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Old 10-11-2011, 08:17 PM   #12616
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I am sure I have the internal ratio correct. We are not going for speed here and more driving/setup skills.

We have been talking with Tim from the Omaha Hobbyplex abut their VTA rules and like what we hear about the FDR limits.

Our track is considerable smaller. Our typical lap times are about 6-8 seconds. We have an oval setup this week so we have been seeing a lot of 3's!

Due to the size of our track we are contemplating an FDR of 7. I tested a 7.1 out today as it was the closest I could get with the gears I had on hand. The speed was a little slow for the oval and I was by myself so it was not very exciting.

What I didn't like was the all on/all off feel of that low a ratio. The motor had to really turn a lot of rpm for the speed. Not sure how that will effect the motor. Heat was a non issue, just a lot of high rpm.

(69t spur / 24t pinion) * 2.5 = 7.19 final drive ratio. I am using a TC4.
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Old 10-11-2011, 08:26 PM   #12617
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We run a 6.0 FDR and it works great. We are considering a lower fdr this year. Our track is 90x60 and it seems we may have the room to gear down. We shall see. But fdr limits works great and also we use the novak rpm sensor and adjust everyone's end bell timing so that all motors are within 100 rpm of the others. We then put a sticker over the end bell to know it has been set. On more serious race days we check before and after races. This has really tightened up racing last year and we hope for the same success this year.

As far as the TC5 it is a great car for VTA. I have run one for an entire season and loved it.
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Old 10-11-2011, 09:13 PM   #12618
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Thanks for all the great info,I appreciate everyone's reply!I'm going to order the TC5R after I post this.I have one more question,what's the best option for mounting a lipo battery in a TC5?

Thank's again,Johnny
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Old 10-11-2011, 09:59 PM   #12619
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Originally Posted by ez_rider91 View Post
Thanks for all the great info,I appreciate everyone's reply!I'm going to order the TC5R after I post this.I have one more question,what's the best option for mounting a lipo battery in a TC5?

Thank's again,Johnny
I went with a Gens Ace 5000 mainly to have more weight. I use the Associated lipo brace (part 31257) and thin strapping tape from my hobby shop. I had to slightly dremel the brace (maybe 1mm) to make the battery case fit properly.

I do not use the graphite battery strap and no screw posts because I read that using them can tweak the chassis. To get the car balanced and up to min weight I taped lead weights to the lipo retainer on the outside edge.
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Old 10-13-2011, 08:49 AM   #12620
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I got a call asking me to move my post of a thread...so he it is...read away USVTA fans...
Hey guys I didnt want to even get into this....but a couple of things I have questions....

1. why do you think there has been any other motor offered in VTA since brushless/lipo....it has always been Novak..

2. whats the difference in a spec motor and spec anything else...tires, bodies, esc, battery, ride height, weight, ect...its just rules correct. the rules of a class, be it TC,12th scale or off-road. Its just rules of a class...not playing favorites. Its shouldnt be looked at any different than running Sweeps as a spec tire in TC.

3. running house rules for a National level class, will get little or no response from the guys that love and respect the USVTA rules. I think the ROAR Pavement, MSRA BTH, and some other races would have had a lot better turn-out if the National rules were used.

4. Your locals run the "ROAR" rules(21.5), and that fine, but the USVTA(majority) of all the VTA racers fly the USVTA banner. Wouldnt it make more sense to get ppl in the right rules before you completly allienate the club from VTA racers that would LOVE to come run at your track. Especially with the large events that you guys put on...ei HC and Champs.

5.NJ had said that they was running ROAR as well because the locals ran it and the surrounding states/area did as well...and 7 guys showed to run the Pav Nats? Thats a loss for the chance to gain some ground on the only entry class that has gone coast to coast and overseas with the same rule package.

6. I know the debate about getting on-road on "track" and Im always going push VTA, sometimes to hard..lol, but Ive seen what it has done for several tracks to keep the doors open and ppl getting into the RC on-road program, incl Thunder RC here in Nashville.

sorry to draw this out and I respect what all of you do for on-road...but I trully believe that the USVTA rules is the easy way to keep the class growing and gain ground for new racers...its proven by two things...

A. we have had the MCC for 3 years and it always was a great event, but we always had some mix of house and USVTA rules....this year we did some tweaking, and not in just the name, but went full on USVTA for VTA and GT, and look at what happen. We double the entries, as well as had ppl come from as far as Ohio,Indiana,Michigan,Illinois,S. Carolina,N.Carolina, Alabama, Georgia,Kentucky, and others..which is also a 1st for us.

