R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-26-2007, 11:34 AM   #46
Tech Elite
 
edseb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Laguna Niguel, California
Posts: 2,421
Default

I don't think anyone here has mentioned any of this and its affect on our nich in the RC World. Touring cars are losing their popularity and that's a fact. Sure their might be some areas that have shown some growth, but ask anyone in the industry and they all agree that our TC segment is decreasing. So what is good for the health of the segment? Going to an obscure 5-cell rule will only make it harder for new racers. If the manufacturers go to 5 cell, how will it affect newcomers? They will have to purchase specific 5-cell packs since current 6 cell stick packs won't work or fit, Lipos will be affected, etc. Why do you think 1/8th offroad buggies are gaining popularity? The arguments for 5 vs. 6 cell obviously have their pros and cons, but neither seem to have a huge difference in the big picture, so keep it a standard that the industry is used to. Let's not alienate ourselves more. We need new racers.
__________________
RC Car Action Editor and Photographer
Carl Hyndman
edseb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 11:48 AM   #47
Tech Master
 
TRF415boy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,857
Default

Mod racing ain't for newcomers and 27T / 19T classes still run 6 cells so really your point is, well, pointless. And if the whole industry ever does changes over to 5-cells, then you will find 5-cells stick packs for new starters.

As you said, this is a niche segment, and as a niche segment it needed some rules changes because numbers were dropping off. Problem was that you knew you were starting a run, but you didn't know if you were going to finish it. Going to 5-cells has solved this issue and speed hasn't decreased thanks to the amendment to B/L rules. I would have liked a different path but as things are, I like 5-cell racing more than I did 6-cell.
TRF415boy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 11:52 AM   #48
Tech Elite
 
edseb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Laguna Niguel, California
Posts: 2,421
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TRF415boy
Mod racing ain't for newcomers and 27T / 19T classes still run 6 cells so really your point is, well, pointless. And if the whole industry ever does changes over to 5-cells, then you will find 5-cells stick packs for new starters.

As you said, this is a niche segment, and as a niche segment it needed some rules changes because numbers were dropping off. Problem was that you knew you were starting a run, but you didn't know if you were going to finish it. Going to 5-cells has solved this issue and speed hasn't decreased thanks to the amendment to B/L rules. I would have liked a different path but as things are, I like 5-cell racing more than I did 6-cell.
So with your point, we should have mod cars with 5 cell chassis, 6 cell chassis for 19t and stock. That's good for the hobby.
__________________
RC Car Action Editor and Photographer
Carl Hyndman
edseb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 11:55 AM   #49
Tech Elite
 
edseb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Laguna Niguel, California
Posts: 2,421
Default

Also, who's blowing up stuff? Maybe some of the elite at the top level of racing? If the elite have issues, and the manufacturers can't keep up, limit motors.
__________________
RC Car Action Editor and Photographer
Carl Hyndman
edseb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 11:59 AM   #50
Tech Champion
 
AdrianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 5,914
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by patrick
Adrian, for you to say the weight limit is stupid, well, really is stupid. The weight reduction should not only be the weight of the cell, bar, and solder, it should also incorporate some offset for the voltage reduction in order to keep the cars at a similar speed with six cell.
75g will not drastically reduce a car speed but it does allow car makers to make the car tougher so you dont wad up $150 in parts every time you crash.

trd415boy - That was a preproduction PHI. The production cars will have beefier bulkheads and will be heavier. Gee...I wonder why they beefed up the bulkheads for production
__________________
Adrian Martinez
What I run: Schumacher Mi5/Associated RC10R5.1/Associated RC12R5.2/Futaba/HobbyWing/Team EA Motorsports/BSR Racing
Where I run: Florida Indoor R/C Complex/Thunder Racing/Florida On Road State Series
AdrianM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 12:50 PM   #51
Tech Initiate
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 22
Default

last weekend we had the first national in the Netherlands with the 5 cell rule. 5 cell also for stock. In the stock we are still running the same (old green) element. The first national was in Heemstede(www.machheemstede.nl)(Serpent and AMB hometrack with 2 sectiontime's and a speedtrap) a reall big track.

last year, with 6 cell, highest top speed was 73 km/h and fastest laptime was 18,4 sec.

this year with 5 cell(1350gram with transponder , my car was 1394gram) fastest top speed was 67 km/h and fastest laptime 19,0 sec.

Driving the car is much more easy, but there are also more problems with motorheat and battery's. The motorheat is the same as last year, but now it's more important to keep the motor cool for the power in the last couple off laps and because it's more easy to drive, it's also more important to have really good pack's.

also problems with the gear ratio. 3,5(yes 3,5 ) is not possible with a lot of car's.
Jan van Steeg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 03:13 PM   #52
Tech Master
 
TRF415boy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,857
Default

Adrian, how do you know it was a pre production car, you don't even know which driver I am talking about.
TRF415boy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 03:14 PM   #53
Tech Master
 
TRF415boy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,857
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by edseb
So with your point, we should have mod cars with 5 cell chassis, 6 cell chassis for 19t and stock. That's good for the hobby.
Actual 6-cell chassis work fine in 5-cell racing.
TRF415boy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 03:17 PM   #54
Tech Master
 
TRF415boy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,857
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by edseb
Also, who's blowing up stuff? Maybe some of the elite at the top level of racing? If the elite have issues, and the manufacturers can't keep up, limit motors.
Everyone was blowing motors and speedos, not only the top guys. Actually the top guys were the ones that were blowing less stuff because they could get specially built motors... I don't know what class you're running but at the moment running mod with 6-cells you have about 30% chance of blowing your motor unless it's above 9T, which would be too slow.

As for limiting motors, you obviously don't know what you're talking about, it has been done before and was even worse as you'd simply crank the timing up.

