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Old 10-16-2007, 02:48 PM   #46
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Any idea how much it will cost? Im would guess between he 3200 adn the 4800 but im probally wrong. Why is the 3600 bigger and will it fit in a hara cycloen without mods?
Bigger capacity = bigger case. It should fit in the Cyclone.

As for price if I had to guess it will cost what the 4800 does but they will drop the cost of the 4800. Unless they fear that would cause too much confusion (the one with the bigger # costing less).
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Old 10-16-2007, 04:22 PM   #47
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Get 'em while they're cheap... This is a pretty good deal, right?

http://www.speedtechrc.com/store/ebp...id=516&id=6297
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Old 10-17-2007, 05:20 AM   #48
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I think thast about $10 cheaper than normal.
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Old 10-17-2007, 06:09 AM   #49
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I'm curious how much the C rating matters when you're only loading the battery at 5C or 10C or whatever. What I mean, is, does it matter more to mod racers than stock, since they put the batteries under more load? Or, does a higher C rating mean the batteries will hold more voltage under all loads, including the smaller ones. It's not clear to what extent, if any, it really means to the layman that's just running them with slow motors in club races.

I've heard it said before that C is mostly a marketing term, and is way too ambiguous (especially between different manufacturers) to really mean anything. I wish we had a way to test LiPo that could really tell the story about how the cells will react on the track in different styles of racing. I'm not convinced the standard 35A discharge like we use with NiMH is the best way.
I don't think the C-rating is a marketing term. The C-rating lets us know what the MAX possible discharge current available is. The 3200= 20C rating, which can provide up to 64amps of current in short bursts. The 3600 batt = 25C and provides up to 90amps of current in short bursts. If we keep going, the 4800 = 15C and provides 72amps of current in short bursts.

Without the C-rating you would not know how much amperage a battery could provide. Known amperage can be important when running modified motors.

For Stock Racing - 27T or 13.5 BL, a 3200 only uses about 1/2 a charge for a 5-min race, so the amperage draw is obviously low.

The new 3600 is probably a newer type of cell as someone else stated, or it was designed to meet the needs of modified motors, as it provides more current than the 4800 batt, while the 3200 and 4800 provide close to the same, just different run times.
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Old 10-17-2007, 08:54 AM   #50
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In context, though...if the system only flows 10 amps,it only flows 10 amps...it doesn't matter if the battery can flow 90. It may be slightly (SLIGHTLY) better after some time, but if it's a high resistance load, the "maximum" capacity of the battery really doesn't matter much.
Joe, see if this makes sense to you... remember Volts = Current x Resistance.

So you won't flow 10 amps if resistance is higher internally in the battery. Instead of producing current it will be used as heat instead. Remember, the driving force (ability to deliver punch) is determined by the battery's Volts under load. That is where IR comes in... lower IR = higher average V under a given load (say 10A). Said another way, the motor can't PULL what the battery can't PUSH.

Try some old NiMH2 batteries (say Sanyo 3000) with about 100 internal resistance per pack instead of 10. The old batteries will deliver an average voltage about 1 V lower at even a modest load like 10 amps. By contrast a new pack in good shape will deliver 7.5 V under modest load.

Take the same old pack and run your 4.5 brushless on it. The batteries will get so hot in very short time they melt the plastic. Performance is lousy, no punch, lower top speed, in short, they perform like a 4 cell pack.

The same thing happens to a lesser extent when you run a lower C rated cell of the same capacity. Punch will be less.

If what you said was true, then you could say, "the speed limit is 55. Why buy a Ferrari, when I can buy a YUGO, they both only have to go 55 mph". While it is true both will let you run the speed limit, one definitely has more "punch" getting up to speed. However the case of batteries the higher C rating should also give slightly higher top speed.

Remember that the starting current from zero to 10,000 or 20,000 rpm in a heavily loaded motor (on starting line grid) is much higher than the average. So the amp draw is really quite high... which is why a very low IR battery will have tremendous "punch" off the line and out of the corners. If my thinking is correct, then a 25C should have less voltage drop-off, less internal resistance, and therefore more punch and a little more top speed capability than a 20c cell.

