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Old 01-12-2009, 06:41 PM   #3901
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I think what Tire Chunker was trying to get at and someone else reinforced above, was that the 21.5 motor lipo combo makes everything else obsolete, if one of the other options was even close, someone would have run it, even if it's more "work" or tuning to do so... Everyone was running that cause it's the fastest, not cause of the "easyness" of Lipo....
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Old 01-12-2009, 07:17 PM   #3902
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No, it's more work to be fast with the other motors. That is why everyone thinks the 21.5 is faster, if your car is not on point with the other motors you will never make it up to the 21.5
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Old 01-12-2009, 07:36 PM   #3903
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Originally Posted by Ffejdat View Post
I think what Tire Chunker was trying to get at and someone else reinforced above, was that the 21.5 motor lipo combo makes everything else obsolete, if one of the other options was even close, someone would have run it, even if it's more "work" or tuning to do so... Everyone was running that cause it's the fastest, not cause of the "easyness" of Lipo....
It makes the other combos obsolete because of the lack work involved, not because it's faster.

BTW I have 2 brand new 4600 packs for my Slash's, got them at the end of Sep, take good care of them and don't abuse them, a week ago a cell vented.
Buying lipos for the Slashs too.

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Old 01-12-2009, 08:19 PM   #3904
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Thanks for the kind words Doug, hopefully we'll see you Saturday for the Hurricane race, if not......definately in April for the T/A Nats.

As far as the width question goes, this weekend was probally the highest traction you'll ever find on carpet. I actually narrowed my car to tuck the tires farther under the body and make the suspension react quicker and more consistantly. By Sunday the traction was insane, but I was able to fight it with shock oil/shock positioning.

I believe everyone used the 21.5/lipo combo for the Novak race. I'm positive everyone in the top 10 did. In my opinion, it's not that one is faster/slower that the other....I think everyone has had enough of cycling batteries and risking exploding one in the pits. Sunday for example, would have taken at least four top quality 4-cell packs alone(one for practice and one for each main). With lipo, I used the same battery all day/every day and never had to worry about it.

Chassis wise I'm running a older original TA05R with the stock plastic chassis, Matt is running a TA05-IFSR. We both used the HPI Camaro bodies but the top 10 was a good mix of Camaro's, 'Cuda's, and Mustangs.
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Old 01-12-2009, 08:48 PM   #3905
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Thanks for the kind words Doug, hopefully we'll see you Saturday, if not definately in April.

As far as the width question goes, this weekend was probally the highest traction you'll ever find on carpet. I actually narrowed my car to tuck the tires farther under the body and make the suspension react quicker and more consistantly. By Sunday the traction was insane, but I was able to fight it with shock oil/shock positioning.

I believe everyone used the 21.5/lipo combo for the Novak race. I'm positive everyone in the top 10 did. In my opinion, it's not that one is faster/slower that the other....I think everyone has had enough of cycling batteries and risking exploding one in the pits. Sunday for example, would have taken at least four top quality 4-cell packs alone(one for practice and one for each main). With lipo, I used the same battery all day/every day and never had to worry about it.

Chassis wise I'm running a older original TA05R with the stock plastic chassis, Matt is running a TA05-IFSR. We both used the HPI Camaro bodies but the top 10 was a good mix of Camaro's, 'Cuda's, and Mustangs.
You wouldn't happen to have a setup sheet that you were using for the TA05R.
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Old 01-12-2009, 09:26 PM   #3906
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So now my question is this. What exactly does the "Spirit of VTA" mean?

This is the last paragraph of the official rules.......

MOST IMPORTANTLY: If it's not in the rules, and does not encompass the spirit of slower, controlled racing with realistic looking cars, consider it illegal. This is called the "Spirit of VTA" Rule. The class is based on slower, equal playing field competition with less traction, minimal aerodynamic aids and mostly older carpet racing technology. The final objective is close, fair, wheel-to-wheel racing for all. All decisions of the race promoter or track owner are final.

Slower.........Equal playing field and OLDER racing TECHNOLOGY are really not being applied to this class. It's been said more than once in here that the NEW technology is faster than the old. I thought that the whole idea from this class was to be slower.