Anyway this discussion isn't about the decision to go 5-cell, I think you'll find the people who decided for it know a bit more about the RC market than most of us, and they won't kill their own source of revenue. What i'm more interested in is to see what is actually gonna be run at the Reedy race.
TRF415boy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 03:20 PM   #55
Tech Master
 
TRF415boy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,857
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan van Steeg
last weekend we had the first national in the Netherlands with the 5 cell rule. 5 cell also for stock. In the stock we are still running the same (old green) element. The first national was in Heemstede(www.machheemstede.nl)(Serpent and AMB hometrack with 2 sectiontime's and a speedtrap) a reall big track.

last year, with 6 cell, highest top speed was 73 km/h and fastest laptime was 18,4 sec.

this year with 5 cell(1350gram with transponder , my car was 1394gram) fastest top speed was 67 km/h and fastest laptime 19,0 sec.

Driving the car is much more easy, but there are also more problems with motorheat and battery's. The motorheat is the same as last year, but now it's more important to keep the motor cool for the power in the last couple off laps and because it's more easy to drive, it's also more important to have really good pack's.

also problems with the gear ratio. 3,5(yes 3,5 ) is not possible with a lot of car's.
Jan, your problem with heat and gearing comes from the motor you're using, I wouldn't classify the old orion element as cool running and it needs gearing to the moon to work.
TRF415boy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 03:50 PM   #56
Tech Champion
 
AdrianM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 5,914
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TRF415boy
Adrian, how do you know it was a pre production car, you don't even know which driver I am talking about.
Because the owner of Corally USA is a good friend of mine and he told me this weekend that all the Phi's out right now are preproduction units that Corally sent out to team drivers to get them running asap. The full production cars are coming in a week or two. The team drivers with early Phi's will get production bulkheads sent to them when they are available.

Please understand that I am the sales manager of Schumacher and I am good friends with the owners, sales managers and drivers of just about every company you can think of. I usually know about stuff months before you guys are talking about it here on RCtech.
__________________
Adrian Martinez
What I run: Schumacher Mi5/Associated RC10R5.1/Associated RC12R5.2/Futaba/HobbyWing/Team EA Motorsports/BSR Racing
Where I run: Florida Indoor R/C Complex/Thunder Racing/Florida On Road State Series
AdrianM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 04:49 PM   #57
Tech Addict
 
Big Rigg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 574
Thumbs up

neener, neener, neener I can see your wiener

Take a light, nimble, darty, underpowered car and put it up against a heavy, overpowered beast... which one do you think will end up in the wall
__________________
[url=http://www.corallyusa.com/][color=Red]- Corraly USA -[/color][/url]
[url=http://www.corallyusa.com/specializedrc/index.htm/][color=Red]- Specialized R/C -[/color][/url]
[url=http://www.thunderrc.com/eshop/][color=DarkRed]- Team Thunder RC -[/color][/url]
[url=http://www.cfxpaintworks.com/][color=DarkOrange]- CFX Paintworks -[/color][/url]
[COLOR=DarkSlateGray]- Team Ertrachter Factor - [/COLOR]
If my last name were Oxlong, I would name my kid Mike... yup Mike Oxlong
-Heywood Jablome

I don't want to pay for my sig, so yawl figure it out...
Big Rigg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2007, 05:55 PM   #58
Tech Elite
 
edseb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Laguna Niguel, California
Posts: 2,421
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TRF415boy
Everyone was blowing motors and speedos, not only the top guys. Actually the top guys were the ones that were blowing less stuff because they could get specially built motors... I don't know what class you're running but at the moment running mod with 6-cells you have about 30% chance of blowing your motor unless it's above 9T, which would be too slow.

As for limiting motors, you obviously don't know what you're talking about, it has been done before and was even worse as you'd simply crank the timing up.

Anyway this discussion isn't about the decision to go 5-cell, I think you'll find the people who decided for it know a bit more about the RC market than most of us, and they won't kill their own source of revenue. What i'm more interested in is to see what is actually gonna be run at the Reedy race.
At the Worlds it was high, but no where near 30%. My point is that TC are a small segment of the market and going to 5 cell even with some manufacturers releasing some product will only pigeon hole us even more. There is no way 5 cell is going to catch on in any other form of RC, it will be specific to TC which is not good.... and seeing as how I work at a magazine, we hear a lot from manufacturers, and there are plenty who think 5 cell is bad.
__________________
RC Car Action Editor and Photographer
Carl Hyndman
edseb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2007, 09:59 AM   #59
Suspended
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Costa Mesa
Posts: 408
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Rigg
neener, neener, neener I can see your wiener

Take a light, nimble, darty, underpowered car and put it up against a heavy, overpowered beast... which one do you think will end up in the wall
Dude that sounds just like you ...lol...

Clapink I hit the kink again, sorry coming thru..

Slow is fast ..
CAlbrecht is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2007, 11:24 AM   #60
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,300
Trader Rating: 13 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Rigg
neener, neener, neener I can see your wiener

Take a light, nimble, darty, underpowered car and put it up against a heavy, overpowered beast... which one do you think will end up in the wall
Better yet - which one will move the wall more...
duckman996 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
F/S - 4 cells 6 cells IB4200 Batteries for TC or Trans Am Solara R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 5 08-11-2008 09:38 AM
2 packs Power push 3600 intel. cells,4 cells whynot R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 0 05-31-2005 09:01 PM
XRAY T1FK - RC12L3 - Serpent 710 - Surge Batteries (4-cells & 6-cells) and more XrayRacer R/C Items: For Sale/Trade 24 03-31-2005 03:19 PM
1.18+ cells -vs- orion's 1.19= cells dawgmeat Electric On-Road 142 03-31-2005 11:01 AM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 02:39 PM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net