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Old 09-19-2007, 01:52 PM   #121
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No, "Newer, faster, and more runtime" is a BATTERY thing. It was with NiCads, it was with NiMh, and it is with LiPo's. It's called technology.
OK, I'll bite. Tell me - what makes your packs faster? C rating doesn't tell you how fast you are going to go just how much voltage it can safely supply. Do you have any information available regarding voltage under load you can show so we can compare?
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Old 09-19-2007, 01:53 PM   #122
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What are you talking about?
From what I gathered. Right or wrong he said SMC uses a cell made by Wath. He use to use a cell made by vislero which he didnt like but has been pleased with his yuntong lipo pack. I dont think english is his native language.
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Old 09-19-2007, 01:56 PM   #123
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That's another reason we as consumers are wary of companies that don't disclose the source of their cells. I'm not saying that's why they do it, but it certainly crosses one's mind.

It's no secret that wholesale Kokam cells are quite a bit more expensive than the Chinese variety, but nobody seems willing to admit this. They all think they're getting the greatest deal of the century because they got a LiPo for cheaper.
Here we go again... Kokam might be more expensive than SOME other batteries, but not all. Honestly, we pay A LOT for these packs. They aren't some cheap crap.
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Old 09-19-2007, 01:57 PM   #124
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I used to but now work for Reedy. Although I do consider myself the "father" of the hard case LiPo battery for R/C cars as it was my ideas and concept that made its way to the market.

Anyway, If you are afraid of weight you are a little misinformed. If you were to use a Lipo (any) in Touring cars, you would find that you would have to add between at least 3 -4 ounces to make the minimum weight. And the weight should be added to the battery. Actually a case made of lead instead of plastic would be most desirable.

In off-road cars, weight distribution changes so much with LiPo that even though the cars meet the minimum weight, weight is added to retain the cars optimum balance and improve handling.

LiPo does have a tremendous advantage in that for a given capacity, it weights much less. But with today's car designs the advantage is non-existant. It is LiPo's other qualities that make it desirable.

BTW I have raced since 1982 and never used a NiCd/NiMH battery with a plastic case.
Rick, thanks for bringing your insight and wisdom to this thread. Its certainly going to be interesting to see what Reedy does in this space now but we will save that for a different thread.
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Old 09-19-2007, 01:58 PM   #125
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I think we should all agree that the hardcase should be only a User Option and Should Not be a RULE!!!!

Let those that have the paranoia use the hardcase and those of us that don't want to use a hardcase be our choice!!!

Glad to see Li-pos are here and are the future of RC Racing!
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:02 PM   #126
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Ok so these packa re no good becouse they aren't in a hard case, they are going to blow up and destroy cars, there are no good lipo's that are in shrink wrap.

You have assimilated me. NOT EVEN!!!!

I am not saying that the weight makes a difference, since the current packs are heavier. But looking into my glass ball I see lower weights and lipos everywhere r/c cars are raced. Eventually it all about speed, not the current legal weight. I would rather be able to run the weight where I want it, not where a battery manufacturer deams I should.

Also you guys are already concerned about the batteries fitting into the cars becouse of the hard plastic case. Anyways hard case battery owners and the people who sell them should be worried, these new cells are going to make them obsolete to the guys who race lipo already.
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:06 PM   #127
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Since everyone's taking the gloves off

1) Soft lipos should never be used with a cf chassis.

2) The reason why I won't buy a SMC lipo isn't because it doesn't have a built-in fuse, hard case, or that SMC isn't disclosing which cells they're using. It's actually due to the fact that I clearly remember Danny from SMC doing his fair share of bashing lipo on rctech before SMC jumped on the lipo bandwagon.

To all the Johnny-Come-Latelys who have been bashing BL and lipo and then expect us to buy their BL stuff and lipo batteries: Good luck with that.

