Phoenix - The CEFX C12 is Reborn!!
09-22-2007, 08:37 AM
#17
Looks Cool Josh, can't wait
09-22-2007, 09:43 AM
#18
Looks good
But when will we see a cefx with out a t-bar, like crc?
But when will we see a cefx with out a t-bar, like crc?
09-22-2007, 01:52 PM
#19
Nice job Josh.
See you in a few at Vegas.
Take care.-Bruce
See you in a few at Vegas.
Take care.-Bruce
09-22-2007, 02:38 PM
#20
Nice Josh,
I'm going to have to quit my day job so I can come and race.
Looks like I need a new cefx ride, yeah buddy!
James
I'm going to have to quit my day job so I can come and race.
Looks like I need a new cefx ride, yeah buddy!
James
09-22-2007, 02:39 PM
#21
new brushless cefx
hey all:We got specific cars and chassis for both carpet and asphalt racing who would have ever thought we'd need seprate cars for brushed and brushless.Good luck with the car and team josh at the iic and beyond 
Last edited by b-man777; 09-24-2007 at 03:25 PM.
10-17-2007, 02:50 AM
#23
Tech Adept
I like you t-bar design, but if you made the pods shorter like Ass. CRC
Since you have a longer arm (pods) will not this gyro effect be bigger on the long pods you are using ?
Is the shorter t-bar a attempt to make it work better with the longer pods ? in BL
Alf
10-17-2007, 12:08 PM
#24
HappyHippo - A lot of people have asked me about this but it hasn't really even been something that has crossed my mind. I have a few ideas for a completly different style/system for the rear end of a 1/12 car but until just the other day I still had a few things that I just couldn't work out (in my head). My 6+ hour drive to Cinci for the BRL oval race (traffic sucks!!) left me some free time to think and I've got some ideas on how I could make it all work. Right now, I'm quite happy with the current cars we have so I don't plan on working on it for quite a while. We have a lot of other projects in the works and those need to be focused and finished first.
Reilly - Sounds good!! I should have kits together at the shop this week as I just need to finish up some instructions for the car.
beyond - Thanks! I normally run the PF Speed 12 if the bite is low-med. If it's med-high then I'll run the Parma Speed 8 (old type). I only brought the PF to Vegas but I really wish I would have had a Parma to try there. Normally, we use 1.72 rear with 1.66 fronts with the new Jaco Prism's. With the old Jaco 2-Stage we would run 1.64 front with 1.68 rears.
alf - If we made the pod plates shorter like AE or CRC then you can't fit the larger spurs/pinions like we wanted to. Especially in the age where most club racers here in the US are running 10.5, 13.5 and now 17.5 brushless with spur/pinions in the 40-50t range with a 78-96 spur... With the origional C12, the pivot was already moved back to a similar position to AE/CRC with the longer pod plates. The problem was that most people were using an AE t-bar in the car which did make the pod have a very long arm - resulting in less traction and very bad rough track handling as it also had terrible shock geometry with the AE t-bar. We should have never put the optional holes in the chassis to allow the use of an AE t-bar. Now, the Phoenix has a new t-bar that has the pivot pushed back even further so the pod is shorter than all the others reguardless of the pod plates along with correct shock geometry as the C12 Evo2 has when using the CEFX t-bars... The t-bar is the exact same distace from pivot to pivot as an AE t-bar. It's just pulled way back to shorten the "arm" as you put it.
Reilly - Sounds good!! I should have kits together at the shop this week as I just need to finish up some instructions for the car.
beyond - Thanks! I normally run the PF Speed 12 if the bite is low-med. If it's med-high then I'll run the Parma Speed 8 (old type). I only brought the PF to Vegas but I really wish I would have had a Parma to try there. Normally, we use 1.72 rear with 1.66 fronts with the new Jaco Prism's. With the old Jaco 2-Stage we would run 1.64 front with 1.68 rears.
alf - If we made the pod plates shorter like AE or CRC then you can't fit the larger spurs/pinions like we wanted to. Especially in the age where most club racers here in the US are running 10.5, 13.5 and now 17.5 brushless with spur/pinions in the 40-50t range with a 78-96 spur... With the origional C12, the pivot was already moved back to a similar position to AE/CRC with the longer pod plates. The problem was that most people were using an AE t-bar in the car which did make the pod have a very long arm - resulting in less traction and very bad rough track handling as it also had terrible shock geometry with the AE t-bar. We should have never put the optional holes in the chassis to allow the use of an AE t-bar. Now, the Phoenix has a new t-bar that has the pivot pushed back even further so the pod is shorter than all the others reguardless of the pod plates along with correct shock geometry as the C12 Evo2 has when using the CEFX t-bars... The t-bar is the exact same distace from pivot to pivot as an AE t-bar. It's just pulled way back to shorten the "arm" as you put it.
