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Old 08-22-2007, 08:07 AM   #61
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Just playing devil's advocate:

Let's assume you race 40 times a year, $1000 a year in equipment (you all know you spend more then that), $15 race fee, tires last 2 race days, parts/disposables at $5 per race (triple that if you own an RDX).
$1000 a year equipment
$600 a year in race fees (40 wks * $15 race fee)
$200 a year in parts & disposables ($5 * 40 wks)
$700 a year in tires (40/2 * $35)

With just these conservative estimates we are at $62.50 per race day. Not nearly the same as a movie. This doesnt include the fact that many people pay more then $1000 a year for their stuff, gas to the track, tents, generators, the SUV you bought to haul it, etc.

Thats the reasoning some people use. Its unfortunately just an expensive hobby.

At that cost it pretty much excludes kids. The only people that can do it are those that can afford it or those that dont realize they cant afford it.
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Old 08-22-2007, 08:11 AM   #62
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Most places I race at for weekly races I pay 15 to 20 bucks. I have no problems with that at all. This hobby in general has over the years became more expensive as every thing has. I find if it is too expensive I just take a week or two off and then race a week or two. Racing every week is expensive but I find if I race a little less it is not too much of a problem.
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Old 08-22-2007, 08:17 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by or8ital View Post
Just playing devil's advocate:

Let's assume you race 40 times a year, $1000 a year in equipment (you all know you spend more then that), $15 race fee, tires last 2 race days, parts/disposables at $5 per race (triple that if you own an RDX).
$1000 a year equipment
$600 a year in race fees (40 wks * $15 race fee)
$200 a year in parts & disposables ($5 * 40 wks)
$700 a year in tires (40/2 * $35)

With just these conservative estimates we are at $62.50 per race day. Not nearly the same as a movie. This doesnt include the fact that many people pay more then $1000 a year for their stuff, gas to the track, tents, generators, the SUV you bought to haul it, etc.

Thats the reasoning some people use. Its unfortunately just an expensive hobby.
I see what you are saying but the topic is race fees not what the hobby cost.What you are breaking down is more of an overview of what the hobby itself cost .
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Old 08-22-2007, 08:23 AM   #64
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I see what you are saying but the topic is race fees not what the hobby cost.What you are breaking down is more of an overview of what the hobby itself cost .
But thats the thing, race fees are part of the cost of the hobby. Its not special money that doesnt count like the rest. I could pay $52.50 per week to race or $62.50. At some breaking point for people they quit. If the race fee (which is one of the last expenses) is what puts people over their breaking point then they leave the hobby. Simple economics. Like you may spend $80 a ticket to see your favorite NFL team but you may say $100 is too much. Or you may haggle for that used GTX on the for sale forum and you may say I will buy it for $85 but not $95.
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Old 08-22-2007, 08:31 AM   #65
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I guess the topic would never be agreed on seeing everyone has different opinions and depth of pockets
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Old 08-22-2007, 08:32 AM   #66
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Ah the 5$ question? Its the difference between being a racer or a basher!
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Old 08-22-2007, 08:35 AM   #67
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Originally Posted by sns820 View Post
I guess the topic would never be agreed on seeing everyone has different opinions and depth of pockets


I think someone nailed it earlier with supply and demand though. Tracks need to find the point at which they get the most racers. More racers doesnt really increase the cost to run races (unless you need a bigger space resulting in larger overhead). 50 racers at $10 is better then 30 at $15. If you can go from $15 to $20 without losing racers then thats great. Unfortunately the $5 difference is going to cause people to leave in most cases.
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Old 08-22-2007, 08:36 AM   #68
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Ah the 5$ question? Its the difference between being a racer or a basher!
For an extra $2.50 you can be a hack (in between a racer and a basher).
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Old 08-22-2007, 08:38 AM   #69
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You spend what you can afford I guess, if a club charges too much you go elsewhere if you feel cost that much of an issue.

Cost is just a small issue though - if I like a club that much and the people I meet there i'm not bothered if the race fees go up now and then

Cheap race fee's doesnt nessesarily make high attendance either.

In the UK its a bit different though as we dont have much trackside support in the way of shops.
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Old 08-22-2007, 08:41 AM   #70
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Yeah each track is definately a different "product". Very good point. I know one of the issues locally was that the weekday racing and weekend racing was the same price but on the weekday racing there was one less round of qualifying and less time between rounds. Some people thought they should be different prices but attendance was similar between the two so I guess no reason to discount it.
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Old 08-22-2007, 08:52 AM   #71
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The duration of the meeting should also be reflected in how much you feel you should pay too.

My local club races on wednesday evenings and sunday all day and I have no problem paying a bit more for a full days racing, and rightly so- more racing, more money!

In all, there are too many factors to decide how much you feel you should pay. Some people just hand over the money, others need to justify what theyre spending, some are on the fence and dont really have a view.

Plus it depends on your income too I guess. And how serious you are about racing, big meetings will nearly always cost more.
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Old 08-22-2007, 08:56 AM   #72
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Just to clarify, there are 3 issues at hand hear.

1)THE HOBBY SHOP that has a track(primary focus was running a store selling products)
2)THE TRACK that has a hobby shop(primary focus and reason it opened was racing)
3)THE TRACK RUN BY A CLUB(its members)(primary focus racing for the least amout of money possible)

Of the 3 above race fee increases should only be coming from 2 and 3. And number 2 is the one where the track is so unstable that i typically wont stay open for more then a few years.

