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Old 11-15-2010, 06:59 PM   #9601
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One would think spec mode would be good enough but Tekin v208 kinda messed that up. And Speed Passion has a Cirtix Stock Club spec that does not have adjustable timing but also hasn't been approved by ROAR for the Sportsman class.


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Originally Posted by RCknight View Post
Are we talking about open speedos or are we talking about a spec mode? I just think LED lights showing it's in spec mode should be good enough. Personally I like to keep my class options open with one speedo. VTA is considered a starting class, so when someone wants to move on to a faster class they now need to buy a new speedo. Don't make sense to me is all.
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Old 11-15-2010, 07:02 PM   #9602
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VTA is not really just a starting class. The starting class is sportsman. VTA can be used as a starting class because of the speeds but I beleive it is truely more of a spec driving class. VTA is a great class to see where you compare to some of the better drivers in nearly identical equipment. It is also a class where you can learn to set up your car because you don't have to worry about what the latest motor and ESC combo is that you need to get to think you can be competitive.
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Old 11-15-2010, 07:22 PM   #9603
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Originally Posted by RCknight View Post
Are we talking about open speedos or are we talking about a spec mode? I just think LED lights showing it's in spec mode should be good enough. Personally I like to keep my class options open with one speedo. VTA is considered a starting class, so when someone wants to move on to a faster class they now need to buy a new speedo. Don't make sense to me is all.
That's part of the problem, there is no real "Standard" with the programable speedos, and part of what LRP called Tekin out on.

Intellectually, I like the idea of SPEC hardware. I also love the idea that probramable speedos CAN have a valid spec/zero timing mode and you can move up/over/whatever without an additional outlay of that all too rare thing called money!

Until, or unless, SPEC MODE can be easily validated, I understand why some classes allow ONLY non-programable hardware. It's not about being a modern Ludite, it's about limiting variables and avenues to cheat (intentional or unintentional). Just a matter of time before some tech weenie learns how to hack one of these programable speedos. Once that's out there on the web, the whole game of computer interface speedos is going to come crashing down. I don't care if Novak says it's never happened, that they KNOW of. LRP obviously figured out what Tekin was doing(wrong), and that's pretty darn close enough right there!

Face it. Every week, at every track, every time cash is paid to race, and ESPECIALLY if there are prizes.......SOMEONE is cheating, either intentionally or not, in big ways or not.

I also understand that there are bashers, hobby racers, sportsmen, and serious racers. Bashers will run whatever. Not part of this picture.

Hobby racers are going to see the lower initial investment of SPEC hardware and think it's a good deal, until they realize that they can't do ANYTHING else with most of it. From there, they have to decide are they going to be one car/one class or if they want to try their wheel on anything else and decide for some different hardware and forego SPEC altogether. They may come back to VTA once they mature into sportsman.

Sportsmen usually are just beginning to have one car per class, with lots of hardware options, and some experience in the racing scene and some skills. Either they came back to RC with the ease of SPEC and the lure of VTA, or expanded into it as another option(especially those of us with older, outdated chassis and equipment. Gave us a class without a lot of extra $$ out of pocket where the speeds are slower, racing is closer, and maintenance is easier).

Serious racers are generally matured sportsmen. They are usually the ones that ALWAYS have one car per class. They aren't tinkering with hardware as much as they're searching for that edge with the software. Unless they really adore the lure of VTA/RCGT slower type door to door type racing, they're generally NOT in this class. You'll find them in TC, WGT, 1/12....stock or mod. Since that's their game, swapping motors of the week, or ESCs of the week, or software of the week is really their game.

Not saying that there aren't serious racers in VTA, there are some damn fine ones (one trick ponies or not), just that at that level, it's understood that you play by the rules of the game season to season.

IT'S THE SINGER, NOT THE SONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's a dollars per smile issue. Truthfully, how many of you REALLY swap out motors and entire set ups to run different classes with the same chassis that having different modes in your ESC really matters? Stock TC to Mod TC I can see, but anything else........well, every time I see that, I see fail.

