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Old 01-04-2010, 03:39 PM   #7501
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If people really want to race, $70 for a refurbed Havoc is not going to be that big of deal. Look around next time at the track, if people want to do something, the money always seems to be there.

The guys with three matching chargers, vinyl skins on everything, an Xray T3 bought just for this class, a new 60c battery ("because my 50c doesn't have any rip"), and every blue and purple Much More product ever made shouldn't be complaining much. Obviously spending money on dumb shit is fun for most of us.

I think it sucks that the Tekin RS isn't going to work at "official" races, but 97% of the races are weekly club things, work it out amongst the guys you race with weekly. Bitching cross country with some guy you'll likely never meet isn't helping spawn new racers in your area.
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Old 01-04-2010, 03:42 PM   #7502
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it seems extremely narrow minded and damned foolish to have a company like Tekin that is willing to bend over backwards to help this class out be shut down by the power that be.

You are worried about teching the car at a race where you had what 45 entries, wow

Brilliant marketing in a recession, force people to spend more. Do you think you are actually going to actract more or less this way?
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Old 01-04-2010, 03:43 PM   #7503
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I do not mean to offend anyone
Really? Let's take a look on stop motion instant replay:

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This is only my opinion, but it seems extremely narrow minded and damned foolish to have a company like Tekin that is willing to bend over backwards to help this class out be shut down by the power that be. In these economic times we live in, the common sense thing would be to include as many as possible not exclude !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We are lucky to have the people we get now to show up and race and some in just this last month have bought a Tekin and now are told in 9 months they can't run it at all even with VTA specific software. I am sorry but I do not have the words to express just how stupid that is ! You are worried about teching the car at a race where you had what 45 entries, wow that would be a real pain if you had to look for a led in what 2 seconds. I go to races with 200 entries (summer points series, not club race) and we don't seem to have a problem teching vehicles there, and if someone was cheating, I'm sure one of the other 44 entries would call them out on it. I don't even run a Tekin in my VTA car and still can't believe how narrow minded this approach is. When a software update is free for the people that own them, forcing them to buy something else is just for lack of a better word senseless. I am sorry , I do not mean to offend anyone, but a little common sense goes a long way sometimes. I don't want to hear you have 9 months blah blah blah. It is still forcing people to pay more money to go slower needlessly if they already have something that works. Brilliant marketing in a recession, force people to spend more. Do you think you are actually going to actract more or less this way? Sorry for the rant.
What is your understanding of the word "offend" and of the words an phrases highlighted on the telestrator by our instant replay analyst?
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Old 01-04-2010, 03:48 PM   #7504
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Originally Posted by sportpak View Post
If people really want to race, $70 for a refurbed Havoc is not going to be that big of deal. Look around next time at the track, if people want to do something, the money always seems to be there.

The guys with three matching chargers, vinyl skins on everything, an Xray T3 bought just for this class, a new 60c battery ("because my 50c doesn't have any rip"), and every blue and purple Much More product ever made shouldn't be complaining much. Obviously spending money on dumb shit is fun for most of us.

I think it sucks that the Tekin RS isn't going to work at "official" races, but 97% of the races are weekly club things, work it out amongst the guys you race with weekly. Bitching cross country with some guy you'll likely never meet isn't helping spawn new racers in your area.
I agree for some the money isn't an issue. But here in Michigan some people are lucky to have jobs and have to scrape and give up other things to get to go race. If all tracks go by the official rules then everyone must pony up for a motor also which I did not mention earlier. So how is that going to bring in more people? Tell them they can run this for now and shell out more later, or just buy the slower motor now and get lapped umpteen times but be ahead of the curve?
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Old 01-04-2010, 03:51 PM   #7505
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It means you gotta have thick skin in this business. The reluctance to allow Tekins before anyone knew what they were willing to do is understandable. But to not allow them because people are what to lazy to look for a LED while teching seems a bit , well I think you get the drift.
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Old 01-04-2010, 03:54 PM   #7506
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Don't the rules say that it's ultimately up to the racers and management at a track to decide what is best for their particular situation?

If people at your track can't afford to change to the new rules, then don't. If you want to include products by company X, do it. It's as simple as that.

Or did that clause get taken out of the 2010 rulings?
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Old 01-04-2010, 03:57 PM   #7507
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If Tekin would or did make a Brushless ESC that had no boost and was not able to be hooked up to a computer or other device and be manipulated Iím sure it would be added to the list of approved ESCís. The fact is that they donít right now. Changing the software doesnít solve the problem when the software can be changed. If you canít see the reasoning for this change then really this might not be the right class for you to be racing in anyway.