The hobby shop in my opinion should be self sufficient with or without a track.(option 1 above) Anyone thats been in this hobby a long time knows that racers and attendance come and go, its cyclical. I have been with my club with 10 racers and at times when when busted off 100 entries for a club race... ITs up and down. Knowing this if i was opening a hobby shop thats what my main goal would be, the onsite track would be gravy, extra something that is not there to make or break my bussiness. IF a hobby shop puts all his efforts in making money off the track instead of his hobby shop this is where u get the fee increases from.(option 2 above) For instance my LHS has a slot car club in the back of the building. For years they had there own oval track, the rent was paid by the busines of the hobby shop not the track, now for the last 5-6 years they have had a slot car club in the back paying the hobby shop rent to be there. The hobby shop never got a dime for the space before only what it got from racers. Now they have monthly rent from the club, will they ever raise it? No because its bonus money to them its not money they need to keep the hobby shop open. There shop ran for a few years with no track in the back just empty space. There business plan was a hobby shop first track second or extra.
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Old 08-22-2007, 09:00 AM   #73
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hey sinister,
that is part of the discussion we are having about the on road at Coral Springs....we know we will be ready to start racing very soon, and we are running open practices currently on Sundays, but where do we set the Race Fees...? The track needs some upgrades, and that takes money....so we are going to be selling ad space(banners) to different businesses for small fees. A large banner is $250/yr and that business will be the only one of its type, and a smaller banner is $100/yr but we can solicit more businesses of its type. An example might be the LHS's....there are 4 that are interested in being a sponsor, so they will get the $100 banner. The local wings joint is being talked about as the "official watering hole after the races" restaurant, so it would be the $250 banner. These fees should help with procuring items like new tables for pits, tents for the pits, new driver stand with a roof, a storage room, etc. Then the race fees will help with the upkeep, like resurfacing, new pvc pipe, paint, scoring software and updates, etc....

Also, we are considering Yearly memberships with reduced race fees, such as $20 non-member/$15 member.......with the yearly dues around $40.....again, we are still in discussions.....

I welcome all feedback, and I will obviously continue to watch this thread.
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Old 08-22-2007, 09:06 AM   #74
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hey sinister,
that is part of the discussion we are having about the on road at Coral Springs....we know we will be ready to start racing very soon, and we are running open practices currently on Sundays, but where do we set the Race Fees...? The track needs some upgrades, and that takes money....so we are going to be selling ad space(banners) to different businesses for small fees. A large banner is $250/yr and that business will be the only one of its type, and a smaller banner is $100/yr but we can solicit more businesses of its type. An example might be the LHS's....there are 4 that are interested in being a sponsor, so they will get the $100 banner. The local wings joint is being talked about as the "official watering hole after the races" restaurant, so it would be the $250 banner. These fees should help with procuring items like new tables for pits, tents for the pits, new driver stand with a roof, a storage room, etc. Then the race fees will help with the upkeep, like resurfacing, new pvc pipe, paint, scoring software and updates, etc....

Also, we are considering Yearly memberships with reduced race fees, such as $20 non-member/$15 member.......with the yearly dues around $40.....again, we are still in discussions.....

I welcome all feedback, and I will obviously continue to watch this thread.
I like the lines of your thinking. Dont put all the burden on the racers. On the outdoor track locally we add banners to the track but we did that so that each of the tenants of the parking lot would sign-off allowing the track. It doesnt offset the cost but it at least gets us a place to race.

So the club is going to provide the tents, tables, etc? A nice perk but people may prefer to buy and bring their own with a lower race fee.

Along the "donation" line, those of us with the means usually purchase things that can be used by many like generators, large tents that can fit a few people, etc.
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Old 08-22-2007, 09:07 AM   #75
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Originally Posted by Headshot View Post
hey sinister,
that is part of the discussion we are having about the on road at Coral Springs....we know we will be ready to start racing very soon, and we are running open practices currently on Sundays, but where do we set the Race Fees...? The track needs some upgrades, and that takes money....so we are going to be selling ad space(banners) to different businesses for small fees. A large banner is $250/yr and that business will be the only one of its type, and a smaller banner is $100/yr but we can solicit more businesses of its type. An example might be the LHS's....there are 4 that are interested in being a sponsor, so they will get the $100 banner. The local wings joint is being talked about as the "official watering hole after the races" restaurant, so it would be the $250 banner. These fees should help with procuring items like new tables for pits, tents for the pits, new driver stand with a roof, a storage room, etc. Then the race fees will help with the upkeep, like resurfacing, new pvc pipe, paint, scoring software and updates, etc....

Also, we are considering Yearly memberships with reduced race fees, such as $20 non-member/$15 member.......with the yearly dues around $40.....again, we are still in discussions.....

I welcome all feedback, and I will obviously continue to watch this thread.
Those are all good ideas, we do the same thing with our local hobby shops and our track. Check my post above to see how we do our membership fees. Our $50 a month could be good for you guys if you have more members you can lower that. Right now we need that 50$ to make a certain amount to cover costs, if we doubled our membership we coudl change that to 25$ a month. An insane deal at either price point
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