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Old 04-11-2007, 12:59 PM   #76
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Everyone needs to quit bashing ROAR and thank them for all their hard work managing the "vintage classes". RC Pro Series or bust.
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Old 04-11-2007, 01:01 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieO
Believe my argument? Not sure what your implying.....

I can tell you, without a shadow of a doubt, the companies had nothing to do with ROAR's stance on LIPOs.....we didn't even know about it till it was announced. I am on the onroad comittee, anyone it can tell you we didn't even know about it till it was announced. It was questioned by multiple company reps on this very forum....I talked to multiple ROAR officials about it and they all said it was because of safety concerns from the insurance company, which Adrian M came on here and verified....and he is a HUGE LIPO activist.......LiPOs are banned in all forms inside of a car.....doesn't matter what yer using for.

Do you actually think anyone at ROAR listens to trinity or SMC regarding batteries?

Or if your arguing about the 5 cell thing.....well, that was my big problems with it.....no data proving it works and the fact is made LiPO unuseable (unless yer aware of a 6 volt lipo that I am not)....I still sell batteries either way.....and from our 5 cell testing, you would of been buying even MORE packs because of the strain it puts on them....

So if you don't think I believe it......well, thats your deal....

Later EddieO
Thank you for your clear and precise explanation in regards to this portion of the topic. No ill words lobbed or flames used in either of our postings. I understand what you stated. I may not agree with all of it, I do understand where you are coming from. Thanks for taking the time to clarify your side to me.
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Old 04-11-2007, 01:16 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by EddieO
....Jlock, I also sit on the Onroad comittee....we have suggested MANY rule changes and been shot down......don't blame it on us, we are not trying to cater to the sponsored guy.....we are trying to cater to racers, but stuff just seems to stall past us......I can have the other guys on the comittee....like Todd Hodge, Josh Cryul, etc come on here and post.....


Later EddieO
Thank you for pointing this fact out. Many more that read this thread need to know this fact. Can't change things, possibly for the better, if the people higher than you don't want to exact change. Why is that? If the change is beneficial to 100% of the racers and better the sport of r/c racing, isn't that a good thing?
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Old 04-11-2007, 01:30 PM   #79
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Today, the very rules that are suppose
to be protecting us are now stopping us from joining Roar events....


The new racer`s and experience racer`s are buying the new tech instead of the old ....

They are the ones who will be not allowed to race with their equipment...


Hopefully not for long ....
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Old 04-11-2007, 01:39 PM   #80
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It doesn't make sense yet to design a car around LiPo. A few things need to be ironed out before you can take advantage of its reduced weight in your chassis design, including settling on a standard sized case. That kind of thing takes time, although the new chassis that are being released ARE including provisions specifically to fit the unspoken standard size of Orion's Platinum pack, which is very clearly a sign of its acceptance being wide enough to get the attention of designers.

We have a very usable interim solution using LiPo packs designed to fit into standard spaces. Just because it hasn't happened yet doesn't mean it won't. The process is already well under way. The next step is for companies to offer optional chassis with a rectangle milled into the spot where the battery slots would normally be.

I can say with certainty that XRay didn't sell at least two more of their sedans (and probably a few thousand dollars in parts over time) because their cars didn't reasonably fit LiPo. My money and support went to Losi for embracing something new, and if not them, then Schumacher. And I'm not alone, I can think of a couple of other people just at our track that made similar decisions against other cars. Consumers are already speaking with their wallets, even at this early stage in the game, so you -know- the companies are going to respond sooner or later.
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Old 04-11-2007, 02:32 PM   #81
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I'm not gonna bash, or endorse ROAR....but every organized sport or hobby has a sanctioning organization (motocross, BMX, swimming, shooting, running, model airplanes, etc). Some are integrally involved, others more loosely. THEY ALL have a membership fee and are required before competing or participating in the given sport. These organizations are hugely handicapped as they are almost solely manned by volunteers, and especially ROAR where the participants are nationwide with varied needs and expectations. We all work, have families and other priorities, sometimes the volunteer work is often low on the priority list. Another limiting factor is that the participants have to pay the organization for membership, and in the US, if we pay for something we expect an immediate and satisfactory return, much like a customer, even if the org. is manned by volunteers. The fee is really more of a donation and usually offers intangible benefits, like insurance or rules and guidelines. No huge organization, manned by volunteers, with nation participation can be reactionary to it's members' needs. At the club level ,four or more makes a heat......make sure every week that 4 or more show up with lipos and brushless, no track or promoter can afford to turn away racers. If it's better, more will embrace it and eventually it will become an integral part of the program, and grow. But not immediately.......Even the FL state series tweaks the rules to promote better racing and we advertise the series as a ROAR series....I have more of a "by the book" philosophy, but have to agree the changes we've voted on and made, even at a state level have helped, improved, and made racing closer and more fun.
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Old 04-11-2007, 04:13 PM   #82
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So if ROAR split electric racing into nimh/stock and lipo/mod tomorrow what would be different than it is today? It would still be expensive and time consuming, wouldnt it?

