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Old 01-09-2008, 09:51 AM   #706
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Originally Posted by Jeff Cuffs View Post
Hey dawn quick question. I talked to dale from protoform about body thickness on the touring cars. He sent out acouple of emails to roar and received no response. How do u feel about mandating a min body thickness?

Jeff - that is not true. I received those emails just yesterday and will receive the bodies tomorrow in shipping. Dale and I have spoken in length regarding this as I have spoken to Parma. Also, I had a long conversation with Proline yesterday.

I believe we are finding a solution and it is a topic of discussion at the Excom level currently.

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Old 01-09-2008, 10:08 AM   #707
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[QUOTE=convikt;4055741]
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Retooling at the moment, but you'll see me soon and well get it on
You boys settle down. The Losi will have you both out at the tool shed for a good whoopin'.

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Old 01-09-2008, 10:33 AM   #708
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You boys settle down. The Losi will have you both out at the tool shed for a good whoopin'.

Ben
so what happens when I show up with a Losi as well
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Old 01-09-2008, 11:55 AM   #709
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Originally Posted by Scottrik
AND, if you can't stand the added competition in a POSSIBLY slightly de-powered class there is always whatever the replacement for 19T ends up being.
Believe me, if we had a 19t class that is where I would be. However I will not say you don't make good points, Mr. Stormer makes good points as well, heck almost everyone who has posted has made a good point. My problem is I can't get past the contradictions.

What is the point in slowing the motors down? The consensus; easier for newcomers to drive, and create more competition. But Dawn is saying that these rules are for the big races, that clubs should continue to run what is right for them, which invariably means that a portion of the clubs will continue with the 13.5, now how does that help the newcomers. If you really want to help those people you should advocate to the clubs that they follow the rules, and it is always easier to get people to follow rules that they like. The best idea has already been posted.

Make the 13.5 the lowest level for big races, then compile a set of rules for the novice classes and encourage the clubs to implement them. But regardless, as I said before, I will buy what I need to race, so if the 17.5 becomes the low level class, then push it for everyone not just the big races. We need consistency.
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:14 PM   #710
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Make the 13.5 the lowest level for big races, then compile a set of rules for the novice classes and encourage the clubs to implement them. But regardless, as I said before, I will buy what I need to race, so if the 17.5 becomes the low level class, then push it for everyone not just the big races. We need consistency.
We need consistency. So the 17.5 or 21.5 won't be raced at a regional or national level, but without the guidence from ROAR local clubs will be developing "odd" rules that in the end cost racers more to participate. I would rather have one spare BL motor in my Pit box than have to have 5 or 6 motors: 18.5, 15.5, 23.5, 20.5 ect...I would rather just have to keep a spare motor for a class above or below my perfrered racing class so when I travel I can be almost certian I will be racing without the need to visit the LHS.
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:24 PM   #711
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We need consistency. So the 17.5 or 21.5 won't be raced at a regional or national level, but without the guidence from ROAR local clubs will be developing "odd" rules that in the end cost racers more to participate. I would rather have one spare BL motor in my Pit box than have to have 5 or 6 motors: 18.5, 15.5, 23.5, 20.5 ect...I would rather just have to keep a spare motor for a class above or below my perfrered racing class so when I travel I can be almost certian I will be racing without the need to visit the LHS.
That is it exactly. This isn't a problem for those stay at home race guys or for people that don't run a track. But for people who travel and track owner/managers it will inevitably become a problem without standardized rules.

I can run this motor at my track, why can't I run it here?
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:31 PM   #712
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Johhny... Bravo about the square brick in the round hole!

Fact, 95% of all laptops use 18650 sized Lithium Cells (Millions of cells)
Fact, Dewalt 36V Powertool line uses 26650 sized Lithium Cells
Fact. Black&Decker VPX powertool line uses 18650 sized Cells
Fact. Bosch Lithium Drivers use 18650 size cells
Fact KillaCylce worlds fastest EV and EV Bike uses 26650 sized cells
Fact Falcon EV Scooters use 26650 sized cells


Why would industries perfer to use a set size Cylindrical cell? It reduces cost! Having a fixed size limits the amount of retooling and needed re-enginnering accross the board. The fixed size would allow R/C car makers to work on the geometry and handling of the car rather than how to make the next batch of "bricks" fit the car.

