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Old 04-23-2009, 06:01 AM   #601
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Chris and me used 7T delta motors with a fan-less 12.5mm mag

WE did not have too many temperature issues (below 80°C)
ESC temp was easy too

and we definately did not have the slowest cars on track *G*

in fact I did not have to replace a single ESC

as far as I know there was not one that broke ...
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Old 04-23-2009, 06:18 AM   #602
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin Hofer View Post
Chris and me used 7T delta motors with a fan-less 12.5mm mag

WE did not have too many temperature issues (below 80°C)
ESC temp was easy too

and we definately did not have the slowest cars on track *G*

in fact I did not have to replace a single ESC

as far as I know there was not one that broke ...
Sure Martin,
GM motors sounded to work pretty well and safely but some other "blue is better" (actually, they are grey) german products could not say the same !

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Old 04-23-2009, 06:26 AM   #603
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Hi Guys
I have just purchased the 13.5 grey version that is star wound, and have a Nosram SPEC esc, and will be using setting 8 which has the turbo mode, where as the timing is advence by 30 degrees, and runs at a constant 35 amps. I know this gets asked a lot, and it depends on the track layout etc, but any Idea on gearing please. A mate of mine was using a 2 year old esc and was geared at 3.9 using the grey 13.5 moto, and will be the same trck as he was playing on.
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Old 04-23-2009, 06:26 AM   #604
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haha

some did not even start (I remember a Mr. Martin Hudy burning in the grid *G*)
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Old 04-23-2009, 06:34 AM   #605
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the lrp/nosram spec motor first advances the timing by more than 30° *g*

anyway

I think a gearing around 4.5ish should be fine

there are 2 possible gearing with that esc

either bloody long, or very short
if it's long it does not get this much timing and uses the motors torque
if it's short, the esc advances the timing open end *g*
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Old 04-23-2009, 04:13 PM   #606
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there are enough drivers here in germany using a 4T or 7T delta with 5 cells and it'S fast enough ... and easy on the electronicsso I cannot understand why a 7T delta with LIPO would not be fast enough ...
Martin you say that because most of the tracks are narrow/small so thatīs why you say with 7T Delta and 5 cells is fast enough but when you go for a large track youīll see the difference between 6T and 7T Delta.

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Hi Jopor, I'm not sure which worlds track are we talking about. If you mean the last ISTC Worlds track in Bangkok Thailand so yes, this track was actually very stressful for modified class. Not so long straight line and many rhythm changes in the corners section. At that time, the IFMAR rule was to use 6 cells SUB-C only. So mostly, the modified class drivers used 4.0t or 4.5t with a secured ratio. Combined with the air and track temperatures, it was really like hell. Some motors could reach 110°C after 5 min. The limits were reached and beyond sometimes.Slide
Now iīm not going to respond but leave Juraj Hudy do it
“The Worlds track layout was completely different from the practice layout where the corners were sharp and a lot of chicanes. Now the Worlds track had long and smooth corners so this was not the place for aggressiveness and sharp handling. To keep at the pace there was no space to push in the corners and a high need for a very smooth throttle finger”

As you see you can run on a large track that can be more stressful to your motor and ESC than a small/narrow one, it depends of the corners you have, in that track on Thailand you didnīt have to brake so much.

during practice we always see the Motor/ESC/Batteries temp to see if itīs okay or need to be adjust (gearing) and if itīs better to put 6, 7 or 8T Delta because of handling the power of the motor for that specific track.
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Old 04-23-2009, 04:36 PM   #607
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you don't have to brake this much on the RCS track

man have you ever been there?

LOL I don't think I was at a track more stressfull than thatone ...

even on flowing tracks you got insane loads once the motor starts to rev ...
I said some drivers use 7Ts / 4Ts with good results

which does not mean that I am not using 5T delta or so a few times ...

but 6T delta / lipo is just little too much ...
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Old 04-23-2009, 05:03 PM   #608
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Yep Jopor,

Martin just steals my coming words: Have you ever been at RCS before?
It's a real technical track with sharp corners. Motors are always under high pressure because the track has a infernal Brake/Throttle rythm. No time to rest in large curves or long straight lines where the weight of the car is always well launched.

