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Old 05-24-2007, 01:02 PM   #76
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My mistake for even mentioning the enduro deal and sidetracking the thread. Just to clear the air, we did make lots of friends and had a great time at the event. We are looking forward the Paved Nationals and expect an excellent event.

The truth is 2 weeks prior to the race Team A said if they could not have it now they would have to use something else. Given the fact that it did not work at that pointÖ... Team B just happened to be lead by one of our team drivers and was willing to use the system if we showed up before the race started. We did, barely, and offered units to both teams. One accepted and the other now lives for orange. Itís a funny world. What can you do but press on and fight the battles you can win.

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Old 05-24-2007, 01:03 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by SWTour
( Does this mean at some point in time, they WON'T be allowed? I can't say until we have the opportunity to see what they have to offer.)
That was all I needed to hear to be happy. I am telling you it is going to be fine or at least no different than now. Fast guys will be fast and some will just think they should be fast. Totally agree on faster not being better. Fair is the key and the goal in controlled speed classes. The burdon falls on us to make sure it happens.

If we are talking about business deals, sponsor support, and one time races buying smart, thatís different than fair racing. We can have the Them series and the Us series, it just seems like it would be more fun to have all the best drivers compete together and let a little healthy rivalry feed the fire. We need more people at the races, not less people at more races or in more classes.

Honestly we have told our drivers they can use what ever they need to race where they want. We are big enough to let them enjoy their hobby without undue restrictions.

Since I opened this door and it ultimately it effects sponsorships, I want address sensored/sensoreless and slotless/slotted. It is not sensorless that is really the difference it is slotted vs slotless. Driving a sensored slotted motor with a sensorless controller does not change the power available at the wheels. The same power limits will exist in a slotless motor it just will take a different number of turns to be equal and track time to prove it.

I appreciate all of the comments thus far. We agree with the grass roots approach. I apologize to all the local races we did nothing for recently. We will be a lot more supportive when things are rolling. In case you have not noticed all the ridiculous jabs we are pretty late with our new products. I am not a trust fund baby.

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Old 05-24-2007, 01:05 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by Scrubb
I think it would be a little nice for manufacturers to give contingency money and free product to the winners of the different classes at regionals and nationals or other similar size races that are using, in this instance, Tekin products. This includes non-sponsored drivers using Tekin Products.
Mark Westerfield
I like the podium money for anybody that uses Tekin equipment idea. We have talked about this a few times. As long as there is some minimum requirements for entries.

Do you think that would change the face of racing for the better or worse if companies put up Cash and it becames part of the attraction?

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Old 05-24-2007, 01:39 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamTekin
I like the podium money for anybody that uses Tekin equipment idea. We have talked about this a few times. As long as there is some minimum requirements for entries.

Do you think that would change the face of racing for the better or worse if companies put up Cash and it becames part of the attraction?

Tekin Prez
being that this is a thread "Sponsoring ROAR Races" .. I figure a discussion regarding contingency money might be moved to another thread to not cause confusion?

ROAR will not allow cash payouts at any sanctioned event for several reasons - one, its in the rule book pretty clearly stated...

Sorry to rain on the parade here... but all things ROAR, I do try to keep an eye out for.
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Old 05-24-2007, 02:18 PM   #80
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Podium rewards work great , seen it already with fuel and now everyone uses the brand that pays ...

Tekin would be wise to adopt this method of sponsorship for its products ...
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Old 05-24-2007, 06:21 PM   #81
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With all due respect Dawn, racers such as Ryan Cavalieri and such get bonuses from their sponsors such as Team Associated for winning ROAR nationals, they actually make their living from winning prize money.

Perhaps I should have used a different wording. This would not be a cash payout from the host track or ROAR for winning, This would be a payout from manufacturer to customer. This would be more like a commision. Tekin would not pay a winning racer using a different a speed control such as Novak, so it can't be considered prize money.

Here are the rules:

5.16.3 No cash prizes or cash compensation awards are allowed at ROAR-sanctioned events. Any ROAR Club or Track conducting such an event will have its annual club membership voided and will be barred from holding a ROAR-sanctioned event for a period of one year from the violating event. Note: This ruling does not apply to individual non-sanctioned events that are publicized as being non-sanctioned, but does apply to any regularly scheduled level 1 events, as these are automatically considered to be ROAR-sanctioned events. (See 1.1.12 above)

5.16.4 All ROAR drivers participating in events outlined in rule 5.16.3 will have their memberships revoked, and will not be eligible for reinstatement for a period of one year. Note: ROAR does not restrict its members from competing in non-sanctioned events. This ruling therefore does not apply to ROAR drivers competing for cash prizes in nonsanctioned events held by non-affiliated clubs or tracks or affiliated tracks advertising non ROAR sanction with the exception of level 1, club events.

5.16.5 Merchandise, whether donated or purchased, may not be given as race awards. The use of merchandise certificates as race awards by a club is permitted, but the cash value cannot exceed the cost of an appropriate award. Selling raffle tickets for donated door prizes is not recommended unless there is agreement with the prize donor. Door prizes donated by manufacturers should be given away using a random selection process. Selling raffle tickets for organizer purchased prizes is allowed.

Their is no mention of Manufacturer incentives to racers using their products. The rules imply that their is to be no cash or compensation from from a ROAR club or Track. Or have the 100% sponsered travel team drivers been racing illegally for a great many years?

Last edited by Scrubb; 05-24-2007 at 06:34 PM.
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Old 05-24-2007, 06:38 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrubb
With all due respect Dawn, racers such as Ryan Cavalieri and such get bonuses from their sponsors such as Team Associated for winning ROAR nationals, they actually make their living from winning prize money.
That is true. That is Ryan's job. He's compensated for performance. He's not awarded cash as a trophy at a ROAR event.