Why are soft cells good, they can be made to fit unique aplications for small production runs where long-term cost are not assocaited. IE: cell phones, Mp3 players and yes R/C airplanes. Because the shape of these devices are changing rapidly the battery must be able to adapt with that shape.
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:33 PM   #713
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Dreaded double post!!!
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:37 PM   #714
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Originally Posted by trailranger View Post
Johhny... Bravo about the square brick in the round hole!

Fact, 95% of all laptops use 18650 sized Lithium Cells (Millions of cells)
Fact, Dewalt 36V Powertool line uses 26650 sized Lithium Cells
Fact. Black&Decker VPX powertool line uses 18650 sized Cells
Fact. Bosch Lithium Drivers use 18650 size cells
Fact KillaCylce worlds fastest EV and EV Bike uses 26650 sized cells
Fact Falcon EV Scooters use 26650 sized cells


Why would industries perfer to use a set size Cylindrical cell? It reduces cost! Having a fixed size limits the amount of retooling and needed re-enginnering accross the board. The fixed size would allow R/C car makers to work on the geometry and handling of the car rather than how to make the next batch of "bricks" fit the car.

Why are soft cells good, they can be made to fit unique aplications for small production runs where long-term cost are not assocaited. IE: cell phones, Mp3 players and yes R/C airplanes. Because the shape of these devices are changing rapidly the battery must be able to adapt with that shape.
Because the A123 cells don't conform to any known standards within the RC industry that every manufacturer is already conforming to.
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Last edited by timmay70; 01-09-2008 at 12:38 PM. Reason: nice post for a BRUSHLESS THREAD, btw.
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:41 PM   #715
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OK, OK I got it the first post. LOL

I have no facts, but.

There is about a million flashlights out there that use round cells.
About a billion remote controls for god only knows what that still use round cells.

I'm in agreement that soft Lipo is probably more applicable, but I still believe, for this hobby, maybe we should leave well enough alone. JMO

I still see the Euro side of racing going 5 cell, and not Lipo.
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:48 PM   #716
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Because the A123 cells don't conform to any known standards within the RC industry that every manufacturer is already conforming to.

I think you missed the point.

First A123 does not own the exclusive rights to all 26650 cells produced!

Second the change over from NiMH will require designing new chassis no matter what brick can be made to fit into the round hole.

Choosing a standard size cell that other industires are using will
1. Ensure a stable supply of cells
2. Ensure the future development of the cells
3. Achieve longterm reduce cost in the production of the cells
4. Allow R/C car makers to focus on the geometry and handling
5. Alieviate the constant shape shifting and CG conficts that "Soft" cells create
6. Reduce the over all cost in our HOBBY
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:52 PM   #717
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Originally Posted by Johnny Wishbone
I'm in agreement that soft Lipo is probably more applicable, but I still believe, for this hobby, maybe we should leave well enough alone. JMO
Have you used a lipo yet? The only problem with them is making weight. I will admit, had I not used them I would be content with sub-c nimh cells. But I can't for the life in me convince myself I haven't used them.
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:54 PM   #718
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[QUOTE=convikt;4055895]
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so what happens when I show up with a Losi as well
then you'd be officially 'downgraded' to crazy
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:58 PM   #719
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Here is something to consider

Horizon distriubutes A123 (26650 sized cells). I would assume it is because they plan on using this cell size in future. Maybe they plan on making RTR's26650 compatible so they can sell more batteries and make more money. They are a business, so why would want to carry a product that does not make money?

First it will be Traxxas, then Losi and then other car makers will be making 26650 compatible cars and trucks so bashers can take their VXL equipped rustler down the street for a 70mph speed run.

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...odID=AQR400063
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Old 01-09-2008, 01:11 PM   #720
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Have you used a lipo yet? The only problem with them is making weight. I will admit, had I not used them I would be content with sub-c nimh cells. But I can't for the life in me convince myself I haven't used them.
I have but never have and never will use them, why bother, there will be a lot of cheap used equipment out there shortly, or at least according to some and I'll still be able to buy my round cells. So what if they don't last the next 2 years, the shrink wrap will be so tatered, I'd change them just for the sake of changing them anyways.

Much like a brushless motor, similar to a Pringle potatoe chip, bet you can't have just one.
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