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Old 04-11-2007, 11:57 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by tomkelley
I think others have tried that already. Here's a suggestion, you can volunteer your services and run for president.
If I was going to do something, I sure as hell wouldn't volunteer. I would just start up a company and run it like a business. I have been in RC since the mid 80's and it's become a broken record with issues with ROAR. There is a better way, but this is just a hobby for me so I could care less what happens with ROAR.
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:00 PM   #62
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JLock- The old school guys-At least they volunteered their time and energy.Are your a current member?Do like Carl suggested and send them to the pres and vp.That would go for all of you out there.Send them to the Major officers. ROAR has never moved quickly. It's been the clubs and others that have done them first. If it works it's adopted at sometime.The few that voice there opinions here are an minority. The majority of R/C racers could care less. Heck most of them never ever race in an organized race of any kind.Most are back yard bashers.
You want something to change gripping here is not going to do it.Writting letters and e-mail and talking with the ROAR people will at some point in time.Those old school guys like me have been working to change things for years- that's why I retired. Now it's time to just sit back and watch and enjoy racing like I used to!
Go Brushless 13.5 & better batteries( a heck of alot better that the 1200SC I started with)................
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:05 PM   #63
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Believe my argument? Not sure what your implying.....

I can tell you, without a shadow of a doubt, the companies had nothing to do with ROAR's stance on LIPOs.....we didn't even know about it till it was announced. I am on the onroad comittee, anyone it can tell you we didn't even know about it till it was announced. It was questioned by multiple company reps on this very forum....I talked to multiple ROAR officials about it and they all said it was because of safety concerns from the insurance company, which Adrian M came on here and verified....and he is a HUGE LIPO activist.......LiPOs are banned in all forms inside of a car.....doesn't matter what yer using for.

Do you actually think anyone at ROAR listens to trinity or SMC regarding batteries?

Or if your arguing about the 5 cell thing.....well, that was my big problems with it.....no data proving it works and the fact is made LiPO unuseable (unless yer aware of a 6 volt lipo that I am not)....I still sell batteries either way.....and from our 5 cell testing, you would of been buying even MORE packs because of the strain it puts on them....

So if you don't think I believe it......well, thats your deal....

Later EddieO
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:12 PM   #64
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And ROAR can be the best thing since sliced bread.......and that ain't gonna stop it from having competition like the RC Pro Series.......if the world was like that.....we would all eat at Mcdonalds, cause there would be no Burger King....we would all fly delta, cause there would be no United....no Chevy, cause we all have Fords....


Sorry, just a retarded arguement you made.....the world is all about choice and when there is choice, no matter how great something is.....some people will always want to try something different.

Jlock, I also sit on the Onroad comittee....we have suggested MANY rule changes and been shot down......don't blame it on us, we are not trying to cater to the sponsored guy.....we are trying to cater to racers, but stuff just seems to stall past us......I can have the other guys on the comittee....like Todd Hodge, Josh Cryul, etc come on here and post.....


Later EddieO
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:12 PM   #65
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EddieO last post is correct I'm on the same committee.
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:15 PM   #66
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as much as some people might think that ROAR is holding back Lipo batteries, please note that not a single manufacturer of racing grade r/c cars makes a car designed to accept any specific lipo battery. Some lipo batteries happen to fit where manufacturers have designed a space for the legal nicd/nimh batteries. There are only a limited number of speed controls with lipo voltage cutoff ability. ROAR isn't only looking after the battery "matchers", but they are apparently looking out for the whole industry.