The one thing I'm still wondering about is whether there is more to the "C" rating than internal resistance... hoping somebody from Peak/Orion can tell us ???
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Old 10-17-2007, 01:20 PM   #51
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C'mon now...LOL...I have at least a handshake relationship with Mr. Ohm and his law.

I know that in the RC world EVERYTHING is important and EVERYTHING matters greatly...but really...if you think a stock motor from a dead start will tax even a lowly 15C pack...then I can begin to subscribe to your beliefs. I don't think it will though.

I never said it wouldn't be any better for anything, I said that for most people running stock or 19T stuff...or off-road...there's no way you could objectively tell the difference if every other factor is held the same.

Onroad mod...who knows? More likely...but I don't run that and I don't foresee myself running that in this lifetime. It's a fast crowd around here.

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Originally Posted by swopemike View Post
If what you said was true, then you could say, "the speed limit is 55. Why buy a Ferrari, when I can buy a YUGO, they both only have to go 55 mph". While it is true both will let you run the speed limit, one definitely has more "punch" getting up to speed. However the case of batteries the higher C rating should also give slightly higher top speed.

The one thing I'm still wondering about is whether there is more to the "C" rating than internal resistance... hoping somebody from Peak/Orion can tell us ???
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Old 10-17-2007, 02:40 PM   #52
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C'mon now...LOL...I have at least a handshake relationship with Mr. Ohm and his law.

I know that in the RC world EVERYTHING is important and EVERYTHING matters greatly...but really...if you think a stock motor from a dead start will tax even a lowly 15C pack...then I can begin to subscribe to your beliefs. I don't think it will though.

I never said it wouldn't be any better for anything, I said that for most people running stock or 19T stuff...or off-road...there's no way you could objectively tell the difference if every other factor is held the same.

Onroad mod...who knows? More likely...but I don't run that and I don't foresee myself running that in this lifetime. It's a fast crowd around here.
Joe,

Sorry, didn't mean to offend re: ohm's law, not everyone knows it. I make the opposite mistake too often, assuming everyone is an engineer my wife in particular.

I agree it's not a major difference, but I think it will be palable when you drive. The reason I say this is, I can feel the difference in older cells with high IR vs newer ones with low IR.

But, without data, this debate can go on forever. Until someone tests this, I'll give up for now !

Cheers,
Mike
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Old 10-20-2007, 12:43 AM   #53
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when will the 3600 hit the market?
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Old 11-01-2007, 08:14 AM   #54
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Looks like these should be out before Christmas. Tower just showed up a listing for them.

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXTMY9&P=7
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Old 11-01-2007, 09:42 AM   #55
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My comment was more aimed at what ever happened to the weighted LiPo. But thanks...
Orion told us that they put the plans aside for the weighted lipo...don't count on one any time soon .
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Old 11-01-2007, 09:47 AM   #56
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Orion told us that they put the plans aside for the weighted lipo...don't count on one any time soon .
Hmm wonder why? Then the person who can sell a steel lipo tray that will fit most cars will be able to sell a few.
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Old 11-01-2007, 10:11 AM   #57
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http://www.rctech.net/forum/showpost...&postcount=270
http://www.rctech.net/forum/showpost...&postcount=275

If you build it...
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Old 11-01-2007, 11:01 AM   #58
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http://rctech.net/forum/showpost.php...postcount=2259

Great minds think alike...lol.
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Old 11-01-2007, 11:24 AM   #59
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Very nice! Some of the sedan folks need the pieces that go into the cell slots to help keep the battery from sliding around, at least with flat packs. That won't work so well with the tall ones like the Orion where topdeck clearance might be an issue, though.
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Old 11-01-2007, 05:05 PM   #60
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THAT'S what i'm talkin' about!!!

Do you have any more in stock??? I'm ready to but one now.

For my TC5 with a high top deck this will work!
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