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Old 01-22-2008, 03:33 PM   #166
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You are big time stock driver. If all your buddies you were used to running with move up isnt it going to encourage you to move up too? You arent going to feel great about beating the guy you have never heard of. I think thats the idea...

If the top 5 guys move up I can guarentee you there are going to be another 5-15 that move up to in order to keep racing those guys. They arent going to want to feel like they were left back in the "minor leagues".
The goal is completely opposite of that. The goal, as I understood it was to remove the "fastest" guy to supposedly give everybody else a chance.

If a racer can't make the top 10 in the slower class, what chance does he have in the faster class? AND, the guy that was stomping the worst in the slower class is now there as well.
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Old 01-22-2008, 03:46 PM   #167
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I'm of a similar opinion to Larry and Jeff when it comes to the fact that removing 1 driver from the class for the following year will do nothing to get people into racing or to encourage people to attend large events. This is just more crap that appeals to the instant gratification mindset. The more classes there are, the worse that gets. The way to get people into racing is to get the cars slowed down to where they were at the beginning of this decade. I started racing in 2000, and back then stock was easy enough that only the least talented people had a difficult time handling the cars. I too remember racing on Saturday nights where we had two classes: stock and pro stock. There were often 5 or 6 FULL heats of Stock and one or two pro stock heats. It was easy enough back then to learn how to drive well and to setup a car without worrying about tapping one board for fear of breaking. At this point, 17.5 BL with 6 cell is close to that speed, probably a little faster. 21.5 BL motors would work, but gearing them correctly is impossible. The BL motor design would have to change to increase the Kv rating without increasing power, if that's possible.

As far as stepping to modified goes:
Right now, especially for those who race on small carpet tracks most of the year, mod is simply too tough to just show up and race at a big event. No one can race it locally because no one else wants to. The cars are too fast. While this makes them great to watch as far as spectators are concerned, having someone who can only club race stock try and run one of these cars for only large events is very difficult.
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Old 01-22-2008, 03:57 PM   #168
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Let me ask a question I haven't seen anyone else ask...

Reedy Race of Champions...

If you win the Open Mod, you run in the Invite class the next year against the big boys. This is seen as something that people strive for. But yet here we have people fighting to stay in stock. I don't get it.
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Old 01-22-2008, 04:09 PM   #169
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Let me ask a question I haven't seen anyone else ask...

Reedy Race of Champions...

If you win the Open Mod, you run in the Invite class the next year against the big boys. This is seen as something that people strive for. But yet here we have people fighting to stay in stock. I don't get it.
The problem is that the class known as "stock" is just to fast for about everybody but the top 20 drivers. It's not slow, it's VERY challenging, and you have to be VERY good at every aspect of it, to be good at it.

Nothing, and I mean NOTHING challenges and frustrates me more than "stock". That's the appeal. Or I could go out in mod, and beat the holy crap out of my car, and make time.

I don't think it's a fight, it's a HUGE challenge. The racing is tighter, there is more "side by side" controlled action, and frankly, my bodies last longer and look better.

Perhaps we've had wrong all along maybe the easiest class is Mod? "technically".
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Old 01-22-2008, 04:16 PM   #170
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Which again brings 4-cell stock sedan into focus as a viable option methinks. Only downer is that there isn't a LiPo 4.8v option or LI-Ion...
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Old 01-22-2008, 04:32 PM   #171
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Knocking one guy out of stock for winning is just a short term slap on the wrist. Alone it does not make much sense. If ROAR wants to make Stock a Novice class then you should have to prove your Novice status. Example: No major event top three finishes, No team drivers, etc.

I think Stock is the Sportsman class. There should be no need to have two stock races at national or local races. All other kinds of races have support classes along with the main event races. Stock should be a support race at the national races, with the main events being 19t and Mod.

Back home at your local track the fast guys would be practicing for their main event races and the new guys would be learning to race in the stock class. The new guys can also get a chance to race at a National event against other new guys in the Stock class. If they do well and place in the top three, then they should loose their Novice status.

Slowing down Stock is also a great way to make it cheaper to race (less broken parts). Keeping is BL/Lipo would also make it cheaper to race and easier learn too.
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Old 01-22-2008, 04:38 PM   #172
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stock is to fast? you want to slow stock down? Unless its 12th scale stock is to fast.. and then I might say yes it is for some people. Unless its at a national event, stock is boring.. Its a full throttle run with a couple lifts..Last time I ran stock at a national was paved nats 2004.. was a good time. I am over it tho.. 19turn/10.5 is a really fun class... its all mod and 10.5 for me now..
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Old 01-22-2008, 04:47 PM   #173
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Which again brings 4-cell stock sedan into focus as a viable option methinks. Only downer is that there isn't a LiPo 4.8v option or LI-Ion...
The only real downer would be the doubling of the amp draw required to go a decent "race speed" again. 4 cell is the answer if the question is, "who wants to go slower and have a harder time making run time in the process?"
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Old 01-22-2008, 05:03 PM   #174
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stock is to fast?
On carpet and 6-cells? Yes.
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Old 01-22-2008, 05:21 PM   #175
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When the slowest class is only say 2 laps back or 20 seconds after 5 minutes, that's to fast. When we tell people to run modified or 19 turn and most can't turn faster lap times with a 19 than a stock, then yes, for the masses, 19 turn is also 2 fast. And the amount of people that can actually go substantially faster with full on, anything goes modified, compared to 19 are few and far between at a club level, even on a national level. You go down 30-40 places, and it gets pretty rough down there.

So what we have is stock is so fast, most guys can't go much faster with 19, and most of the mod guys we know, "typical club dudes", have given up and just run 19 all the time because mod is just trashing their stuff.

Almost seems like everything is to fast, doesn't it.

If ROAR just out of the blue announced that the next big event would be old school silver cans only in every single class, a few would bitch, but the majority of people that like to race would be thinking to themselves, "I wonder how that's going to unfold?" they would go and have fun. The guys that would come on an internet forum and complain that it was to slow would not go. Which is EXACTLY what is supposed to happen. Guys that think something is to slow move on to a faster class, event.

You want guys to move on, you need to make it less appealing to whatever it is that keeps people there, IF that is the goal.

Tossing out one driver is not going to change anything.
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Old 01-22-2008, 05:26 PM   #176
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Yeah, what Bob said.
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Old 01-22-2008, 06:12 PM   #177
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hmmmm...I wonder what Mike Reedy would do if he was making this decision?

I wonder if ROAR has asked him for imput on this issue...hint hint
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Old 01-22-2008, 06:12 PM   #178
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Bring back silver can racing that is tightly controlled, IE the whole "A" main motors get checked. And run a spec lipo.

That should be slow AND cheap enough.
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Old 01-22-2008, 06:13 PM   #179
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I don't agree with stock being to fast for onroad.. Offroad maybe, I run foam mod sedan as my fun class.. Cause its good times and its not sleepdriving for me. I guess RC in general is to fast, lets slow all the classes down.. we can be like the IRL and F1 and everyone else that thinks race cars go to fast.. its a matter of technology and people learning to exploit it.. take 4 cell oval. everyone bitched at first because it was to slow, now look at it. Its out of control again.. its called evolution... you slow it down now, we will just make it faster...
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Old 01-22-2008, 06:14 PM   #180
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hmmmm...I wonder what Mike Reedy would do if he was making this decision?

I wonder if ROAR has asked him for imput on this issue...hint hint
nice... lol... long time no see, hows the northwest treating you?
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