10-18-2007, 02:32 AM
#26
Tech Adept
Thank you Josh
Sow since the BL motors are making less movent in the rear, you are trying
to lock down the rear with a shorter t-bar and moving the movent back to make
it less. Right ?
First don't get me wrong i like BL Motors the low maintenance
but it is virtual impossible to get the motor to do what
i what, lets say you run on a very small track with low to - medium , traction
and the track layout is they way that you go to almost a dead stop in three off
the corners. Then you have to run a 4.5 to get enough bottom end (torque) but the
back straight is very short and you have al this power impossible to get a clean
run and the car steering poor since the motor are puling so hard, with a brush this
are easier to get to work.
And you have to run a receiver battery with BL.
And the torque in the high RPM in BL are virtual ripping the diff to rubbish
What do you think ?
The Las Vegas track, was a very big track Markus Mobers told me that is was huge
and made for touring cars.
This are probley something you like to keep for you self but
maybe i will like to update my car to the t-bar design that you have made
the day i make a BL version off my car if you don't mine but my t-bar is 19 mm wide in my car.
Josh my car is a concept car and not for sale in any store, i purchase a mill and
have learn how to use it, it is fun to se the CNC run :-) and i work together with
a boy in the US, i have Somme ideas that may interest you, i don't now :-)
I'm sorry i'm not trying to make noise in you posts, it you feel i do pleas let me now and i will delete it.
Alf :-)
Sow since the BL motors are making less movent in the rear, you are trying
to lock down the rear with a shorter t-bar and moving the movent back to make
it less. Right ?
First don't get me wrong i like BL Motors the low maintenance
but it is virtual impossible to get the motor to do what
i what, lets say you run on a very small track with low to - medium , traction
and the track layout is they way that you go to almost a dead stop in three off
the corners. Then you have to run a 4.5 to get enough bottom end (torque) but the
back straight is very short and you have al this power impossible to get a clean
run and the car steering poor since the motor are puling so hard, with a brush this
are easier to get to work.
And you have to run a receiver battery with BL.
And the torque in the high RPM in BL are virtual ripping the diff to rubbish
What do you think ?
The Las Vegas track, was a very big track Markus Mobers told me that is was huge
and made for touring cars.
This are probley something you like to keep for you self but
maybe i will like to update my car to the t-bar design that you have made
the day i make a BL version off my car if you don't mine but my t-bar is 19 mm wide in my car.
Josh my car is a concept car and not for sale in any store, i purchase a mill and
have learn how to use it, it is fun to se the CNC run :-) and i work together with
a boy in the US, i have Somme ideas that may interest you, i don't now :-)
I'm sorry i'm not trying to make noise in you posts, it you feel i do pleas let me now and i will delete it.
Alf :-)
10-18-2007, 12:32 PM
#27
Alf - I have met you before at other races and I know you are a good guy with good intentions so it's no problem. We have spent a lot of time (and graphite/fiberglass) making and testing cars. I rather not go into details too much as half the fun of designing/testing the cars is learning what each thing does and how it effects performance. Plus, why give all the information away for free. Buy a Phoenix and tell me what you think. 
Corally Man - I'll work on some today.
Corally Man - I'll work on some today.
10-18-2007, 12:49 PM
#28
Suspended
Will there be a limited "Mo" version?
Where upon a sub-par performance and effort, all the radio gear and motor will be ejected and the car will vanish into thin air?
Where upon a sub-par performance and effort, all the radio gear and motor will be ejected and the car will vanish into thin air?
10-18-2007, 01:16 PM
#29
Hey Josh have Angel post that order as a request for funds through my paypal address [email protected] hope to see it soon, thanks for the quick response yesterday!!
Roger Thenhaus
Roger Thenhaus
10-18-2007, 03:49 PM
#30
Tech Adept
Thank you Josh
I agreed with you the testing and lering how thing works
are what have be driving me all the time, and i hade you car
at the worlds at the us and i don't mine try it again.
And i have som ideas about the BL effect that i need to test
to, the good thing with it is that it will be impossible to see
it, but i'm sure you will understan if you holde the car on a table :-)
keep up the good work, and i love 12 scale you now that :-)
looking forward to see pictures off you car.
Thanks
Alf
I agreed with you the testing and lering how thing works
are what have be driving me all the time, and i hade you car
at the worlds at the us and i don't mine try it again.
And i have som ideas about the BL effect that i need to test
to, the good thing with it is that it will be impossible to see
it, but i'm sure you will understan if you holde the car on a table :-)
keep up the good work, and i love 12 scale you now that :-)
looking forward to see pictures off you car.
Thanks
Alf
