R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Like Tree1Likes
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-03-2009, 09:32 PM   #6091
Tech Champion
 
Scottrik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Billings, MT
Posts: 6,212
Trader Rating: 245 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpt.America View Post
Nobody runs silvercan VTAs?
The problem with "Silver Can" is how FW runs them. There have been, oh, eight thousand or so distinctly different Tamiya-legal Silver Can motors over the years, and a few of the guys racing them there (in Tamiya classes at SIR and now the VTA at FW) have the mega-fast unit from a few years back. It is SIGNIFICANTLY faster than the currently available Silver Cans and you'll play hell trying to get one. I tried to get the powers that be to specify "2009 Tamiya / TCS legal Silver Can" but they won't do anything that makes sense like that where WORST case scenario is that someone who's using the "legacy" motor has to buy a new $15 motor. They just leave it as "Silver Can" which allows any of them in and their HP advantage continues.

These are not "doctored" or illegal motors, they're just a different spec from several years ago now. How much faster? I raced Minis with them and could stay right on them through the turns but was consistently pulled by 6 car lengths on both short-ish straights that were on the layout. That's a BUNCH in a "spec" class. And it ain't like my car was binding or anything--it was built to full TCS-specs with brand new bearings, etc. Anyone who knows me knows I'm the first to admit when I'm outdriven (which is often) but in this case we were plain being out-powered.
Scottrik is offline  
Old 09-04-2009, 05:35 AM   #6092
Tech Elite
 
rccardr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: The Secret Underground Laboratory
Posts: 2,353
Trader Rating: 8 (100%+)
Default

EZ solution #1: first night someone enters the class, their $15 race fee goes to buy a new motor, which goes into the motor bucket. Every week the drivers blind draw a motor out of the motor bucket and put it back at the end of the evening. No motor advantage, the track gets to keep the motors, and the only loss is the one-time driver fee to the track. Sinple, and it works.

EZ solution #2: Race director/track owner buys a set of red Dot 15K motors and uses them for handouts each week, returned at the end of the night. More expensive, but the cars will be faster and the motors are matched.

You are correct, Scottrik, those old 4-vent motors are WAY faster out of the box than the newer 2-vent Johnsons.
__________________
I've never lost.
I've just been a little bit behind when time ran out...

RED DOT MOTORS- Fastest Titan 12T and silver can 540 motors in the known galaxy!
rccardr is offline  
Old 09-04-2009, 04:24 PM   #6093
Tech Addict
 
jeeperscreeper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Idaho
Posts: 680
Trader Rating: 79 (100%+)
Default Newbie Question

#1 * 27t brushed/4-cell:
#2 * 17.5 brushless/4-cell:
#3 * 21.5 brushless/2 cell LiPo:

So which one of these is the prefered setup
jeeperscreeper is offline  
Old 09-04-2009, 04:30 PM   #6094
Con
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Brownsville Ont Canada
Posts: 178
Default

Most of the guys at my track have the 21.5/2cell.
Con is offline  
Old 09-04-2009, 05:15 PM   #6095
Tech Addict
 
jeeperscreeper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Idaho
Posts: 680
Trader Rating: 79 (100%+)
Default

is there an advantage with the brushless 17.5 with 4 cells
slower or faster 21.5 2 cell lipo?
could it be better or worse on a small tight carpet track?
jeeperscreeper is offline  
Old 09-04-2009, 05:39 PM   #6096
Tech Champion
 
robk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Macho Business Donkey Wrestler
Posts: 7,587
Trader Rating: 22 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeeperscreeper View Post
#1 * 27t brushed/4-cell:
#2 * 17.5 brushless/4-cell:
#3 * 21.5 brushless/2 cell LiPo: <<<<<<<<

So which one of these is the prefered setup
21.5
__________________
A mutually re-enforcing cascade of failure

"Failior [sic] crowns enterprise." Robert Goddard

I-Lap Scoring Systems http://www.rclapcounter.com/
robk is offline  
Old 09-04-2009, 05:49 PM   #6097
Tech Master
 
pejota's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vero Beach, FL
Posts: 1,022
Trader Rating: 12 (100%+)
Default

The typical consensus is that the 17.5/4 cell is a dog...

Try the 21.5 and set your FDR for 5.0

We race outdoors but the track is very tight and technical. We found that FDR to be a good starting point. Great punch out of the turns and decent speed down the straight.
pejota is offline  
Old 09-04-2009, 11:24 PM   #6098
Tech Champion
 
snoopyrc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Tunnel Hill GA
Posts: 5,046
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Anybody done any testing with 17.5 and five cells. Or is that too close to touring.
__________________
www.battlefieldraceway.com Racing videos at http://www.youtube.com/snoopyrc
snoopyrc is offline  
Old 09-05-2009, 12:48 AM   #6099
Tech Master
 
hound_dogs_01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,091
Trader Rating: 16 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pejota View Post
The typical consensus is that the 17.5/4 cell is a dog...

Try the 21.5 and set your FDR for 5.0

We race outdoors but the track is very tight and technical. We found that FDR to be a good starting point. Great punch out of the turns and decent speed down the straight.


5.0 is outside of USVTA rules... its got to be between 4.2 and 4.6....

