1LikesU.S. Vintage Trans-Am Racing
12-07-2011, 11:16 AM
Our local VTA track runs lap times in the mid 18 second range. Lap times are more driven by if you hit the line or not. You need to run 4.1's up front and finish with 4.4's on the carpet oval.
12-07-2011, 12:14 PM
I am taking a survey to see if there is enough nationwide interest in VTA to justify a VTA class in the 2012 ROAR Carpet Nats. Please respond with "Definitely", "Maybe", or "Never". This event is a "pay-to-play", so you don't need to qualify to participate.
Question: If a VTA Exhibition Class is offered at the 2012 ROAR Carpet Nats, and the rules are as close as possible to USVTA rules, then would you travel to Dallas on March 15 - 18, 2012 to participate in the VTA Race?
Question: If a VTA Exhibition Class is offered at the 2012 ROAR Carpet Nats, and the rules are as close as possible to USVTA rules, then would you travel to Dallas on March 15 - 18, 2012 to participate in the VTA Race?
12-07-2011, 01:11 PM
I would rather not see everyone have to run out and buy a $25 kit for their motor. Especially when most guys are not getting north of 140-150*F.
I need to figure out how to address this in the rules.
I need to figure out how to address this in the rules.
12-07-2011, 01:13 PM
Difference, I was running a Ballistic 25.5 and the winner was running a Trinity D3 25.5 motor (which has OEM cooling holes BTW) and he just did not fall off the pace as much as mine did when the heat came up. The cooling is a big deal so I run a fan and now will have cooling holes in the endbell to help combat the problem I hope.
Sadly, without so much timing in the motor I cannot keep up down the long straight and sweeping corners (~125') to be competitive so I must control the heat issue. If this does not work I have a new Fantom ION 3 25.5 motor sitting in my pit box ready to go
as long as our track is allowing different 25.5 motors to be run.
Sadly, without so much timing in the motor I cannot keep up down the long straight and sweeping corners (~125') to be competitive so I must control the heat issue. If this does not work I have a new Fantom ION 3 25.5 motor sitting in my pit box ready to go
as long as our track is allowing different 25.5 motors to be run.
12-07-2011, 02:38 PM
Originally Posted by wwddww34
I am taking a survey to see if there is enough nationwide interest in VTA to justify a VTA class in the 2012 ROAR Carpet Nats. Please respond with "Definitely", "Maybe", or "Never". This event is a "pay-to-play", so you don't need to qualify to participate.
Question: If a VTA Exhibition Class is offered at the 2012 ROAR Carpet Nats, and the rules are as close as possible to USVTA rules, then would you travel to Dallas on March 15 - 18, 2012 to participate in the VTA Race?
Question: If a VTA Exhibition Class is offered at the 2012 ROAR Carpet Nats, and the rules are as close as possible to USVTA rules, then would you travel to Dallas on March 15 - 18, 2012 to participate in the VTA Race?
12-07-2011, 06:21 PM
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Last edited by SS LS1; 02-22-2012 at 10:01 AM. Reason: No interest in photos so they were removed.
12-07-2011, 06:39 PM
That's easy, lazy guys can do nothing or spend some cash to buy these parts if they want. Or the more handy racers can save the $25 bucks and just drill the endbells like I did.
It is not really about the money, I would just rather be able say "I did that" when others inquire about where to buy that modification they see. Racers will always be racers and will look for any advantage they can get, don't take that away from us. Being an engineer I love looking for things like this, that its what makes this hobby fun for imaginative guys. It's not just 3 heats and a main each week that I love, but also the bench time each week I get to tinker with my cars to forget the stresses of everyday life.
Where others just toss their car in their trunk and forget about it for 7 days and wonder why they never get out of the B main, well they won't be interested in any of this. No rule needed IMO.
Pics of my motor cooling mods for those interested.....
It is not really about the money, I would just rather be able say "I did that" when others inquire about where to buy that modification they see. Racers will always be racers and will look for any advantage they can get, don't take that away from us. Being an engineer I love looking for things like this, that its what makes this hobby fun for imaginative guys. It's not just 3 heats and a main each week that I love, but also the bench time each week I get to tinker with my cars to forget the stresses of everyday life.
Where others just toss their car in their trunk and forget about it for 7 days and wonder why they never get out of the B main, well they won't be interested in any of this. No rule needed IMO.
Pics of my motor cooling mods for those interested.....
Well put. Nice work on the endbells! I hope it works out for your local racing scene. Nationally, we'll see where the ruling body falls.
12-07-2011, 06:51 PM
EVEN if you were down the .2 per lap (maximum deviation stated) that's 5 laps to fall a second behind. 35 laps would be seven seconds plus two more laps ("37 non marshalling laps) at .2 sec deficit each makes this "slow" guy 7.4 seconds in arears. On 12.6 sec "par" laps that's only 3/5 of a lap or so down, not 1-2 laps. At the low end of the stated discrepancy (.1) the difference falls to 3.7 seconds or only a quarter lap.
