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Old 01-08-2008, 09:21 AM   #1
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Default Trackside summary....Jim Dieter

Great job to Scotty, ran as only Scotty can do it. The first Brushless only race....We'll be discussing ways to fine tune this system as we race the 10.5 class more. By "we", I mean the manufactures. Now we can hurt motors if we arent careful in the 13.5 and 10.5 classes. Everyone has way more battery than a layout like this will allow you to use. We could have ran two races without recharging if we could have geared higher without melting....new problems. Modified, nearly the same. We had over a minute left at 30 amps after a mod run, we simply couldnt use it. On a track where the 10.5 class is only a couple tenths off mod, we will never dump. Better for the average racer trying to compete for sure.
As far as our team ? We lost, cant win them all I guess. Both Mike and Josh ran for me several years on tracks just like this. I knew that they would be good as soon as I saw it. Mike had a setup that was the least scrubbing I had ever seen, his motors didnt even change tones in the corner. Both did a great job, all I can say is congrats and go back to work.
This race definately showed us that things are going to be different, brushless is not the great equalizer everyone had hoped. It pointed out more problems to be solved. Fixed timing motors wont be as important as fixed timing speed controls for one. And...How the hell do you tech it ?? If we guess wrong, it will cost us a motor. Needless to say, I will be speaking with Novak, Cochran, Oscar, anyone else who wants to help the race directors figure things out before the next one.
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Old 01-08-2008, 10:32 AM   #2
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you mean there are speed controls that are not equal ?
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Old 01-08-2008, 10:50 AM   #3
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you mean there are speed controls that are not equal ?
Where do you think racers will look for an advantage? Somehow I THINK the team racers will get different equipment then what goes to the general public.

Anything electronic can be manipulated!! JMHO!!
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Old 01-08-2008, 10:50 AM   #4
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Tech will be an issue for years to come. People will be coming up with new tricks faster than the tech system will be able to keep up. Constant rule amendments will be in the future.

Like we've been saying, BL won't make racing easier, it will just make it different. We'll be tweaking everything, it's just different technology. I am looking forward to it..the more I can get a computer involved the better.

Hypothetical situation - we figure out how to tech the speed control via software control. Everyone has wireless, or wired connections on the ESC for a tech computer to check ... what then is keeping someone from writing software into the firmware that states "After a X minute run, return the ESC state back to this setup for 10 minutes." In an effort to cheat tech..

Enter the hand out speed control and motor...
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Old 01-08-2008, 10:52 AM   #5
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you mean there are speed controls that are not equal ?
I think/hope he means that they are not equal in the respect that they are all 'adjustable'... And some more-so, dependng on who is doing the 'adjusting'..
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Old 01-08-2008, 11:02 AM   #6
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If technology is there how about a chip that is installed at tech for a certain class or BL to limit the posibitlys of cheating( just thinking it out) my comment before was to be funny not serious....
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Old 01-08-2008, 11:04 AM   #7
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I think/hope he means that they are not equal in the respect that they are all 'adjustable'... And some more-so, dependng on who is doing the 'adjusting'..
Sponsored drivers (mostly racing in mod) use prototype equipment quite often. This gear isn't available to the public, and contains stuff that the public might never want to run. One of the perks/drawbacks to being a top ranking sponsored driver.

The question is who will start to produce hacks into existing equipment to take advantage of what the hardware in the box can do, or better yet, engineer a new brain for the box...

desolas: I can't wait for that scenario... what, $300 entry fee to play in the spec classes?
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Old 01-08-2008, 11:11 AM   #8
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Rc500..etc..Most of the newer speedos have some timing adjustments, which is fine, but it makes the fixed timing motor senario irrelevant.
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Old 01-08-2008, 11:14 AM   #9
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I like the speedo idea (handout) but not sure of the cost involved.
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Old 01-08-2008, 11:30 AM   #10
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Jim from your pit area what was the speedo of choice ? and did you guys try different speedos?

Also how did the trinity 10.5 run and did you guys try different rotors? Just wondering what you guys figured out with all that stuff
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Old 01-08-2008, 11:39 AM   #11
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Wall, Honestly, the motors were late, I had them show right before the first qualifier. So we played catchup the whole week. We ran the stock rotor(12.5) and just geared them until they kept up. 4.5 to 1 and higher. We ran both speedos, Novak and LRP. Both work but the timing needed to be adjusted as well as gear depending on the speedo. With another day or more motors we may have been better. I think Paul ran third, but that was more due to him than my setup.
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Old 01-08-2008, 12:31 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Twin 1 Kevin View Post
Where do you think racers will look for an advantage? Somehow I THINK the team racers will get different equipment then what goes to the general public.

Anything electronic can be manipulated!! JMHO!!
Ah I remember the good old days when there WERE team speedos.
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Old 01-08-2008, 12:36 PM   #13
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My first "team" speedo was a silver plated wiper arm on a reversed parma resistor, might even have been before your time Rick. My first delta protoype speedo was in around 83.
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Old 01-08-2008, 12:43 PM   #14
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I like the speedo idea (handout) but not sure of the cost involved.
I think the fact of the matter is that brushless motors are not stock motors. And they should probably not be treated as such. Treat them as what they are (modified motors) and allow what can't be controlled. If that is adjustable timing, so be it.

The other revolutionary idea that I have proposed in the past is to eliminate motor motor classifications completely.

Let any one use any motor, but divide the classes by voltage. So you will have 3-cell (it will work), 4-cell, 5-cell, 7.4V LiPo Enduro, all using the same motors. With BL, we are all using the same motors anyway (specs, price, features), so why not?

Just a thought.
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Old 01-08-2008, 12:45 PM   #15
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My first "team" speedo was a silver plated wiper arm on a reversed parma resistor, might even have been before your time Rick. My first delta protoype speedo was in around 83.
I remember.
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