What is ROAR actually doing to cater to the pro racers anyway? The pro racers run whatever the rules allow, unsponsored racers can run whatever the rules allow as well. I really can't think of a time where ROAR has really even recognized "pro" drivers.
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:20 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrubb
as much as some people might think that ROAR is holding back Lipo batteries, please note that not a single manufacturer of racing grade r/c cars makes a car designed to accept any specific lipo battery. Some lipo batteries happen to fit where manufacturers have designed a space for the legal nicd/nimh batteries. There are only a limited number of speed controls with lipo voltage cutoff ability.
This is untrue. ANY Off-Road 1/10 scale buggy or truck can use a LiPo pack. The Team Losi JRX-S Type R has a LiPo Battery Tray. Novak has released a voltage cutoff device, and I expect other manufactures to follow suit. The Orion/Peak 3200 Carbon Edition's case was designed specifically to fit in carts with chassis that have been slotted for traditional 6-cell packs.
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:22 PM   #68
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why dont they make the nationals mean something. not if you live close. have regional events that qualify you for the nationals. also make some new classes for 1/12 scale touring cars and 1/18 scale on road and off road. micro owners are racers to!
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:23 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RCGaryK
This is untrue. ANY Off-Road 1/10 scale buggy or truck can use a LiPo pack. The Team Losi JRX-S Type R has a LiPo Battery Tray. Novak has released a voltage cutoff device, and I expect other manufactures to follow suit. The Orion/Peak 3200 Carbon Edition's case was designed specifically to fit in carts with chassis that have been slotted for traditional 6-cell packs.
He didnt say there werent cars that Lipo fits, he said there is no car designed for use with Lipo as it's primary power source.
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:23 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLock
RCGaryK - You hit the nail on the head with changing the old guard and bringing in guys with a broader prospective. It seems that many that currently govern ROAR are old-school, closed-minded guys that aren't willing to change and accept new and different things or look at situations from other angles.
.
Much of the old guard is gone, replaced with new blood. But there are still people there from the old guard that have lost touch with the younger crowd. Anyone else notice how many people get in the hobby and stay for less than 2 years?!?!?!?! Guys like those I mentioned are what we need. OH, and if you're a ROAR member...Freaking vote!
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:26 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Smash
He didnt say there werent cars that Lipo fits, he said there is no car designed for use with Lipo as it's primary power source.
The Type R was most certainly designed with LiPo in mind. The other thing too is that, for all intents and purposes, there hasn't been a new car design in any genre (besides the Type R) that has been released since LiPo's have become a viable option. I think (Adrian can verify) that the Mi3 was designed with LiPo in mind too.
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:38 PM   #72
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Like I said, all the cars were designed around legal nicd/nimh batteries, some lipo cells happen to fit. A six cell nicd/nimh battery fits in every car, including the X-Factroy X-6, A Jconcepts BJ4x4, every car. The Orion 3200 only happens to fit in a car designed for side by side nimh batteries. A traditional 6 cell battery can be assembled to fit every car and still be the legal 4300mah, Lipo packs require unlike cells to fit in every car and the batteries would be unequal capacities.

I don't have a problem with lipo being legal, I race with whatever equipment is legal, ROAR hasn't made Lipo legal. So I race with Nimh. I'm intrested in competitive racing, so I follow the rules so I can race. I understand the rules are there to make things as fair as possible for the majority of the country, and to stay inline with the rest of the world through ifmar. I know a lipo battery is better technology, but the rules are there to keep things organized and fair, not to make sure I have the most up to date, highest performing equipment.

Too many people on RCTech think that the rules should be changed the instant new technology becomes availible.
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:39 PM   #73
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Everyone talks about how awesome ROAR was "Back in the day". Well, back in the day the only real major races WERE ROAR Nationals. You didn't have Snowbirds, The Novak Race, Vegas, RC Pro Series (although there was Norrca), etc.
The OLD DAYS ROAR was what? In the 22+ years I've been racing R/C Cars I don't think the average racer ever felt that way..at least not where I am.

We were ROAR because they had at that time the monopoly on AFFORDABLE insurance to offer a track or club. They did have rules that most clubs and/or tracks used whether or not they were actually ROAR affiliated.