12-07-2011, 06:53 PM
A lot of the success of the class has been based on keeping the motor and esc end of things pretty simple. It started to get away from us for a while, but once it was stabilized, it has been a very good situation.
This class is not really about tinkering with motors. I don't think it's a good thing.
This class is not really about tinkering with motors. I don't think it's a good thing.
12-07-2011, 07:02 PM
Tech Fanatic
iTrader: (84)
My two cents.
This is just another "trick" thing that the fast guys (or guys with lots of time on their hands) are going to do, and is thus just another thing that newbs are going to see on the other guys cars and think they have to do just to be competitive.
Translation: it's a perceived barrier to entry into VTA. It's also not within the spirit of the class (buy the motor, bolt it into the car, no "trick" stuff needed, and go race a lot). And most simply, it's not needed. We race VTA cars on California asphalt that gets above 120* track temp, and we don't burn out motors even with 3.7 gearing. There is no epidemic of burned out 25.5's. There is no need for extra cooling. Even if the motors DO slow down a bit,...everyone has the same issue so everyone slows down a bit. It's equal. That's what VTA is supposed to be.
So it should come as no surprise that my opinion is that it has NO business in VTA. Do you really want to tell some new guy that he has to take his shiny $89 motor, and TAKE IT APART and take a DREMEL to it? Or that he needs some $25 hop up piece that he has to take his motor apart to install? No, you don't.
This is just another "trick" thing that the fast guys (or guys with lots of time on their hands) are going to do, and is thus just another thing that newbs are going to see on the other guys cars and think they have to do just to be competitive.
Translation: it's a perceived barrier to entry into VTA. It's also not within the spirit of the class (buy the motor, bolt it into the car, no "trick" stuff needed, and go race a lot). And most simply, it's not needed. We race VTA cars on California asphalt that gets above 120* track temp, and we don't burn out motors even with 3.7 gearing. There is no epidemic of burned out 25.5's. There is no need for extra cooling. Even if the motors DO slow down a bit,...everyone has the same issue so everyone slows down a bit. It's equal. That's what VTA is supposed to be.
So it should come as no surprise that my opinion is that it has NO business in VTA. Do you really want to tell some new guy that he has to take his shiny $89 motor, and TAKE IT APART and take a DREMEL to it? Or that he needs some $25 hop up piece that he has to take his motor apart to install? No, you don't.
12-07-2011, 07:04 PM
Tech Master
iTrader: (3)
Pics of my motor cooling mods for those interested.....[/QUOTE]
IMO...Your motor mods are begging to have debris sucked into your motor. One stray pebble or screw and the motor is junk.
IMO...Your motor mods are begging to have debris sucked into your motor. One stray pebble or screw and the motor is junk.
12-07-2011, 08:03 PM
There is your cover Rob!
HEY, I was going to say that!
If you blip the throttle in 17.5 1s to let a guy get by, you will blow off .2 this lap, plus another .1 or so over the next two (oval is a momentum class, anymore). If you get off line, that adds another .3 or so. Everything counts when you need to run 56/4:02 to keep from getting run over when you start to get lapped at the 45 second mark.
In VTA? Meh. Not so much.
12-07-2011, 08:38 PM
hey if a guy wants to destroy a motor by putting holes in it...and he like tinkering, knock yourself out...he will be tinkering alot more to clean the motor more often and keeping debris out of it...
we dont have a National FDR rule anymore, so ppl are going to the limit to get more speed....Ive seen them geared to 3.1 fdr at our track...but with a extra nice fan blowing on it, it stayed 160 deg-ish...
Rob, I dont think a rule will work...cause then you get into not allowing cooling fans and removing the motor ring...its a can of worms with no end...
but VTA racers dont need to stir-up every time a "something" happens, rather it be battery,motors, or end bells....we need to use a little common sense and think about whats best for the class....
and of course, if I decide to drill some holes in my motor, to try and keep it cool...Im not geared correctly anyway....
we dont have a National FDR rule anymore, so ppl are going to the limit to get more speed....Ive seen them geared to 3.1 fdr at our track...but with a extra nice fan blowing on it, it stayed 160 deg-ish...
Rob, I dont think a rule will work...cause then you get into not allowing cooling fans and removing the motor ring...its a can of worms with no end...
but VTA racers dont need to stir-up every time a "something" happens, rather it be battery,motors, or end bells....we need to use a little common sense and think about whats best for the class....
and of course, if I decide to drill some holes in my motor, to try and keep it cool...Im not geared correctly anyway....
12-07-2011, 08:42 PM
btw....that motor...looks, well, over done...looks like one of our rookies from the Academy took turns shooting at it...lol...jk....but it does look hole-ly