That's why I join Martin saying that your config can be ok for that large track and cooler conditions as I could see on the video, people were wearing warm jackets. But it may show some overload and heat issues on some other small/narrow tracks.

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Old 04-24-2009, 06:06 AM   #609
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Yep Jopor,

Martin just steals my coming words: Have you ever been at RCS before?
It's a real technical track with sharp corners. Motors are always under high pressure because the track has a infernal Brake/Throttle rythm. No time to rest in large curves or long straight lines where the weight of the car is always well launched.

That's why I join Martin saying that your config can be ok for that large track and cooler conditions as I could see on the video, people were wearing warm jackets. But it may show some overload and heat issues on some other small/narrow tracks.

Slide

Well time will tell, this is, next races will tell us who is right. For what I have seen, and experienced here, I believe jopor is right. Let us wait.

I know that track jopor shows. It is a very nice track, lots of grip, and two diferent sectors a fast one with a very hard braking zone and a technical one with lots of braking zone, and to be fast people need to brake hard.

I believe there are a lot of "urban myths" about electrics nowadays. The reason why people moved to 5 cells is because of some of those myths. To me it was a completly stupid move to do. Based on one of those myths the transmissions of Touring cars would brake apart every pack of use with lipo and brushless motors.

I know drivers that moved to stock class because of that expected problem.

Reality have showed us that it was just a myth, I have been racing with that configuration for a lot of time, I knew it a long ago.

This first race jopor showed just proved that, nobody broke the cars even with lipo and 6 turn delta motors.

I know from experience that GM motors together with GM ESCs are the best system one can use, they always run cooler then the rest. It was impressive to me the temperature of the motor of jopor's son after 5 minutes racing even in the hotest days in our summer, we were racing each other and my system was not a GM one on that time. I can tell you the diference.

I believe electric cars drivers must put in their heads electrics are not those "small" cars of 20 years ago, electrics must, and I repeat must, move to bigger tracks, and stop racing in the tracks done to Mabuchi 540 motors.

Electrics, are today, faster than nitro so I think it is no dificult to accept that.

I am no longer racing 1/10 electric as I move to 1/8 Off-Road, electric too, but I want to congratulate GM for their fine equipments, to me the best for 1/10 racing, by far, and i never understood the reason of so many drivers using those equipments of "that color that is better". Or perhaps I do.

Last edited by PDM; 04-24-2009 at 10:58 AM.
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Old 04-24-2009, 08:28 AM   #610
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All right Guys,

Jopor may be right to use this given config on this given large track/race conditions.
But he may not claim loud and clear that overtaking the GM tech specifications is safe from any trouble whatever the track size/conditions.

All the topic is here. Nothing more nothing less.
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Old 04-24-2009, 10:56 AM   #611
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Slideaway you are right.

I look at what Jopor says as a compliment to Graupner-GM.

We all understand Graupner has a solid name in the RC market that they must protect.

What we found out is that Graupner-GM perhaps have been too conservative about their own product. It is far better to the client to discover that the motors can handle more power then the oposite.

And we all know that there are some manufacturers that claim some levels of power of their systems and most of the time they just burn before that.

So, congratulations to GM. They have been doing a magnificent job on 1/10.

Perhaps it is time to "grow" for 1/8? I would be very happy to see this happening.
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Old 04-24-2009, 11:49 AM   #612
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Yes GM is " make the fast stuff"

I have a GM genius 95 and it's the must! No problem, SAV in 15 days and verry serious
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Old 04-24-2009, 12:07 PM   #613
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Quote:
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So, congratulations to GM. They have been doing a magnificent job on 1/10.

Perhaps it is time to "grow" for 1/8? I would be very happy to see this happening.
Well, first 6S ESC is already in catalogue, waiting for supply
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Old 04-26-2009, 02:16 PM   #614
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Hi does anybody know if there has been a software update done to the gm speedos? All the info i see now states that there is a new version and it has 9 throttle profiles? What is the new throttle profile used for? Just wondering if its worth sending my speedo back for update.
Thanks
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Old 04-26-2009, 02:30 PM   #615
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we are currently at firmware 6.2

I tested it this weekend and it was pretty good
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