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Old 10-02-2007, 09:15 AM   #16
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These guidelines are PERFECT for club racing, and as such, should be enforced at that level. Anything above that, IMHO it would be a difficult to tech what is stock and and what is not on 10 different chassis.

If a racer will commit to going to a regional or National race, then they can still run thier tub chassis.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleighty View Post
Just an idea, but couldnt you have each manufacturer submit a budget chassis e.g T2R for homologation. Then only those homologated cars are allowed to be raced as standard?

For example:
Xray T2R
Losi JRXS-R tub chassis
Hot Bodies Cyclone S

Then only allow set up changes, e.g springs, shock oil, camber, toe, gearing

Only allow differentials perhaps, no spools or one ways.

A proper stock or sport class could be created if someone could be bothered with the regulations and it could potentially be very cheap.
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Old 10-02-2007, 09:15 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by RaceAce701 View Post
well lets just say such a rule came into affect
all of the mid pack stock racers (that would be me) who alreday spent 400+ on a chassis (like a cyclone, tc5, mI3, typ r ECt) and parts would have 2 shell out more cash for a new chassis just to keep running stock
Well, there's always somebody who would buy your current car on eBay, then you'd parlay that into the proposed "ROAR Stock TC chassis kit". But the real question you raised is, "Would you really enjoy racing a car that is less capable than the one you just sold?" Keep in mind, you'd be racing a car that is very equal to the one the guy next to you has and overall would be cheaper without the constant flow of upgrade/hop-up parts. (see my last post)

What'cha think?
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Old 10-02-2007, 09:30 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by Greg Sharpe View Post
Well, there's always somebody who would buy your current car on eBay, then you'd parlay that into the proposed "ROAR Stock TC chassis kit". But the real question you raised is, "Would you really enjoy racing a car that is less capable than the one you just sold?" Keep in mind, you'd be racing a car that is very equal to the one the guy next to you has and overall would be cheaper without the constant flow of upgrade/hop-up parts. (see my last post)

What'cha think?


im on the fence i guess yes id love racing a lass capable chassis and working on my setup more (which is my favorite part) so you have a good point

Id probibly just move up to 19 becayse i love my cyclone to mych to part with it but i would like 2 try the cyclone S


well Im still on the fence come on roar step up to the plate and lets make some changes first off is a bump up and out type program
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Old 10-02-2007, 09:31 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by Greg Sharpe View Post
Keep in mind, you'd be racing a car that is very equal to the one the guy next to you has and overall would be cheaper without the constant flow of upgrade/hop-up parts. (see my last post)

What'cha think?
Don't we already do that??? Who on here would say that ANY of the top brand cars are not as equal as the next right out of the box! I am talking carpet setup to carpet set up and Asphalt to asphalt!

The current HIGH END cars do not need Hop-ups.

If you buoght a Xray US spec and I have a Corally PHI US SPEC you are saying that we are not racing "equal" cars???

Now I am confused!


Also with your idea, I race at 3 club tracks that can only pull in about 10-15 ppl on a good day. EVERYONE runs stock because thats just what EVERYONE signs up for because of the low turn out vs having 2-3 in stk, 3-4 in 19t and 1-2 in mod. Bigger class is more fun right?

Say my track doesn't run by ROAR rules (one doesn't), and I can run my RDX PHI there in stk. But at the ROAR nationals I want to run stk....I now need another chassis to run that class. You just doubled my racing cost!

Something to remember racing of any kind is not CHEAP! Yes you can scale it down, but its still going to be too expensive for SOMEONE!!

Also something to rememer is not all Chassis companies offer lesser chassis...BUT stk. is the biggest selling point for them.

So know you would force these companies to offer two types of chassis, that is going to double the R&D cost for them, who do yo think is going to pay for that in the long run??? The consumer, thats YOU!

Also why would you want to take racing BACK a step in limiting chassis designs to something that was done 4-5 years ago?
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Old 10-02-2007, 10:33 AM   #20
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Greg, YGPM
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Old 10-02-2007, 10:49 AM   #21
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We are trying to sovle this problem here in Tn, Oct 14 we are starting a touring breakout class no lap faster than "X" amount will be counted. This way a guy who bought his stuff second hand off ebay and the guy who just dropped $1500 at a hobby shop can run each other and not be in the way of the faster guys and gives them a chance to win, instead of being blistering fast and trying to hang on it's about being steady and keepin' it off the pipes. This way whatever you run you can move up with or run regular stock when you're ready.

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Old 10-02-2007, 10:59 AM   #22
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I like Slieghty's proposal. Its straight forward and simple. Nobody said for engineering to stop like some people suggested. This idea was to put a cap on the retail value or street price of chasis for this class.

Like Slieghty stated each manufacturer can submit a chasis for approval.
Heck if some one can produce a carbon fiber twin deck with alluminum bulk heads then it should be allowed if it falls within the set price.
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Old 10-02-2007, 11:01 AM   #23
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I have an interesting observation.