In the end, everyone votes with their wallet. Buy in or buy out.

Regardless of if you DO or DON'T like the national level rules, and it doesn't make your track/club money......RUN WHATEVER YOU WANT. 3 still makes a class at damn near every track in the country. Find 2 other buddies that think like you do, and burn up the track and prove everyone else wrong!!!!

You didn't PAY for this set of rules, did you?

Heck, at my local track, so many of us had old TC3s and TC4s and 27T motors that we added 27T motors in as legal and ran a local Muscle Car class all summer with either VTA tires or Jaco Blues (prefered on the carpet, as we're taking these cars BACK indoors for the winter), with plenty of turn out. Once we burn through all of our old motors, we'll convert to brushless. The mid step up with the same chassis has been RCGT and brushless. Damn fun, and the largest class by far at our Halloween trophy race that drew over 40 drivers from over 150 miles away, most racing 2 or more classes for the weekend.

To everyone in general: Do what's right for YOU and YOUR local club/track that keeps the lights on and the doors open. Remember, most tracks are owned and operated as FOR PROFIT businesses!!!!!!!!! But if the money doesn't come in the door and STAY, either you have to change or go somewhere else. Most of us don't have more than one option in town, so we play the game we have. But don't bitch to me when your equipment won't be legal at any other track or regional or higher level event when you want to play for a share of the prize money. But then again, if you're at that level, you're probably already set up with the right hardware and SPEC'd hardware won't affect you in the least!
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Last edited by Buckaroo; 11-15-2010 at 07:51 PM.
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Old 11-16-2010, 06:02 AM   #9604
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Originally Posted by H.N. View Post
+1 F1larry

We raced yesterday with the USVTA rules and all three heats had a different winner each time. Racing was real close. But the best part is when the guys went back to the pits there were no talk of speedos. They were actually tuning their cars. What??!? They were talking about camber link position, shock oil and etc. Back then the I would just see guys just breaking out their laptops. What's more funny is there is always that one guy with the worst handling car pull out his laptop dialing up his boost. Every time I see that it reminds me of the Real man of genius Budwieser commercial and sing to myself.

MR TEKIN ADJUSTABLE BOOST TUNER
So what if your car handles like sh*t turn up that boost.
I'm going to make that A-main

Seriously guys the rules that are out now is solid and it will be solid for years to come. What's going to happen let's say speedpassion comes out with a stock spec esc setting that are slightly faster than the tekin stock spec esc setting? You guess it, back to speedo wars again. Guys are going to be going back to the pits and whisper to each other and pointing to the guy that won. What speedo is he using? Come on guys real men tune cars and not speedo.
Hey, besides racing, tuning the speedo was the most fun I had in VTA. And 25.5 would be fine if Novak didn't have a monopoly....
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Old 11-16-2010, 06:41 AM   #9605
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Originally Posted by hairy View Post
This is the kinda stuff that keeps me from running vta and staying with t/c racing and all the vairables.

People are free to express their opinions aren't they? I mean this a country that was founded on free speech, right?

You don't like what they are saying , so instead of putting up a viable argument you tell them to shut up and go some place else.....real friendly!

Just MY 2CENTS!

That's probably why VTA is dead around here.

Wow another free speech speech from someone that's obviously clueless as to his own freedoms.

Just Wow.

What none of you get is it's very simple and basic, the rules are set and they are what they are. My god never seen such a large group of whinny little girls.

People are sick of the why you cant we do this? Read back a few 100 posts. I've been off of here for the summer, get back on to see what's going on and it's the exact same posts by different people.

Get over it, race the class or don't.