Sure not trying to get everyones blood pressure rising here...........just trying to find out how this is a slower and equal playing field in the "Spirit of VTA"
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Old 01-12-2009, 09:31 PM   #3907
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well for starters the class is slower than regular rubber tire and as far as older tech goes that includes the chassis as well,not just motor/battery.
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Old 01-12-2009, 09:49 PM   #3908
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This class is slow enough that I have to make sure my setup is perfect to run well. To be competitive I have to take time to practice and gear for the track. I run 21.5/lipo because I don't want to have to cut a com or change brushes or discharge and charge cells between rounds. This isn't the only class I run. I typically set up 2 cars for 2 classes as I have a 10 year old that likes to race, but isn't exactly a mechanic yet (I can wish anyway). Its bad enough trying to get lipos back on chargers and run back out to marshal. I still have to deal with cleaning tires and checking the glue beads and making sure my camber and toe are correct. Most times its still a scramble up to the line for one class or the other. Most times I don't even get to watch my son race unless he's in it with me. To anyone who runs 27t, I know your car can and will be faster. To the 17.5 guys, enjoy the challenge as I know the better drivers can pull it off. If my britches get so big that I don't see the fun in this class, I hope someone gives me a reality check.
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Old 01-12-2009, 10:02 PM   #3909
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does anybody know if the VTA rules will ever allow any roar approved 21.5 B/L motor as they do with the 17.5?? I know that when the VTA was probably started that novak was the only one to have a 21.5 available.. just wondering??
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Old 01-12-2009, 11:11 PM   #3910
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And they all said, Just shoot me!

Ahem Uh Jon as far as I know there are no ROAR approved 21.5 motors. But that was Yesterday. Today might be differrent.
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Old 01-13-2009, 04:48 AM   #3911
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does anybody know if the VTA rules will ever allow any roar approved 21.5 B/L motor as they do with the 17.5?? I know that when the VTA was probably started that novak was the only one to have a 21.5 available.. just wondering??
i take it you HAVEN'T read thru this thread at all???????

Save yourself some time, save Doug some hair and read that damn thread - especially the last 5-10 pages...its all in there about a motor change...

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Old 01-13-2009, 04:59 AM   #3912
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i take it you HAVEN'T read thru this thread at all???????

Save yourself some time, save Doug some hair and read that damn thread - especially the last 5-10 pages...its all in there about a motor change...

You must not know Doug .... He doesnt have much hair these days to pull.

Sorry Doug, I had to try to make a funny (at your expense) to forget about all this MADNESS.

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Old 01-13-2009, 05:42 AM   #3913
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does anybody know if the VTA rules will ever allow any roar approved 21.5 B/L motor as they do with the 17.5?? I know that when the VTA was probably started that novak was the only one to have a 21.5 available.. just wondering??
Jon, Novak is the spec 21.5 motor for this class. Even the Novak 21.5 does not show up on the ROAR approvals page. As this class is run outside of ROAR, that will never change.

To everyone that doesn't understand and doesn't know the history of this motor: What most people don't get and SW Tour has brought up many times in various threads is that the 21.5 was created solely as an oval motor for those not wanting to set land speed records. It was found a viable alternative to what was on the market and the other two motors used by this spec. The Novak 21.5 was ADOPTED by USVTA and added to our spec rules set. Pretty simple.
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Old 01-13-2009, 05:54 AM   #3914
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I have an idea. When anyone asks about motors they get ignored. No response, no answer, just forget it was even said. At least that will cut down on the pointless banter that has taken over this thread.
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Old 01-13-2009, 06:25 AM   #3915
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Originally Posted by Mikey M View Post
So now my question is this. What exactly does the "Spirit of VTA" mean?

This is the last paragraph of the official rules.......

MOST IMPORTANTLY: If it's not in the rules, and does not encompass the spirit of slower, controlled racing with realistic looking cars, consider it illegal. This is called the "Spirit of VTA" Rule. The class is based on slower, equal playing field competition with less traction, minimal aerodynamic aids and mostly older carpet racing technology. The final objective is close, fair, wheel-to-wheel racing for all. All decisions of the race promoter or track owner are final.

Slower.........Equal playing field and OLDER racing TECHNOLOGY are really not being applied to this class. It's been said more than once in here that the NEW technology is faster than the old. I thought that the whole idea from this class was to be slower.

Sure not trying to get everyones blood pressure rising here...........just trying to find out how this is a slower and equal playing field in the "Spirit of VTA"
The 'Spirit of VTA' shows when 2 older tub chassis cars take top place at a large race.

The 'Spirit of VTA' is in the slower cars, I've watched the other classes, can't imagine trying to race with those guys after so many years off.

The 'Spirit of VTA' is allowing new Lipo/Brushless combo that is equl to older tech, but allows more people to be competitve for a lot less money. 27t/NiMh can be faster tha 21.5/lipo but you have to work for it.

USVTA wouldn't be the cheap class it is if it were just 27t/NiMh- that would require, motor lathe, Dyno, race packs blah blah- been there no thanks, but it's not to say if you still have all that equipment you can't compete- that's plainly not true.
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