Stock TC racing is killing this SPORT. Look at the recent IIC in Vegas. The top 10 Stock Foam guys out spend the top 10 MOD Foam guys in:
1. cost of Motor preparation
2. Chassis preparation
3. Time to prep car
4. Time and cost to test and find the last 1/1,000 sec. in speed.
5. Equipment and supporting technologies.

It is like saying NASCAR cost more to operate than F1.

A highly skilled driver can readily go out a buy off the shelf a 3.5 BL motor and a battery and have a chance of running up front in the MOD class. Stock motors and batteries are not available off the shelf comparatively.


My son is considered a newbie by time comparision standards. I found it cheaper and more "balanced competition" to:
1. Upgrade from a hopped up TA05 (Tub chassis) to a XRAY T2.
2. Run Brushless and Lipo where allowed.
3. Run 19T instead of Stock 27T when available. Usually, there is only a STOCK class (where all the fast guys get great pleasure in winning every time ).
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Old 10-02-2007, 11:45 AM   #24
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Of course drivers wouldnt want to sell their $400 top spec cars a week after they had got them. Thats why you give them a years notice before introducing the class, then they have the choice of changing to a sport chassis OR moving into 19turn or Modified with their $400 chassis.

Heck its just a suggestion, im from the UK so i dont have any say when it comes to ROAR but i do feel that the problem with this hobby/sport is the lack of fresh blood and to bring those new drivers in, you need a lowish cost entry class.

Put it this way, why not try it out? the drivers that dont like it will move into 19turn or Mod, the ones that like it will stay in stock and make it work. If it doesnt work in 2 years then you can change it back, perhaps into full brushless stock!

Somewhere needs to try a sport class like this, otherwise we are stuck with the same old problems year after year.

just my 2 cents
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Old 10-02-2007, 11:47 AM   #25
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One thing that I could possibly support is increasing the weight of the cars but only if as a way to improve durability and not to decrease costs.

I'm not against bringing costs down, but why is a $200 tub car acceptible and a $450 carbon fiber car suddenly unacceptable?

There are already some very competitive cars under $200 already out there.

Most racers actually have more invested in their electronics than their cars. Should we also reducue the costs of the radios, servos, escs too?
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Old 10-02-2007, 11:57 AM   #26
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My first "National" event was in early 2004, the same top guys that were running in the stock "A" main at that race are still running the stock class at a "National" event in late 2007.
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Old 10-02-2007, 12:01 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by barnacle View Post
My first "National" event was in early 2004, the same top guys that were running in the stock "A" main at that race are still running the stock class at a "National" event in late 2007.
Dobbs,

My point exactly.

"The problem is not the chassis'. The problem with stock is the "same" ole guys keep winning and are not moving on. Modified may not be the answer, but 19 turn sure is a good alternative. Keep the factory modified guys out of 19 turn and let the fast stock guys move on. If modified is the answer their needs be an open modified class with a 10 turn motor limit and a Factory Modified class that is unlimited. These type of things will get the current fast stock guys to move on and make way for new "fast stock" guys.

If you win a ROAR stock event you should be forced out of stock. If you podium three times (2nd or 3rd) you should be forced out.

I also think brushless should be looked at a little harder. Much cheaper in the long run. Easy to tech with a meter. But, 13.5 is not the answer. We have proven it 100 times that a 13.5 is and can be faster than a stocker. I did some testing with a 17.5 and ran the same lap times as I did in stock. Brushless just takes a "BIG" gear and they can be faster. Brad Johnson just won stock at the IIC and I guarantee you he would have went a "lot" faster with a 13.5.

This post was a little off topic, but I truly believe it is something ROAR needs to consider for onroad stock racing......"
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Old 10-02-2007, 12:04 PM   #28
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Quote:
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My first "National" event was in early 2004, the same top guys that were running in the stock "A" main at that race are still running the stock class at a "National" event in late 2007.

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Old 10-02-2007, 12:07 PM   #29
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I would have to agree with RBLove, I have only been racing for a few months since June/July of this year. We have a pretty big club race every other week about 50-60 people show up. It seems that Stock TC class gets bigger every week, and the winners are not moving up into the class with the faster guys but just hanging out and stock and whooping a$$. We have people come from out of town and put in a 27T motor, to run stock. This sounds like BS to me, why would you run in MOD/19T in your home town then come to my race track and slap in a 27T so you can run stock. Suppose to be the MOD class is where the bragging rights come in at.
Yeah so you whooped a$$ running stock this week, great for you!! You could have placed 3rd or 4th, running MOD/19T and not have to buy yourself a 27 turn. It would be like NASCAR drivers going back down to dirt track to kick butt.

I don't think mandating a "STOCK" chassis would help at all but make more people not want to get into it, because you can only but this "chassis" or that one.

I personally bought my car off of ebay last year, for about 100 bucks and upgraded what I needed to to be a little more competitive.
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Old 10-02-2007, 12:18 PM   #30
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I will have to agree with my good friend RBLove. I have been racing since about 2000 and the exact same guys that were winning stock national events are still doing the same thing. I am one of those guys that at a club level have decided to run 19t as opposed to stock to allow some of the other guys to have their day in the sun. When they are ready they can move up just like some of us have. Nationally it should be the same.
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