B. as the track owner, you are in charge...me and Dirla talked about going to full USVTA weeks even months before doing so. He told me that the easy way to get ppl to jump ship, was for me to jump 1st, and see who follows. Dont get me wrong, I was more afraid of losing racers cause of the rule change...I even waited longer cause of the fear of ppl quiting, a class I was very helpful in building at my local track. But I jumped...and 20+ guys jumped with me...and another 10 followed...oh yeah, 1 quit...but came back to finish 2nd in the 2011 USVTA Southern Nationals...go figure

thanks for your time and I hope soon that all tracks will fly one rule set, for right now, the best shot we have to build on-road racing...other ideas are out there...but right now USVTA is building racers and keeping track open...until something else comes along....lets work together to keep on-road racing going and adding new ppl where possible...

Thank you
Myron "Battman" Kinnard

ps...hope the race is awesome...cya soon
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Old 10-13-2011, 09:25 AM   #12621
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Originally Posted by DARKSIDE View Post
I got a call asking me to move my post of a thread...so he it is...read away USVTA fans...
Hey guys I didnt want to even get into this....but a couple of things I have questions....

1. why do you think there has been any other motor offered in VTA since brushless/lipo....it has always been Novak..

2. whats the difference in a spec motor and spec anything else...tires, bodies, esc, battery, ride height, weight, ect...its just rules correct. the rules of a class, be it TC,12th scale or off-road. Its just rules of a class...not playing favorites. Its shouldnt be looked at any different than running Sweeps as a spec tire in TC.

3. running house rules for a National level class, will get little or no response from the guys that love and respect the USVTA rules. I think the ROAR Pavement, MSRA BTH, and some other races would have had a lot better turn-out if the National rules were used.

4. Your locals run the "ROAR" rules(21.5), and that fine, but the USVTA(majority) of all the VTA racers fly the USVTA banner. Wouldnt it make more sense to get ppl in the right rules before you completly allienate the club from VTA racers that would LOVE to come run at your track. Especially with the large events that you guys put on...ei HC and Champs.

5.NJ had said that they was running ROAR as well because the locals ran it and the surrounding states/area did as well...and 7 guys showed to run the Pav Nats? Thats a loss for the chance to gain some ground on the only entry class that has gone coast to coast and overseas with the same rule package.

6. I know the debate about getting on-road on "track" and Im always going push VTA, sometimes to hard..lol, but Ive seen what it has done for several tracks to keep the doors open and ppl getting into the RC on-road program, incl Thunder RC here in Nashville.

sorry to draw this out and I respect what all of you do for on-road...but I trully believe that the USVTA rules is the easy way to keep the class growing and gain ground for new racers...its proven by two things...

A. we have had the MCC for 3 years and it always was a great event, but we always had some mix of house and USVTA rules....this year we did some tweaking, and not in just the name, but went full on USVTA for VTA and GT, and look at what happen. We double the entries, as well as had ppl come from as far as Ohio,Indiana,Michigan,Illinois,S. Carolina,N.Carolina, Alabama, Georgia,Kentucky, and others..which is also a 1st for us.

B. as the track owner, you are in charge...me and Dirla talked about going to full USVTA weeks even months before doing so. He told me that the easy way to get ppl to jump ship, was for me to jump 1st, and see who follows. Dont get me wrong, I was more afraid of losing racers cause of the rule change...I even waited longer cause of the fear of ppl quiting, a class I was very helpful in building at my local track. But I jumped...and 20+ guys jumped with me...and another 10 followed...oh yeah, 1 quit...but came back to finish 2nd in the 2011 USVTA Southern Nationals...go figure

thanks for your time and I hope soon that all tracks will fly one rule set, for right now, the best shot we have to build on-road racing...other ideas are out there...but right now USVTA is building racers and keeping track open...until something else comes along....lets work together to keep on-road racing going and adding new ppl where possible...

Thank you
Myron "Battman" Kinnard

ps...hope the race is awesome...cya soon

Battman, I don't think people have a problem with the rules of USVTA. The problem was this was legal one year and the next it wasn't. I hope Rob K doesn't change the rules, then you'll see all the questions about the rules go away. It just takes time.......
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Old 10-13-2011, 09:40 AM   #12622
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How many people are still having trouble getting to the last page of this thread?