NORRCA came to be out of frustration w/ ROAR and wanting to go a little different direction. This worked for a couple years, but in time the two organizations rules were almost parallel...which IMHO was one of the reasons NORRCA went down hill, before it's demise (There were plenty of other reasons as well)

ROAR is YOUR Organization - USE IT for what it's worth. Support IT, VOTE when they have voting ISSUES - VOTE when your region is up for VOTE - BE A PART or SHUT UP.

I belong to ROAR although only 2-3 races a year that I participate in require ROAR membership. My 14 yr. old son is also a member. I've never voted, I don't agree with ALL their rules and ideas...but if I run at a ROAR RACE I show up and RUN based on the RULES.... no big deal.

On the issue of LiPo's, at this time I'm glad ROAR has not jumped too quickly to approve these. A NEW product should NEVER be "approved" just because RACERS want it. Especially when there are so many questions about Safety, Liability, Fire, and other issues.

IF ROAR were to approve these batteries, and a 14 yr. old kid was to damage one or overcharge one and cause a FIRE or something at a track and someone were to get hurt...it would REALLY hurt ROAR and worse...it would HURT R/C RACING. FEAR of people getting hurt w/ R/C Cars is great enough these days w/o this type of issue. (Don't believe me....try getting permission to have a race on PRIVATE PROPERTY w/o a $1,000,000.00+ insurance policy)

I recently talked to a school about holding a race in their parking lot, they want BIG INSURANCE coverage...I asked them about the SOCCER club using their field on SUNDAYS - THEY were not required to have any permit, or insurance...(Hmmmm MORE PEOPLE GET HURT PLAYING SOCCER than playing with R/C CARS)

R/C Rules making is like any political position. You are NOT going to make everyone happy, MONEY will always influence certain aspects of rules that get passes, but that will NOT be the #1 deciding factor very often.

In OVAL racing we now have ROAR , ARCOR, BRL and lots of spin off non-sanctioned series (including my own South-West Tour Series) Most of our groups are trying to follow similar rules and guidelines ,but all regions of the US seem to like things a little different due to track size, style and personal preference...so we DEAL WITH IT.
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Old 04-11-2007, 12:50 PM   #74
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What is ROAR going to do to get these factory guys out of stock?

*ducking*

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Old 04-11-2007, 12:56 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BullFrog
JLock- The old school guys-At least they volunteered their time and energy.Are your a current member?Do like Carl suggested and send them to the pres and vp.That would go for all of you out there.Send them to the Major officers. ROAR has never moved quickly. It's been the clubs and others that have done them first. If it works it's adopted at sometime.The few that voice there opinions here are an minority. The majority of R/C racers could care less. Heck most of them never ever race in an organized race of any kind.Most are back yard bashers.
You want something to change gripping here is not going to do it.Writting letters and e-mail and talking with the ROAR people will at some point in time.Those old school guys like me have been working to change things for years- that's why I retired. Now it's time to just sit back and watch and enjoy racing like I used to!
Go Brushless 13.5 & better batteries( a heck of alot better that the 1200SC I started with)................
Yes, I am a current ROAR member (since 1999). That is because I have and do race a couple of ROAR-sanctioned races (use to do a few more but don't due to politics). The president of ROAR lives in my state and is involved with the SouthWest Championship Series (SWCS) here in Texas. I have tried to talked to him before at a couple of events in the past and I would have a better conversation with a brick wall. I did shock him at the Texas Biggie back in 2004 when he found out that I know some rules that some racers were violating at the event and pointed out, per rule, what was being violated. I will not go into detail about what transpired later but I will say I was not satisfied with his answers of why some racers were allowed to violate the pointed out rules and why others had to adhere strictly to those same rules. So, I have been there, done that, as far as trying to convey my thoughts to ROAR heirarchy.

I am a nitro onroad racer that dabble in electric touring occasionally. My beef as far as the battery thing is about fairness to all racers, not just a few. I do have a brushless system in one of my electric cars and a brushed system in another. With me, it is about fairness to all, not just a select few.
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