Alex
hound_dogs_01 is offline  
Old 09-05-2009, 06:21 AM   #6100
Tech Champion
 
Scottrik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Billings, MT
Posts: 6,212
Trader Rating: 245 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hound_dogs_01 View Post
5.0 is outside of USVTA rules... its got to be between 4.2 and 4.6....

Alex
That is the "recommended range" for best performance in most situations. The "rule" is that the FDR has to be more than 4.2, so you COULD run 10.0 if you chose to do so.
Scottrik is offline  
Old 09-05-2009, 09:22 AM   #6101
Tech Champion
 
liljohn1064's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Deerfield, WI
Posts: 5,581
Trader Rating: 17 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottrik View Post
That is the "recommended range" for best performance in most situations. The "rule" is that the FDR has to be more than 4.2, so you COULD run 10.0 if you chose to do so.
Only for 21.5 right? I though no restrictions on 4 Cell.
__________________
John Higgins former student of The Ian Ruggles Negative Reinforcement Driving School. The "Team Principal".
liljohn1064 is offline  
Old 09-05-2009, 09:25 AM   #6102
Tech Champion
 
liljohn1064's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Deerfield, WI
Posts: 5,581
Trader Rating: 17 (100%+)
Default

For Myron:









Starting to show some wear, but still running.
__________________
John Higgins former student of The Ian Ruggles Negative Reinforcement Driving School. The "Team Principal".
liljohn1064 is offline  
Old 09-05-2009, 03:34 PM   #6103
Tech Elite
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: NY/FL
Posts: 3,376
Trader Rating: 24 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hound_dogs_01 View Post
5.0 is outside of USVTA rules... its got to be between 4.2 and 4.6....

Alex

Not quite right. The suggested fdr is 4.2 to 4.6. That's got more to do with typical track sizes and motor efficiency than anything else. As pejota stated we use 5.0 simply because our track is VERY technical and we've found that at that fdr we are running very equally against 27t/4cell cars.
Evoracer is offline  
Old 09-06-2009, 07:46 AM   #6104
Tech Champion
 
snoopyrc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Tunnel Hill GA
Posts: 5,046
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

I was just watching the Outlaw video from the last Snowbirds. (A-Main VTA) Realizing that all the guys in that heat are probably the best at their own local tracks, and no one is running with the timing eased back. Probably everyone is on 21.5/2s. It just seems to me that the pace was much quicker than what you see at a club VTA event. The other thing I noticed was that there was a lot of carnage for a Snowbird A-Main. The carnage IS about what you would expect from a club race. At least at the start, it did smooth out with some separation. I know a few of the drivers in that heat and they are the cleanest drivers that I personally know.
What I'm saying is that I realize this was the Birds and no one is going to hold back, but it sure did feel like it was too quick to be VTA.
__________________
www.battlefieldraceway.com Racing videos at http://www.youtube.com/snoopyrc
snoopyrc is offline  
Old 09-06-2009, 09:33 AM   #6105
Tech Champion
 
DARKSIDE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Nashville-Memphis
Posts: 8,568
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hound_dogs_01 View Post
5.0 is outside of USVTA rules... its got to be between 4.2 and 4.6....

Alex
Its is what is suggested...to get within the "ballpark"...but you cant go below the 4.2fdr...example..3.9fdr

Quote:
Originally Posted by liljohn1064 View Post
Only for 21.5 right? I though no restrictions on 4 Cell.
none...run it how you feel..

Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopyrc View Post
I was just watching the Outlaw video from the last Snowbirds. (A-Main VTA) Realizing that all the guys in that heat are probably the best at their own local tracks, and no one is running with the timing eased back. Probably everyone is on 21.5/2s. It just seems to me that the pace was much quicker than what you see at a club VTA event. The other thing I noticed was that there was a lot of carnage for a Snowbird A-Main. The carnage IS about what you would expect from a club race. At least at the start, it did smooth out with some separation. I know a few of the drivers in that heat and they are the cleanest drivers that I personally know.
What I'm saying is that I realize this was the Birds and no one is going to hold back, but it sure did feel like it was too quick to be VTA.
thats the word I got as well..the drivers are all fast...but the cars seemed way to fast to be VTA...this is also why we started the restrictions on speed. If the cars feel like TC on rubber, than its not VTA....the VTA class should have a completely different driving experience...much like when we run 10.5 buggy compared to open 4wd buggy(4.5)..it should feel and look like a different class...we have to find a way to slow the cars down to show a different class of racing, and not just bodies and rims/tires...
__________________
Myron "BATTMAN" Kinnard
Team Associated/Reedy Powered/PROTOform/OTT/1UP
Apex Raceway and Hobbies
1172 Park Ave, Murfreesboro, TN 37129
DARKSIDE is offline  
Closed Thread

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Georgia Vintage Trans Am Racing shadow102 Georgia Racing 725 02-24-2012 09:56 AM
Vintage Trans Am Scottrik Electric On-Road 47 02-24-2012 08:21 AM
Vintage Trans-Am TC hlpressley R/C Items: Wanted to Buy 5 10-23-2008 04:00 PM
Thursday Vintage Trans Am racing at Victory in Green Bay Brian F Wisconsin & Illinois Racing 13 05-10-2008 08:37 AM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 04:43 AM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net