with R/C after over 10 years of racing. I don't even want to be in the same building if people are doing this.

At this point in time we can't afford to lose one single racer and believe me this will do it.

Maybe gas would be fun.
OldNSlow2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 04:01 PM   #83
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 68
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by trilerian View Post
If most people could just get it through their heads that drivers win races this wouldn't be a problem. The fact is, that if you have to push the limits of your battery to keep up with a guy who doesn't, you need to work on something else. If everyone does it, it is pointless. Now everyone is risking harm to others and destroying their batteries. Stupid, idiotic, I could think of a few other words to put there. But if everyone just follows safe guidelines you would be right where you would if everyone didn't. So if you really think you need an edge, I got an idea for you, learn to drive your car better.

Jack Rimer...me too!!!!!!

Get a new set of JACO's they are probably worth more than a tenth.
OldNSlow2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 04:05 PM   #84
Tech Fanatic
 
Tornado_Racing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Anywhere there is racin'
Posts: 750
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

This should be a little better. The following is fine and will not result in dangerous conditions. The following can be used on any Lipo pack but it will cut the overall life of the pack down but no fire or safety dangers should occur.

NORMAL CHARGE

CHARGING (CE Lipo updated GFX)
12000mah or 12 amps
2 cell 8.40 peak
(90-95 degree temps)
DO NOT hook up sensor leads

DISCHARGE (CE Updated Lipo GFX)
35 amp
2 cell 6.0 cut-off
(140-150 degree temps)
Hook up sensor leads

CONDITIONING (CE Updated Lipo GFX)
Cycle, Cycle, Cycle...............
Charge then discharge several times prior to racing.

Under high end racing conditions 2 packs are needed. Cycle the pack using the above info and do not delay in-between discharge and charging. When the pack is done discharging go directly into a charge. With the SMC packs 3-4 cycles will "top out" the pack. Many other Lipo packs took 7-10 cycles and still did not top out.

When you are done with your heat/qualifier dump the pack and go right back into a charge.

At the end of your main or day of racing dump the pack done and store without charge. More than 2 weeks do not discharge your pack.
__________________
Tony Moffre
PRS Customer Service

PRS - Hyperdrive - EA Motorsports - Corally USA - Parma/Faskolor - SMC - Killer Koncepts - MSA - Finishline - IRS - Lunsford - Trinity - Guarantee Graphix - RC4Less

Last edited by Tornado_Racing; 01-21-2008 at 04:50 AM.
Tornado_Racing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 04:17 PM   #85
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 68
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Tornado,

"After the pack has completed a normal charge, re-peak with your Lipo GFX on NIHM mode at 10 amps. Let the pack overcharge to 9.00 volts and then stop the GFX. DO NOT WALK AWAY during this process as the pack may cause fire and safety dangers if voltage exceeds 9.25."


This is exactly the kind of treatment nobody should be putting on the Internet. It is dangerous and will probably lead to injury, eventually. I can't imagine SMC has any interest in promoting this type of abuse and probably would be happy if it wasn't even on a thread about their product (at least I hope so).
OldNSlow2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 04:32 PM   #86
Tech Fanatic
 
Tornado_Racing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Anywhere there is racin'
Posts: 750
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldNSlow2 View Post
Tornado,

"After the pack has completed a normal charge, re-peak with your Lipo GFX on NIHM mode at 10 amps. Let the pack overcharge to 9.00 volts and then stop the GFX. DO NOT WALK AWAY during this process as the pack may cause fire and safety dangers if voltage exceeds 9.25."


This is exactly the kind of treatment nobody should be putting on the Internet. It is dangerous and will probably lead to injury, eventually. I can't imagine SMC has any interest in promoting this type of abuse and probably would be happy if it wasn't even on a thread about their product (at least I hope so).
If I'm asked it will be removed.
__________________
Tony Moffre
PRS Customer Service

PRS - Hyperdrive - EA Motorsports - Corally USA - Parma/Faskolor - SMC - Killer Koncepts - MSA - Finishline - IRS - Lunsford - Trinity - Guarantee Graphix - RC4Less
Tornado_Racing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 04:38 PM   #87
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 68
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tornado_Racing View Post
If I'm asked it will be removed.
Fair enough.
OldNSlow2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 05:55 PM   #88
Tech Master
 
Kings Kid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: sw lower michigan
Posts: 1,681
Trader Rating: 35 (100%+)
Default

Please remove it!

Back when most of you were still running 3300 nimhs, we were charging the scorpion paks at 3c. the c rate isn't the problem, it's the voltage! Roar has allready set guidelines for charging them, and as "responsible" vendors-adults
You should know better. Have you any idea how many young kids read these sites and take what some of you say as gospel? So how many of your gears and batteries should I recomend to the young ones within my influence?
You decide! Be Blessed,Rick
Kings Kid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 06:02 PM   #89
Company Representative
 
Danny/SMC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Elkton, VA
Posts: 3,097
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Tony there is no need to remove the info as if you wouldn't of tried this somebody else would of. I think the message boards are great so we can discuss/debate about things like this. Bottom line tracks allowing Lipos need to know that overcharging can be done and should be looked into. If racers don't know about it they will wonder why some guy is going .2 or so of second faster than them. Plus we know it's not safe so it's better to make people aware.

I have said it all along that Lipos are not as perfect as some want them to be and when you start using them in high end racing they will not have any of the so called advantages over sub-c cells as were finiding out that cycling them certain ways is making them perform better.
Danny/SMC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2008, 06:15 PM   #90
Tech Lord
 
syndr0me's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: 5280 Raceway
Posts: 13,140
Trader Rating: 32 (100%+)
Default

This thread is full of fail. I'm ashamed of you guys.

ROAR's voltage rule should be strictly followed at all racing venues, and anybody intentionally breaking it should be banned for life.
syndr0me is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
SMC 4100 and 5200 Hardcase 7.4V 24C Lipos Danny/SMC Electric On-Road 90 04-05-2009 10:55 AM
SMC 4000 mah Hardcase Lipos 28C NIB rraden R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 11 09-12-2008 11:20 AM
SMC Lipos 7.4 5000mah wfdfiremedic Electric On-Road 624 08-27-2008 10:09 AM
New SMC Lipos 7.4v 2s 4000 and 5000mah HardCase IOwNMkeG R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 4 03-30-2008 01:54 PM
new maxamps 4000mah 7.4v Lipos $75 aussiebuddha Australia For Sale/Trade 2 02-01-2007 04:08 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 02:47 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net