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Old 09-20-2007, 11:22 AM   #241
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How about answering my question...where did I say I was opposed to hard case LiPo's?
BTW- we do have an exclusive. They are not entertaining other R/C companies. We are very proud of our supplier. So, yes everything you "speculated" on was wrong.
Did you ask me that question (hard case)? Im not one of the people pushing the hard case. You have me confused with somone else. Im the one pushing for something that says it is a safe battery. I saw what you said on the first page the day your wrote it (about the hard case).

I said you had an exclusive (based on what you said earlier). I also said I dont care who your supplier is. But those that want to know probably wonder why if there is no risk of someone else using your supplier, and you are proud of them, then whats the risk in sharing who it is?
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Old 09-20-2007, 11:24 AM   #242
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Jack, I may be reading the last 3 years worth of LiPo threads here incorrectly, but I really don't think that people are up in arms about the lack of hard cases for themselves, but what we ALL face within national and international acceptance of LiPo batteries (which has been frustratingly difficult for LiPo proponents). We all worry about an unprotected pack failure or rash of them to become what is known of this technology to the mindless masses who know only what they have seen on YouTube of LiPo batteries.

We worry about a mainstream soft case pack potentially setting LiPo acceptance back 5 years in an instant.


Call it irrational, uniformed, bashing or "hating" but the questions asked so far are reasonable ones in the LiPo world (which in case you haven't noticed is VERY different from the NiMh world), and to this point, you haven't answered any of them.

Sorry, but "it's faster, better, cooler and more top secret than everyone else" just doesn't cut it for any thinking R/C racer.
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Old 09-20-2007, 11:26 AM   #243
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Would that company appreciate it if perhaps I "speculated" to OSHA that you have some safety violations. Same thing. You may not care, but I bet the owner would.
Actually we have been safety certified so OSHA doesnt have to come in to check on us. All I have asked is what methodolgy you used to certified the safety of your cells. The fact that you cant answer how you determined they were safe suggests to me perhaps you didnt. I dont know that to be the case but thats how it appears to me.
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Old 09-20-2007, 11:29 AM   #244
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Just so everyone is clear since Jack isnt. Ive said it before but I have no knowledge of SMC and any speculation on my part is just that, speculation. I have not said anything about their product that should be considered fact. The only thing I have asked about but is constantly ignored is how the cells were determined to be safe.
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Old 09-20-2007, 11:34 AM   #245
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Actually we have been safety certified so OSHA doesnt have to come in to check on us. All I have asked is what methodolgy you used to certified the safety of your cells. The fact that you cant answer how you determined they were safe suggests to me perhaps you didnt. I dont know that to be the case but thats how it appears to me.
You missed the point. Nevermind. I think most people will understand.
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Old 09-20-2007, 11:42 AM   #246
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This is crazy. If SMC is putting out Li-Po battery packs and is willing to put their name on the cells then you can pretty much count on these products being up to their strict standards.

Just my 2cents,

No kidding !

SMC has been know for selling the "best" for a long , long, time.....
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Old 09-20-2007, 11:45 AM   #247
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This is just speculation on my part:With that said does the name of a company give us a lot of confidence in a battery or does documentation of thats companies safety give us the confidence? In my opinion keep the name, give us the data!
Would you like to other companies to get a hold of your "ace" supplier, too? SMC has to be careful to devulge their secret- they paid lots of money and invested a lot of time and research into this to now come and divulge their battery and chemistry so some other volture gets an easy connectiona dn tries to sell similar packs...give them a break...

By the way, it seems like you're from John Stranahan school of lipo...the way you ask to devulge checmistry or source of cells/manufacturer- that's John Stranahan classic
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Old 09-20-2007, 11:48 AM   #248
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You missed the point. Nevermind. I think most people will understand.
Im going to drop off this thread. I think Ive been "blamed" for some things others have posted. We obviously disagree on the approach to sharing safety data. Definately all within your rights to not share. I wish you luck in this lipo thing. Dont let mine or anyone elses posts discourage you. At the same time though I wouldnt brush the people of RcTech off. While they may not represent a majority of your sales they are consumers none the less, entitled to their buying decisions and trying to become as informed as they can in their purchasing decisions.
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Old 09-20-2007, 11:49 AM   #249
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Would you like to other companies to get a hold of your "ace" supplier, too? SMC has to be careful to devulge their secret- they paid lots of money and invested a lot of time and research into this to now come and divulge their battery and chemistry so some other volture gets an easy connectiona dn tries to sell similar packs...give them a break...