...if you are.... Send a PM to "IBobi" ...please.
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Old 10-13-2011, 10:06 AM   #12623
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Originally Posted by jgraham37128 View Post
Battman, I don't think people have a problem with the rules of USVTA. The problem was this was legal one year and the next it wasn't. I hope Rob K doesn't change the rules, then you'll see all the questions about the rules go away. It just takes time.......
I understand that...my issue if any, is that alot of the large on-road events that have alot of history seem to think that a "house rule" will get the ball rolling with the VTA class....and its not...

having the rules change over a year ago was a great thing...they are perfect right now...ppl have to remember VTA is still a new class...it only been here since 2007...and has changed from 27t and 4 cell, to 17.5 4 cell, to 21.5 lipo, to 25.5 lipo...4 changes and some of these where offered at the same time..

other classes have changed more over a summer than VTA in 4 years...

the USVTA National rules are the best set of rules for VTA..period...and I hope ppl see this at some point to help and not hurt the class...

thanks to all the USVTA loyal racers that understand and make this class what it is....

NOTE:...nobody came to me and said they lost a VTA race cause of anything other than driver and setup...not esc,motor,tires, or money...go figure
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Old 10-13-2011, 10:16 AM   #12624
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DARKSIDE View Post
the USVTA National rules are the best set of rules for VTA..period...and I hope ppl see this at some point to help and not hurt the class...

thanks to all the USVTA loyal racers that understand and make this class what it is....

NOTE:...nobody came to me and said they lost a VTA race cause of anything other than driver and setup...not esc,motor,tires, or money...go figure
I agree with Darkside. We started a VTA class at Mike's Hobby Shop in Dallas, Texas on May 2011. Since VTA started at Mike's it has blown away all preconceived expectations that the class would only be around for a couple weeks and then it would just fizzle away. As of today we have had 42 consecutive VTA races and new people are showing up with VTA cars every week! The USVTA Formula is magic!! Don't mess with the formula.
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Old 10-13-2011, 10:28 AM   #12625
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How many people are still having trouble getting to the last page of this thread?

...if you are.... Send a PM to "IBobi" ...please.
I get "Firefox has detected that the server is redirecting the request for this address in a way that will never complete"

Also, the "last page" is trying to go to page 842, but there are only 828 pages.
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Old 10-13-2011, 10:53 AM   #12626
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All those redirects are a server/forum issue and they are piling up as empty posts.
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Old 10-13-2011, 11:08 AM   #12627
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Here's a temporary fix for the re-direct problem. Copy this URL and save it as a bookmark in your browser: http://www.rctech.net/forum/electric-road/198728-u-s-vintage-trans-am-racing-829.html. When you click on that bookmark it will always take you to page 829 of the US Vintage Trans Am Racing thread.

If you want to go to another page (like 830 for example) then you have to change the number just in front of ".html" to the page number you want.
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Old 10-13-2011, 01:06 PM   #12628
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DARKSIDE View Post
I got a call asking me to move my post of a thread...so he it is...read away USVTA fans...
Hey guys I didnt want to even get into this....but a couple of things I have questions....

1. why do you think there has been any other motor offered in VTA since brushless/lipo....it has always been Novak..


2. whats the difference in a spec motor and spec anything else...tires, bodies, esc, battery, ride height, weight, ect...its just rules correct. the rules of a class, be it TC,12th scale or off-road. Its just rules of a class...not playing favorites. Its shouldnt be looked at any different than running Sweeps as a spec tire in TC.


3. running house rules for a National level class, will get little or no response from the guys that love and respect the USVTA rules. I think the ROAR Pavement, MSRA BTH, and some other races would have had a lot better turn-out if the National rules were used.


4. Your locals run the "ROAR" rules(21.5), and that fine, but the USVTA(majority) of all the VTA racers fly the USVTA banner. Wouldnt it make more sense to get ppl in the right rules before you completly allienate the club from VTA racers that would LOVE to come run at your track. Especially with the large events that you guys put on...ei HC and Champs.


5.NJ had said that they was running ROAR as well because the locals ran it and the surrounding states/area did as well...and 7 guys showed to run the Pav Nats? Thats a loss for the chance to gain some ground on the only entry class that has gone coast to coast and overseas with the same rule package.

6. I know the debate about getting on-road on "track" and Im always going push VTA, sometimes to hard..lol, but Ive seen what it has done for several tracks to keep the doors open and ppl getting into the RC on-road program, incl Thunder RC here in Nashville.

sorry to draw this out and I respect what all of you do for on-road...but I trully believe that the USVTA rules is the easy way to keep the class growing and gain ground for new racers...its proven by two things...


