R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-17-2007, 01:36 PM   #61
Tech Elite
 
macnkitty2002's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Montgomery, AL
Posts: 4,920
Trader Rating: 7 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Even if I do everything right with my own batteries, the guy next to me might not and his blows up and shrapnel heads my way. We are packed really tight in the pits. Why not use batteries that are safe rather than keep pushing the limits? It really comes down to driving afterall.
good point. isn't that why we still have a stock and 19 turn class? if not everybody would be racing 6 turn modified and sailing their 007's into orbit.
__________________
Team Associated RC10B4.2
Losi Rock Rey
macnkitty2002 is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 01:44 PM   #62
Tech Addict
R/C Tech Charter Subscriber
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Indiana
Posts: 579
Trader Rating: 8 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to acyrier
Default

...on topic...

It seems that the exploding batteries seem to be IB's. Anybody had any EP's explode on them?
acyrier is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 01:45 PM   #63
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 227
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to TurboT
Default

One of the guys I race with had one of his EP cells blow up. Very nasty.

It seems that all the companies that are pushing the limits of their packs are having problems.

I'm thinking of going back to GPs just because I never had any problems with them. They're probably the toughest batteries out there, if a little down on voltage to the other guys.
__________________
Team Great Hobbies
Team Durango Canada
Exotek
TurboT is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 01:53 PM   #64
Tech Master
 
timmay70's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,701
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craps View Post
Really makes you wonder with all this info about 4000+ mah ni-mh if the battery cell manufacturers have gone too far for the sake of safety by packing those cells with too much capacity for the size of cell and also not allowing for the abuse RC cars/trucks/buggies present to them with them packed so tightly.
I bet if you were to follow Intellect's advice, you would hardly ever have battery failure problems. Racers will use any methods to extract every little bit of power from their equipment when a title is on the line. That is the way it is. If charger Mfgs followed IBs charging advice, their chargers would only go up to x amps. Even with the Sanyo 1200sc cells, the labels from the factories were always warning not to charge over a certain rate.

People pushing the limits have to know that there will be failures. People that gear their their cars up to be competitive know that there is the danger of missing the apex and shattering parts on their cars. People marshaling know that if they step out on the race track, their ankle is at risk of getting smashed into. People waking up in the morning know that there is a grave danger that they could die that day from natural or un-natural phenomena. It's also a sad fact of life that people do not want to accept accountability.
__________________
Speed Merchant Rev7, Tekin, TQ Racing (wire), Team Tamale
RC Excitement - Buy where you race, support your local tracks.
ROAR #105242
timmay70 is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 01:59 PM   #65
Tech Addict
R/C Tech Charter Subscriber
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Indiana
Posts: 579
Trader Rating: 8 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to acyrier
Default Not to second guess but....

I noticed that there are some matchers out there doing 40A matching..(thanks to new equipment) but...

Not only are WE pushing the limits of the cells w/the type of charging/discharging, but is it possible that by matching at higher amperages were doing damage upfront?

I agree w/the "weeding out of the weeker cells" and all, but at what point is too much?

While I've heard of cells exploding in the past, but it certainly wasn't on the scale that it seems to be hapening as of late. Part of that is due to the "information super highway" today, if a guy blows a cell in CA, MD has heard about it the next day if not sooner. So information is much more accessable. But as capacities have increased, so has the matching process. I'm not at all saying the matchers are wrong and mucking up the process, I'm looking to get educated. It's just a thought.
acyrier is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 02:18 PM   #66
Tech Elite
 
macnkitty2002's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Montgomery, AL
Posts: 4,920
Trader Rating: 7 (100%+)
Default

From Intellect's website, link above.
Quote:
Charge the battery with quality charger, and max. current 3~4A.
And who actually does this? Nobody, that's because IB is trying to cover their a$$es. That way when a pack explodes or malfunctions, and you ask for a new one under warranty, they can come back and ask if you charged over 4A. If you did, then they can claim operator abuse.
__________________
Team Associated RC10B4.2
Losi Rock Rey
macnkitty2002 is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 02:24 PM   #67
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 227
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to TurboT
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by macnkitty2002 View Post
From Intellect's website, link above.