We ask and always have asked that sponsors and MFG's to not make announcements during the event, on the flyer or advertisements of such awards.

I'm just saying, this thread was created to discuss sponsorship of ROAR events. To discuss podium cash incentives at ROAR events really isn't appropriate and could create confusion to the new folks getting involved.

I completely understand compensation to sponsored drivers and of course it occurs. They drive for a paycheck. But, no award at a ROAR event is money.
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Old 05-24-2007, 07:19 PM   #83
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So it's like NASCAR, a racer is paid by the sponsors (i.e. Contract, and bonus based on performance), and for winning the race (Daytona 500 etc..) you recive a Trophy.
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Old 05-24-2007, 07:27 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big B
So it's like NASCAR, a racer is paid by the sponsors (i.e. Contract, and bonus based on performance), and for winning the race (Daytona 500 etc..) you recive a Trophy.
nah, NASCAR does payouts for finishing position.

NO matter, I didn't mean to cause a bigger discussion..... just ask if cash awards is a direction you guys are heading with this great brainstorming thread, please, lets not involve ROAR. Jim started this thread and titled it "sponsoring ROAR races"... which means to me, a discussion about how to make sponsorship at ROAR events more beneficial not only for him, other MFG's, racers and hosts alike.
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Old 05-24-2007, 07:36 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big B
So it's like NASCAR, a racer is paid by the sponsors (i.e. Contract, and bonus based on performance), and for winning the race (Daytona 500 etc..) you recive a Trophy.
Comparing RC racing and NASCAR? Why NASCAR, why not Formula 1?

Dawn, is ROAR trademarked/copyrighted?

Seems every "big" race uses ROAR rules....
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Old 05-24-2007, 07:40 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dawn Sanchez
nah, NASCAR does payouts for finishing position.

NO matter, I didn't mean to cause a bigger discussion..... just ask if cash awards is a direction you guys are heading with this great brainstorming thread, please, lets not involve ROAR. Jim started this thread and titled it "sponsoring ROAR races"... which means to me, a discussion about how to make sponsorship at ROAR events more beneficial not only for him, other MFG's, racers and hosts alike.
Ok, I didn't know that, but you get the idea
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Old 05-24-2007, 07:56 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamTekin
My mistake for even mentioning the enduro deal and sidetracking the thread. Just to clear the air, we did make lots of friends and had a great time at the event. We are looking forward the Paved Nationals and expect an excellent event.

The truth is 2 weeks prior to the race Team A said if they could not have it now they would have to use something else. Given the fact that it did not work at that pointÖ... Team B just happened to be lead by one of our team drivers and was willing to use the system if we showed up before the race started. We did, barely, and offered units to both teams. One accepted and the other now lives for orange. Itís a funny world. What can you do but press on and fight the battles you can win.

Tekin Prez
From a member of the "B" Team:
THANKS
The whole team was a last minute deal and we all greatly appreciate all of your support.
Tekin supplied speed control, BL motor and lipo's ran flawlessly for 24 hours, well other than during the extended pit stop to replace most of the car, that cost us the race after a good lead in the early stages, power was awsome, outdone only be the reliability.
You even supplied 2 radios with one dialed down power wise, for us senior members.
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Old 05-24-2007, 08:07 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamTekin
My mistake for even mentioning the enduro deal and sidetracking the thread. Just to clear the air, we did make lots of friends and had a great time at the event. We are looking forward the Paved Nationals and expect an excellent event.

The truth is 2 weeks prior to the race Team A said if they could not have it now they would have to use something else. Given the fact that it did not work at that pointÖ... Team B just happened to be lead by one of our team drivers and was willing to use the system if we showed up before the race started. We did, barely, and offered units to both teams. One accepted and the other now lives for orange. Itís a funny world. What can you do but press on and fight the battles you can win.

Tekin Prez
Jim, let me clarify. You pulled your sponsorship, and out of the race because there was no way for you to get your system done in time. You only brought one working unit with you and we were never offered the chance to run it. The only help offered by you was after the race when we beat your team.

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Old 05-24-2007, 08:14 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nova F1 Racer
Dawn, is ROAR trademarked/copyrighted?

Seems every "big" race uses ROAR rules....
Yes, on the inside cover of the ROAR rule book is the copyright information.

Also, stated on the inside cover is -

"Specifications and standards contained in this rulebook are intended primarily for use as a guide with respect to safety and equitable conduct of races, and for no other purpose, either expressed or implied. Their use by any association, organization, manufacturer or individual is entirely voluntary and ROAR will accept no responsibility for consequences resulting from their application."

Also, "ROAR rules are the sole property of ROAR. Use of thse or previous rules by any other organization or individual without the consent of ROAR is forbidden."

Technically, ROAR allows the use of the rules and the advertisement of the use of rules but does not accept liability should the host experience an incident unless the event is sanctioned by ROAR and is held at a track affiliate.

Basically, ROAR is the standard of rules and specifications and has been for 40 years. Of course most big races use ROAR rules or a version of ROAR rules and of course permission is granted for the use of the rule book. (we use SRS rules at our track... they are a version of ROAR rules because why reinvent the wheel?)

Litigious society we live in.... its sad.
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Old 06-05-2007, 05:36 PM   #90
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I know this is a little off topic, but has any of the sports channels like Speed or ESPN ever brodcast a RC race. I would think that would bring alot of attention to the Hobby, alot of new racers, and outside interest.
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