A. we have had the MCC for 3 years and it always was a great event, but we always had some mix of house and USVTA rules....this year we did some tweaking, and not in just the name, but went full on USVTA for VTA and GT, and look at what happen. We double the entries, as well as had ppl come from as far as Ohio,Indiana,Michigan,Illinois,S. Carolina,N.Carolina, Alabama, Georgia,Kentucky, and others..which is also a 1st for us.


B. as the track owner, you are in charge...me and Dirla talked about going to full USVTA weeks even months before doing so. He told me that the easy way to get ppl to jump ship, was for me to jump 1st, and see who follows. Dont get me wrong, I was more afraid of losing racers cause of the rule change...I even waited longer cause of the fear of ppl quiting, a class I was very helpful in building at my local track. But I jumped...and 20+ guys jumped with me...and another 10 followed...oh yeah, 1 quit...but came back to finish 2nd in the 2011 USVTA Southern Nationals...go figure


thanks for your time and I hope soon that all tracks will fly one rule set, for right now, the best shot we have to build on-road racing...other ideas are out there...but right now USVTA is building racers and keeping track open...until something else comes along....lets work together to keep on-road racing going and adding new ppl where possible...


Thank you

Myron "Battman" Kinnard

ps...hope the race is awesome...cya soon



I want to preface this post to avoid being misconstrued; I am in favor of the USVTA rules package in it's entirety. I was also the guy who had to make the tough decision with regards to the rules at the NJ Paved Nats where the old USVTA/ROAR rules were run, so you can imagine my moral dilemma there.

I knew a few USVTA racers would be turned away by the 21.5 rules, but I had to do what was right for the 30+ VTA locals who could have run the class. Unfortunately, another common problem affecting "funster" classes arose, EVENT COSTS. The ROAR Nationals is not a cheap race, and the outdoor events are a crap shoot because of the weather. Few "funsters" have the funds to risk getting washed out at a fly-away race.

Now here's the one notable side affect from that event; Racers felt the need to buy a couple motors from other manufacturers to find out which one was fastest due to the open motor policy at ROAR events. Adding to the costs of a major event, funsters were now up against each others wallet size. Had this been a USVTA event, there would not have been any additional spending of this type because there's only two legal motors (SS, Ballistic) and they're similar in performance without the now defunct FDR restriction.

I realize that this is preaching to the choir here in the USVTA thread, at the very least the choir that has successfully accessed the thread in recent days , but there's a reason for my words.

After hearing about the Halloween Classic (eidt: <----incorrect, my bad) and Indoor Champs decision to run 21.5, I read through the chatter on their threads and it makes me wonder how well received the VTA class will be at their events. Their reasons seem eerily similar to my own at the NJ NATS, but that doesn't mean they aren't offering a fun class. In the end, they are offering the old VTA class at a big race, races which are an amazing experience in of themselves. I sincerely hope that the 21.5 VTA racers local to these two events come out to support the class, ensuring that in years to come VTA continues to be offered at big races. After all, big races have limited time with which to offer each class. If VTA isn't supported now, it may be a long time before it's given another try at these events.

p.s.-Who's got some vacation time in February?
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Last edited by Greg Sharpe; 10-13-2011 at 02:43 PM.
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Old 10-13-2011, 01:24 PM   #12629
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small correction greg the halloween classic is running 25.5 (as we did last year)

the indoor champs is the only event running 21.5
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Old 10-13-2011, 01:24 PM   #12630
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I ran/raced a VTA car for the frist time at last year's Halloween Classic and had an absolute blast. More fun and less stress than when I went to Vegas.

The level of competition for that race was second only to the USVTA Nationals and now Southern Nationals. Racing and running competitively with guys like Quinton Robbins, James Reilly and many others made it worth the trip as well as half the fun, not to mention lapping my son in 3 laps.

What I do think happened that weekend for some,was that they saw a new side to the USVTA formula and that it works. Now, I think VTA has become a staple class at the Gate as well as many other tracks that were struggling with classes and attendance. The tracks that are seeing a decline, imho, are tracks were the local fast guys may be bringing pressure for folks to move up and fill the ranks in the faster classes so there is more competition for them. Or, the RD's are offering way to many classes for the weekly program.

I forgot were I was going with this but I do concur, that if the "big races" offer VTA then they should offer it in USVTA format. So, no more Hannah Montana stickers boys, Pez heads are ok
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