BTW the viable argument is simple Tekin 208. Done.
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Old 11-16-2010, 07:11 AM   #9606
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H.N. View Post
We raced yesterday with the USVTA rules and all three heats had a different winner each time. Racing was real close. But the best part is when the guys went back to the pits there were no talk of speedos. They were actually tuning their cars. What??!? They were talking about camber link position, shock oil and etc.
Now THAT'S what it's all about !! +++1
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Old 11-16-2010, 08:36 AM   #9607
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Originally Posted by TwoTone View Post
Get over it, race the class or don't. Done.


Man, did that ever need to get said!

The rules are not a majority rule kind of thing. There isn't a big vote coming up. Lobbying to use whatever it is that you think ought to be legal isn't going to change anything. USVTA is not a democracy. Even if it was, the rules wouldn't change because the vast majority of us like the rules just the way they are. You just don't hear us whining here because we are out racing our VTA cars and loving it.

Perhaps there should be a thread for folks to talk about why the rules don't work for them so the rest of us can talk about racing cars within the rules on this thread.
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Old 11-16-2010, 09:42 AM   #9608
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Originally Posted by robk View Post
There won't be a poop storm, just a firm "no".
And why is that ??? If someone other than Novak has the stones to make a 25.5 Why wouldnt it be allowed?
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Old 11-16-2010, 09:49 AM   #9609
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gris View Post
Hey, besides racing, tuning the speedo was the most fun I had in VTA. And 25.5 would be fine if Novak didn't have a monopoly....
The reason Novak has the "monopoly" is because USVTA tested some prototype 25.5 winds we built for them and asked us to make this special, custom wind for the organization.

The 25.5 motor is the most expensive both parts (copper) and labor that we make, but we offered a special, affordable system to USVTA without passing on these additional costs.

Uninformed comments, like yours, really annoy me...
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Old 11-16-2010, 09:50 AM   #9610
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gris View Post
Hey, besides racing, tuning the speedo was the most fun I had in VTA. And 25.5 would be fine if Novak didn't have a monopoly....
I hear you about tuning speedo, I was kinda half joking about that. I too like to mess with it but not in this class. This class to me it's about close racing, cool cars and not worrying about esc and motors. It's about running a clunky heavy body (but realistic) big ol' tires and tuning the sh*t out of it and squeezing the most corner speed out what you have to work with. It's about running clean lines and finding a spot in the track that you're faster than everyone else and setting up your car that it can practically drive itself. That's the challenge right there.
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Old 11-16-2010, 10:29 AM   #9611
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Originally Posted by TwoTone View Post
Wow another free speech speech from someone that's obviously clueless as to his own freedoms.

Just Wow.

What none of you get is it's very simple and basic, the rules are set and they are what they are. My god never seen such a large group of whinny little girls.

People are sick of the why you cant we do this? Read back a few 100 posts. I've been off of here for the summer, get back on to see what's going on and it's the exact same posts by different people.

Get over it, race the class or don't.

BTW the viable argument is simple Tekin 208. Done.

You sure put me in my place didn't you?
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Old 11-16-2010, 10:39 AM   #9612
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Default Our Constitutional guarantee of Free Speech

....isn't about bloviating on an internet forum; this protection restrains GOVERNMENT from punishing Americans for what they say or write or film.

Complaining or criticizing what someone posts has nothing whatsoever to do with anyones' right to "free speech". Time to drop this wounded accusation from responses.
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Old 11-16-2010, 10:44 AM   #9613
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My TT01 based 68 camaro built to resemble my 69. I'm waiting for HPI to release the 69 body so I can do a real replica down to the wheels....







The inspiration. My TA inspired 69.


And its no garage queen.





+ YouTube Video
ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.
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Old 11-16-2010, 10:47 AM   #9614
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Looks great Daign. Willow Springs is a great place.
Appreciate the change of convo.
Both sides need to take a break.
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Old 11-16-2010, 10:57 AM   #9615
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Originally Posted by hotrodchevy14 View Post
And why is that ??? If someone other than Novak has the stones to make a 25.5 Why wouldnt it be allowed?
There are about 9000 posts, been answer at least 100 times somewhere in there.

Have fun reading
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