You all have been reported and this thread will be closed.
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:10 PM   #128
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Originally Posted by or8ital View Post
From what I gathered. Right or wrong he said SMC uses a cell made by Wath. He use to use a cell made by vislero which he didnt like but has been pleased with his yuntong lipo pack. I dont think english is his native language.
How about...wrong! Please refrain from posting innacurate speculation. I have never heard of "Wath". Your credibility has just been eliminated. I thought you just misspelled "what".
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:14 PM   #129
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Here we go again... Kokam might be more expensive than SOME other batteries, but not all. Honestly, we pay A LOT for these packs. They aren't some cheap crap.
I believe you, because I believe that SMC values its reputation and wouldn't put crap out there and risk it. Other, lesser-known companies don't have a reputation to worry about. That's the challenge we face as consumers, and why this conversation is happening at all. So far, the response on your part has been rather defensive, which I think is unfortunate, because most people here are being extremely kind and fair, with a few annoying exceptions.
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:14 PM   #130
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Originally Posted by Leodis View Post
Since everyone's taking the gloves off

1) Soft lipos should never be used with a cf chassis.

2) The reason why I won't buy a SMC lipo isn't because it doesn't have a built-in fuse, hard case, or that SMC isn't disclosing which cells they're using. It's actually due to the fact that I clearly remember Danny from SMC doing his fair share of bashing lipo on rctech before SMC jumped on the lipo bandwagon.

To all the Johnny-Come-Latelys who have been bashing BL and lipo and then expect us to buy their BL stuff and lipo batteries: Good luck with that.

You all have been reported and this thread will be closed.
That will teach us!
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:17 PM   #131
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SMC- if the case cost pennies, then why didn't you add it in a pack that costs $152.99 retail? You can have a removable case so the racer can decide if they want it or not, especially if they want to run at a club that only allows encased lipos. If you price your pack the same as the orion pack that uses kokam cells and has a plastic case, (top of the line in safety!!!!), then you say how much faster it is, you are clearly selling it based on speed and nothing else other than the smc name.

Bigmike, I don't know how else to say this again, nimh cells are in a STEEL TUBE, they don't need a plastic case around them. Your argument doesn't make any sense. Exposed lipos are protected by SHRINK WRAP and FOIL. Batteries in cordless phones are protected by the Phone, and the li-ion batteries in phones are still in a plastic case. Airplanes and helicopters are in an environment where every gram counts because they are FLYING, plus unless you crash, I don't think another plane will sideswipe your plane.

This argument comes down to those who want safety above all else vs those who want speed above all else.

I'll say it again, make everyone run 3.5 brushless with lipo and speed won't be an issue because the cars will be uncontrollable.

SMC- I know you are trying to sell a product, and are now defending the features in version 1 of your pack regardless of anything else, but I personally will not buy a lipo pack for a CAR that is not in a case. Not so much because it is safer, but because it is too prone to being damaged, and at $120-$150, it is too much money to throw away in case of damage.

1 more thing, SMC is a battery matching company who's bread and butter is matching cells. Please don't say SMC is as good as kokam and orion at LIPO until you have the same track record they do.
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:18 PM   #132
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I believe you, because I believe that SMC values its reputation and wouldn't put crap out there and risk it. Other, lesser-known companies don't have a reputation to worry about. That's the challenge we face as consumers, and why this conversation is happening at all. So far, the response on your part has been rather defensive, which I think is unfortunate, because most people here are being extremely kind and fair, with a few annoying exceptions.
Consider my comments directed at the annoying exceptions- they know who they are.
I always get defensive about my companies. I thought everyone knew that. I'm always butt-hurt about something. It keeps me motivated.
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:19 PM   #133
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I bet if you think back real hard you remember the plastic cases on the nicd batteries.
Did you really just try and call out THE Rick Hohwart? I saw that dude wheel a dead cat to an A-main victory at SoCal!
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:21 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by Craps View Post
I think we should all agree that the hardcase should be only a User Option and Should Not be a RULE!!!!

Let those that have the paranoia use the hardcase and those of us that don't want to use a hardcase be our choice!!!

Glad to see Li-pos are here and are the future of RC Racing!
Craps, I love what you're doing with the enduros but I gotta tell you - the fact that even when you are trying to be reasonable you can't layoff insulting others really gets old.

I have never once called you careless, ill-informed or even retarded. The fact that I have chosen Orion packs in no way means that either I am paranoid or you are a careless retard.
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:22 PM   #135
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Originally Posted by billjacobs View Post

1 more thing, SMC is a battery matching company who's bread and butter is matching cells. Please don't say SMC is as good as kokam and orion at LIPO until you have the same track record they do.
Did I say this or are you trying to start more shit?
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