By the way, it seems like you're from John Stranahan school of lipo...the way you ask to devulge checmistry or source of cells/manufacturer- that's John Stranahan classic
Last post I swear. But to clear this up. If you read my post I dont want to know the supplier (others do). I just wanna know they are safe. If you read Jack's post he said they have an exclusive relationship.

Just wanted to clear that up.
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Old 09-20-2007, 11:58 AM   #250
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Originally Posted by Jack Rimer View Post
How about answering my question...where did I say I was opposed to hard case LiPo's?
BTW- we do have an exclusive. They are not entertaining other R/C companies. We are very proud of our supplier. So, yes everything you "speculated" on was wrong.
The few guys that are asking for the packs info/data are usually fans of Dr. John Stranahan, originator of the Pantoura Pancar thread and the newer "TC5, Lipo, Li-Ion nanophosphate, tips and tricks"...Dr. Stranahan has been testing lipo's for over a year, from Maxamps and thunderpower, and the APogee lithium manganeese cells...he has extensively reported his findings on them and the cycle life and many other helpful info on them. He has not tested Orion lipos. Some have caught fire, some gone bad, and he posts findings...one common thing he does is ask kokam or orion or Maxamps to divulge their packs chemistry or source- to know which pack has which characteristic or more likely to catch flames if something goes wrong...these guys here posting on these threads asking similar questions have learned a page or two from Dr. Stranahan and are avid fans of his research and posts and wish to know the same info( I'm also a fan JS)...in the end they just want to make it safer for all...the "roudy" ones posting and demanding aswers from you on the battery safety on this post mean well, I'm sure. They are just frustrated...cause thye are not getting satisfying answers from you.

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Old 09-20-2007, 11:59 AM   #251
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Personally, I could care less who makes the cells. Just as a for instance, Cadillac makes great cars but they did make the Cimmaron.

The best way for all of the manufacturers to show that their cells are safe is to show the industry standard test results. These are normally the overcharge, overdischarge, and puncture tests.

Orion has already shared this info for the Kokham cells and I think Apogee has as well.
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Old 09-20-2007, 12:04 PM   #252
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By the way you and every other person on this forum use my companies products everyday.
Let me guess...shower curtain rings!.....No........Darn!
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Old 09-20-2007, 12:04 PM   #253
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I can believe that they are safe becouse smc puts there name on it. When honda came out with a hybrid did everyone ask questions about safety, no they didn't it was a honda, avery safe a reliable car. Just like SMC makes very good batteries, why should these be any less. If there name is on it, that means something to me.

If SMC's name was replaced with company X, this thread would of died in the first 2 pages. It is this big becouse people know of thier quality Sub C packs, and their matching system. I have faith that they have an awesome pack.

Thanks go out to Danny and Jack for jumping into the Lipo arena and taking there hits. I for one can't wait to see where they take lipo in the years to come.

I can say this, after dealing with orion for the past two days over my carbon charger, they have awful customer service compared to other companies. And I also contacted SMC before this thread started about these cells, my emails were returned within a coulple of hours and answered all the questions I had. So when it comes time for me to spend more money, I will go with the company that actually goes out of their way to help me, not the company that promises to call me back and doesn't.

SMC has earned my business over the years. I will continue to support them as long as they do business the same way.

Thanks again for introducing another quality choice in the lipo scene.
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Old 09-20-2007, 12:05 PM   #254
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Jack, you have officially entered spin mode, and are no longer being fair or rational with your answers, or our concerns. You're ignoring the valid points made and focusing on negativity instead of answering legitimate questions. I officially withdraw my support for or interest in your products until you can respond to reasonable questions with reasonable answers.
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Old 09-20-2007, 12:09 PM   #255
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Jack, you have officially entered spin mode, and are no longer being fair or rational with your answers, or our concerns. You're ignoring the valid points made and focusing on negativity instead of answering legitimate questions. I officially withdraw my support for or interest in your products until you can respond to reasonable questions with reasonable answers.
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