Also donít forget that these rules can be changed to suit your local racing but at a USVTA event the rules will be followed and you must adhere to them. Local tracks and racers do whatís best for your local area to keep your track running and people walking in the door. Just know what the USVTA official stance is for the betterment of the class and as a national guideline.

ROAR sets up rules for all the classes how many of these rules are 100% of the time enforced at local tracks? They are notÖÖthey are used as the local track or racers see fit to keep racing going on, but at the same time they know what the ROAR rules are when they want to go to a ROAR event. Whats going on here with the USVTA isnít any different.
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Old 01-04-2010, 04:01 PM   #7508
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Originally Posted by cwoods34 View Post
Don't the rules say that it's ultimately up to the racers and management at a track to decide what is best for their particular situation?

If people at your track can't afford to change to the new rules, then don't. If you want to include products by company X, do it. It's as simple as that.

Or did that clause get taken out of the 2010 rulings?
Yes, your local track can do as they wish, but in Michigan and Indiana there are a few tracks a few hours from my house. Due to the tracks getting to do what they feel is best, just how coherent are the rules going to be from place to place. If one track goes with the 21.5 and the other goes with the 25.5, see the problem if you want to go to both. Or if someone had a Tekin and its ok at track A and wants to go with his buddies to track B. I may be the only one, and that is fine, but I see more problems than solutions with it.
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Old 01-04-2010, 04:03 PM   #7509
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I agree for some the money isn't an issue. But here in Michigan some people are lucky to have jobs and have to scrape and give up other things to get to go race. If all tracks go by the official rules then everyone must pony up for a motor also which I did not mention earlier. So how is that going to bring in more people? Tell them they can run this for now and shell out more later, or just buy the slower motor now and get lapped umpteen times but be ahead of the curve?
They could buy a Balistic as mentioned before. How does it bring in more people to stay the same?

21.5 with a good set up is running almost as fast as 17.5 so what's the point?
Why bother with VTA at all if it all stays the same?

Hell have any of you been reading the other TC threads? People are already talking about how much faster 17.5 is with the new Tekin update and already wondering if Stock should drop to 21.5.

I know it's a big if, but where would that leave VTA?
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Old 01-04-2010, 04:06 PM   #7510
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If Tekin would or did make a Brushless ESC that had no boost and was not able to be hooked up to a computer or other device and be manipulated Iím sure it would be added to the list of approved ESCís. The fact is that they donít right now. Changing the software doesnít solve the problem when the software can be changed.
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Old 01-04-2010, 04:07 PM   #7511
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You people just can't get over the fact that the Tekin with a computer could be changed back. Let me ask you this, when you go racing do you hire a security guard to stand at your pit space while you are on the drivers stand or do you use a little trust? If someone is hooking up a laptop to a VTA car where I race it is farely obvious because we all pit together. That may not be the case everywhere however but if someone was blowing the paint off of everyone else I think it would even be obvious to Ray Charles that some cheating was going on.
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Old 01-04-2010, 04:12 PM   #7512
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Without the boost, a 17.5 and 21.5 are different. When you have a 21.5 on steroids then yes its fast. I have no problems with having no boost or electrical (esc) timing advance. The problem is telling people they can't use it even when set up legally under the rules. Some tracks probably allow the boost, where I race they don't use it, but they play with it during practice and you can easily see the difference.
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Old 01-04-2010, 04:13 PM   #7513
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But why take any chances? That's the whole idea.

And you don't have to blow the paint off of other doors. Say I only had 5* of boost. My car would only be a little quicker, but I could just say the drivetrain is really free or I have a good setup and it's all cornering speed.
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Old 01-04-2010, 04:15 PM   #7514
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But why take any chances? That's the whole idea.

And you don't have to blow the paint off of other doors. Say I only had 5* of boost. My car would only be a little quicker, but I could just say the drivetrain is really free or I have a good setup and it's all cornering speed.
That is what the led is for. If you don't want to show people if they question it, then it is a sign of guilt.
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Old 01-04-2010, 04:15 PM   #7515
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Originally Posted by Lenman73 View Post
Yes, your local track can do as they wish, but in Michigan and Indiana there are a few tracks a few hours from my house. Due to the tracks getting to do what they feel is best, just how coherent are the rules going to be from place to place. If one track goes with the 21.5 and the other goes with the 25.5, see the problem if you want to go to both. Or if someone had a Tekin and its ok at track A and wants to go with his buddies to track B. I may be the only one, and that is fine, but I see more problems than solutions with it.
The solution is to follow the rules....period....then you know you are 100% with in the rules.....no gray areas.
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