And who actually does this? Nobody, that's because IB is trying to cover their a$$es. That way when a pack explodes or malfunctions, and you ask for a new one under warranty, they can come back and ask if you charged over 4A. If you did, then they can claim operator abuse.
Lol, no kidding. I haven't seen someone charge a pack at that low for at least 5 years!

lol, 4amps. Maybe I'll try it and see what my voltages look like. Too bad it'll take an hour to charge my pack.
__________________
Team Great Hobbies
Team Durango Canada
Exotek
TurboT is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 02:26 PM   #68
Tech Elite
 
macnkitty2002's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Montgomery, AL
Posts: 4,920
Trader Rating: 7 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
lol, 4amps. Maybe I'll try it and see what my voltages look like. Too bad it'll take an hour to charge my pack.
at which point it overheats and explodes!!!!!!!! OMFG what has the world come to!!?!?!??!
__________________
Team Associated RC10B4.2
Losi Rock Rey
macnkitty2002 is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 02:47 PM   #69
Tech Master
 
bxpitbull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Union City, New Jersey
Posts: 1,883
Trader Rating: 6 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by imprsme View Post
YOu can have Lipos...watch these and tell me they are "SAFE". I can only imagine ME sitting in my pits and then all of a sudden a huge fire ball rolls up and catches all my rc stuff on fire...

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...60570423705609

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...29910860084249

And this one IS WHAT NOT TO DO! This guy is an idiot! LOL

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...arch&plindex=5
I wont comment on the guy removing the pack from the car...that battery looked to small to power a vehicle of that size. BUT, in case you have been living in a bubble, people intentionally over-charging lipos means ZIP on the boards! Show a vid that shows a charger with the correct settings with lipos going up in flames, then you have a case. What you have posted is a waste of time and pure idiocy on your part. Do they say what power source was being used? Did it have lipo cutoff? If those were NiMH cells, they would have become projectiles, so get a grip!
__________________
R40-Pondering a new Red Dot
Hara Pro4-GTB/3.5/Max Amps-yea.
Pondering moving on to Xray-have to go with a winner. If you cant beat em, join em!

I gear to run and win, not to THERMAL!
bxpitbull is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 03:12 PM   #70
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: England (UK)
Posts: 151
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by macnkitty2002 View Post
From Intellect's website, link above.


And who actually does this? Nobody, that's because IB is trying to cover their a$$es. That way when a pack explodes or malfunctions, and you ask for a new one under warranty, they can come back and ask if you charged over 4A. If you did, then they can claim operator abuse.
What you are saying is people that dont follow manufactures guide lines and if thier product self destructs the manufacturers are trying to covers their "a$$es".

The guide lines are there for the user and people ignore them at their own cost but dont try to blame the manufacturers for that.
Steve B is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 03:36 PM   #71
Tech Elite
 
imprsme's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Va.
Posts: 3,733
Trader Rating: 74 (99%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bxpitbull View Post
I wont comment on the guy removing the pack from the car...that battery looked to small to power a vehicle of that size. BUT, in case you have been living in a bubble, people intentionally over-charging lipos means ZIP on the boards! Show a vid that shows a charger with the correct settings with lipos going up in flames, then you have a case. What you have posted is a waste of time and pure idiocy on your part. Do they say what power source was being used? Did it have lipo cutoff? If those were NiMH cells, they would have become projectiles, so get a grip!

I posted those so ppl could see the BIG FIRE BALL that the lipos produce when mis-handled vs. the explosion in the first picture!!!! God you lipo faithfuls are THICK HEADED!!!

Ok did you see the charger and the correct cut off from the first picture at the start of this post??? Does anyone of us on here know why his pack went poof! NO


The point is NONE of the BATTERIES we MIS-USE/ABUSE in RC are very safe!!
__________________
AwesomatixUSA
eXpress Motorsports
imprsme is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 03:46 PM   #72
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 227
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to TurboT
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve B View Post
What you are saying is people that dont follow manufactures guide lines and if thier product self destructs the manufacturers are trying to covers their "a$$es".

The guide lines are there for the user and people ignore them at their own cost but dont try to blame the manufacturers for that.
Well, the manufacturer well knows that everyone in racing charges at at least 6 amps. If they can't produce a battery that can handle that, then they're the problem. We never had a problem charging at 6 amps with the IP cells or GPs, for that matter. Even the first generation IBs were more stable.

The manufacturers ARE trying to cover their collective asses because they know their product is being proven inferior. They've got to get these things stabilized before someone gets hurt.

I seriously don't know why we've been forced into this trend as it is! The europeans are dropping to 5 cells for racing. We don't need all this crazy voltage!!! Motors and packs were plenty fast when we all raced with 3300s, and they'd last 5 minutes!

That being said, I'm all for speed and power but they've got to start putting batteries out that can handle the abuse of RC! And if not, at least start getting better info out into the hands of the racers so that we can keep our batteries and ourselves alive.