Can somebody honestly say that right now $200 and 50 hours a month is too much, but if it was only $150 and 40 hours a month, they would race all the time?

All of those people who quit won't come back. You'll still be racing against the same old guys you see every weekend and spending more time and money than you would like doing it. And it will still be extremely difficult.

So how exactly would the actual racing get better? Lipo batteries and brushless motors will not improve your driving skills. The fast sponsored guys will still be faster than you.

I don't understand why some racers cant enjoy the racing unless the specs are to their liking. We've all heard the excuses and watched them quit because it wasnt what they wanted. Isn't that really the problem?

If you have a local track, try to frequent it whether it follows ROAR or not. If you don't, it won't be there and it won't be ROARs fault.
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Old 04-11-2007, 09:02 PM   #83
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Most of you guys have not been in the hobby long enough to remember John Thawley. If you were, you would understand what can happen if Roar buddies up to the manufactures and lets them do what ever the hech they want to do...

Without the foundation of Roar Rules the manufactures could build what ever they wanted. Oh woudn't that be fun...

The sport of RC racing would die guys! Don't you understand? Stop your complaining and spool up a more positive thread!
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Old 04-11-2007, 09:31 PM   #84
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I dont know about where you live but some of the tracks here do what ever they want..Lipos ,brushless and just say its going to be fair.The rules change evey week.
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Old 04-11-2007, 10:10 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CAlbrecht
Most guys say that BL will alow you to work on set-up and get more drive time , but we all know thats bullshit ..It comes down to being lazy and not have to work for it, working on your motors should be right up there with car set-up,
I'm sure most people who purchase an RC for the first time do so for the hours and hours of brushed motor maintence to be had.
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Old 04-11-2007, 10:23 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrubb
as much as some people might think that ROAR is holding back Lipo batteries, please note that not a single manufacturer of racing grade r/c cars makes a car designed to accept any specific lipo battery. Some lipo batteries happen to fit where manufacturers have designed a space for the legal nicd/nimh batteries. There are only a limited number of speed controls with lipo voltage cutoff ability. ROAR isn't only looking after the battery "matchers", but they are apparently looking out for the whole industry.
I have 3 cars that I can fit a lipo battery in. Just because it isn't designed around a lipo doesn't mean I can put it in the car and make it run.
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Old 04-11-2007, 10:24 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigb11
why dont they make the nationals mean something. not if you live close. have regional events that qualify you for the nationals. also make some new classes for 1/12 scale touring cars and 1/18 scale on road and off road. micro owners are racers to!
This is a good suggestion.
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Old 04-11-2007, 10:45 PM   #88
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With the way the rules stand now on batts and brushed motors, the average club racer can get equipment the pros use now, with BL, do you think the av club racer will be able to get the same speedo programing the factory team drivers get?
In the push to sell products, winning is #1, the competition is tight in stock and 19t and a little fiddeling with the BL speedo program can make just that small difference between 1st and 10th.
No 2 motors are the same, even in top level real car racing, so if I switch to BL, I can sell my com lathe and spend big bucks to get a dyno, and then more big bucks to buy a bunch of BL motors to find that one good one.
Fred
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Old 04-11-2007, 11:06 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C_O_jones
With the way the rules stand now on batts and brushed motors, the average club racer can get equipment the pros use now, with BL, do you think the av club racer will be able to get the same speedo programing the factory team drivers get?
In the push to sell products, winning is #1, the competition is tight in stock and 19t and a little fiddeling with the BL speedo program can make just that small difference between 1st and 10th.
No 2 motors are the same, even in top level real car racing, so if I switch to BL, I can sell my com lathe and spend big bucks to get a dyno, and then more big bucks to buy a bunch of BL motors to find that one good one.
Fred
will happen soon...

a stock brushless ,

designed to be sealed and tamper proof .....

Then you will see a "even" power spread in the stock return....


Its not even close to "even" power in stock in todays races...

So why stop brushless now ?

Stock racing need`s brushless more than any class available...
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Old 04-11-2007, 11:21 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C_O_jones
With the way the rules stand now on batts and brushed motors, the average club racer can get equipment the pros use now, with BL, do you think the av club racer will be able to get the same speedo programing the factory team drivers get?
In the push to sell products, winning is #1, the competition is tight in stock and 19t and a little fiddeling with the BL speedo program can make just that small difference between 1st and 10th.
No 2 motors are the same, even in top level real car racing, so if I switch to BL, I can sell my com lathe and spend big bucks to get a dyno, and then more big bucks to buy a bunch of BL motors to find that one good one.
Fred
Oddly enough all the latest "new top secret speedo programming" got shipped out to customers/distributors before pretty much any of our team drivers got any of it.

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