Oh, and the difference between 4 and 6 amps is nothing. If you don't drop the delta peak rating down, you'll end up with the same heat issues that cause the venting and exploding. I've been informed that we have drop our peak rating down a ton to keep the batteries together.
__________________
Team Great Hobbies
Team Durango Canada
Exotek
TurboT is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 04:18 PM   #73
Tech Elite
 
MR JOLLY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: MOOD;; feeling good not racing ,saving shed loads of money,lovely Tan i have aswell
Posts: 4,762
Default

if the manu suggest 3-4 amps on there c-cells ,it must be for a reason

but since US racers want to go faster ,we charge @ a higher rate to get that power ,then when it goes pear shape we the RACERS blame the manu for failure's
but if racers follow the rec amps yopu won't have this problem
coz of the competive nature this HOBBY has gotten into which is go fast @ all cost ,then we have ourselve's to blame

side note i have never gone above 6 a to charge to fast on any c-cell even the SCR 1200 (they liked high amps )

again when things go wrong we look for some one to blame for our 'mistakes'

mistakes happen ,it's called 'life' ,if you don't like the product don't buy it simple ,

i don't buy LRP stuff ,bad things have happen ,so sod them buy some thing else (just me)

it's your money ,you buy what suit's you ,not what the 'jone's' have Next door

dig '@the younger Generation here
since '#common sense' is becoming rarer more problems will arise
just think about what you are doing

Top Teams & Top racers
if your a football player you start to dive & cheat & sear , the youngester will follow suit & this goes for the RC worlds ,youngesters read the coverage on what is happening & if they see or hear that Barry Baker or Andy Moore are pissing on there batts to go faster , then the youngsters will do the same in this day & age ,so charging @ higher amps they will start & things will start to happen badley , But not us oldies ,we just know when the Bullshit starts we turn off & go to sleep
__________________
EAMotorsports;;BRCA 27t National 2007 Champ's
FKO4,AdyB fan club !!
saying of the month;;The Past is History, the Future is a Mystery, this Moment is a Gift- that's why it's called The Present.

Last edited by MR JOLLY; 09-17-2007 at 04:19 PM. Reason: god know's
MR JOLLY is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 04:42 PM   #74
Tech Fanatic
 
gndprx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Fort Mill, SC
Posts: 791
Trader Rating: 18 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by acyrier View Post
...on topic...

It seems that the exploding batteries seem to be IB's. Anybody had any EP's explode on them?
Yes. We had a 4-cell blow on the track waiting to start a race about a month back. EP4200's if I recall and he said he charged at 5A.
gndprx is offline  
Old 09-17-2007, 04:47 PM   #75
Tech Master
 
timmay70's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,701
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TurboT View Post
Well, the manufacturer well knows that everyone in racing charges at at least 6 amps. If they can't produce a battery that can handle that, then they're the problem. We never had a problem charging at 6 amps with the IP cells or GPs, for that matter. Even the first generation IBs were more stable.

The manufacturers ARE trying to cover their collective asses because they know their product is being proven inferior. They've got to get these things stabilized before someone gets hurt.
The manufacturers have the engineers that do all the calculations that produce the numbers that state what kind of safety factors are allowable on their cells. They know what kind of pressure that the cells can withstand. They know how much charge for how long will produce a fully charged cell. They aren't just willy nilly slapping new labels on the cells because they MIGHT be able to handle some sort of charge. It's a safety factor that is engineered into the cells. If you CHOOSE to ignore their recommendation of what the charge rate should be, it's your ass because they already made their recommendation. It doesn't matter to them what the NORMAL treatment of their product is by the users. They posted their instructions. If you ignore them, they have already done as much as they can do. You want them to go to your track and hold your hand and speak to you like a kindergartener and say 'now little johnny, you can't be charging these cells above this rate cause they will go boom and rip your eyeballs out of their sockets'...

Take responsibility for your actions. If you blow 'em up and you weren't following instructions, it's your fault.

BTW, they do list a recommended delta peak value, too.
__________________
Speed Merchant Rev7, Tekin, TQ Racing (wire), Team Tamale
RC Excitement - Buy where you race, support your local tracks.
ROAR #105242
timmay70 is offline  
Closed Thread

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
NVK5908 Velociti Nickel Plated Sintered Rotor baj2374 R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 0 05-08-2008 01:48 PM
WTB around 6 or seven nickel batteries mwd246232 R/C Items: Wanted to Buy 0 01-20-2008 12:00 PM
Quick Charging a 3PK Nickel Cadmium Battery Mpowerz Nitro Off-Road 7 01-15-2008 08:06 PM
Dangerous Nickel Batteries!!! Craps Electric Off-Road 41 09-18-2007 10:15 AM
Nickel Oxy Hydroxide Batteries? Johnathan Rookie Zone 5 08-02-2006 05:40 AM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 03:44 AM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net