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Old 04-05-2007, 09:21 PM   #106
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Originally Posted by convikt
since most no one likes the 13.5, I will be glad to buy them at a discounted price, so you guys can go buy a bunch of brushes for your CO's....lol.....my opinion, the 13.5 (new one) is clearly faster than a brushed stock (and I dont care who builds it)
Absolutely agree...
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Old 04-05-2007, 09:49 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by ShaunMac
And yet some people still insist that the 13.5 should be run with stock 27T motors.
With sintered rotor, I agree they have an advantage, but with the bonded ones, it actually IS VERY close, because it can't pull the kind of gear you need to with that one(motor gets too hot & thermals alot, I know because we runb them at my local track with brushed stocks & it comes out VERY close, & so far the brushless mtors have not won a race here yet, but again, it's too close to call, comes down to who's car is hooked up best & who drives best, just as it should be). I tend to run both in the same car(& sometimes go back & forth with them on the same night), & anyone who watches my car cannot tell when I'm running brushed or brushless.....
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Old 04-05-2007, 10:28 PM   #108
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In club racing, running them together still sounds like a better idea than creating yet another new class, because there's too many already. In most cases, it sounds like all it's done is close the gap between guys that can tune motors, and those that can't. The fast guys are still winning, brushed or not. Brushless is good for the future of racing, find a way to embrace it.
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Old 04-05-2007, 10:34 PM   #109
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Yes, 13.5 back to the drawing board......last thing we need to do is make stock any faster than it already is.......seems a 14.5 or 15.5 may be the ticket....

Later EddieO
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Old 04-05-2007, 10:45 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by EddieO
Yes, 13.5 back to the drawing board......last thing we need to do is make stock any faster than it already is.......seems a 14.5 or 15.5 may be the ticket....

Later EddieO
I heard your delighted squeal in the other room and had to come in here to see what all the fuss was about. :-D
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Old 04-05-2007, 11:31 PM   #111
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Hey Eddie, if you can find a way to slow these things down, or maybe rewind the stators with 14.5 or 15.5 turns, you could make a mint selling "Team Br00d Sport De-tuned Stock Brushless Motors." I'd be all over a de-tuned Br00d 13.5.
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Old 04-06-2007, 12:30 AM   #112
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As fast as the racers keep trying to make there stocks go, they may as well just go a head and do 23t and leave the 27t for novice.
I say make it faster, if you make stock slower people will just try harder to make them faster. That would even up to the 13.5 and bump the class up a notch closer to the speed everyone is getting so close to any way.
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Old 04-06-2007, 12:34 AM   #113
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Slow is the opposite direction of racing.
I say go fast and try not to crash.
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Old 04-06-2007, 12:38 AM   #114
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13.5 Stock
10.5 Super Stock
Open Mod (brushed allowed)

If those speeds are too close, experiment with making stock 14.5 or 15.5, and making super stock/19T/whatever 9.5.

Feel the future.

Here's the great thing about the 13.5 and novice: You don't have to put a 50T pinion on it. If you undergear the motor, it will run fine and won't be that fast. The motor and ESC seem more than happy to hum along undergeared and run cool and consistent.
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Old 04-06-2007, 01:30 AM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syndr0me
13.5 Stock
10.5 Super Stock
Open Mod (brushed allowed)

If those speeds are too close, experiment with making stock 14.5 or 15.5, and making super stock/19T/whatever 9.5.

Feel the future.

Here's the great thing about the 13.5 and novice: You don't have to put a 50T pinion on it. If you undergear the motor, it will run fine and won't be that fast. The motor and ESC seem more than happy to hum along undergeared and run cool and consistent.
What did you do with syndrome?
UNDER GEAR???????????????????
Lord syndrome ruler of the brushless lipo brigade.
Keep dreaming we have still yet to conquer the evil brushed motor Emperor.
I feel the future is light years away. I think in the big races it would be best to separate the brushed from brushless. With exception of modified.
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Old 04-06-2007, 01:56 AM   #116
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me & my friend were racing against 13.5`s last sunday with our Brushed jobbies

in my heat i had 2 13.5s in there ,the 2 guy`s thought i had one to ,so came & asked for gearing info ,they were a bit put out i had 27t on there as they couldn`t figure how i was out gunning them
i pointed them towards TQ man(13.5) for gearing & stuff one of them had the same car & same gearing as TQ man but was really not as fast any where on the track

Q) does this mean there are different performance levels between the novak 13.5`s ,so if you have a slowy & your mate has a fasty ,your buggered

so this is the same boat as 27t now ,you get bad ones & good ones

i think the BL stock will get in the BRCA next year for club racing as the `right` people are for it
it`s not what you know it`s who you know

this brings up the next question
there a few LHS over here that rely on 27t & brush sales (quick turn over) & while they are there they will buy some thing else which helps that LHS to stay alive

now bring in stock BL how does this help those shops


BL is really good if it comes in i`ll be getting one ,but i will wait to see which BL stock is fastest novak/GM/Tekin/lrp/orion then buy that one particular one to go faster

anyway stock is allready to fast why are we making it faster to put more novices off

it`s like flogging a dead horse
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Old 04-06-2007, 07:32 AM   #117
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has anyone tried racing 27T brushed motors with BEARINGS against 13.5 BL?
just curious ..
might give the brushed 27T a new lease of life.
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Old 04-06-2007, 07:41 AM   #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MR JOLLY
me & my friend were racing against 13.5`s last sunday with our Brushed jobbies

in my heat i had 2 13.5s in there ,the 2 guy`s thought i had one to ,so came & asked for gearing info ,they were a bit put out i had 27t on there as they couldn`t figure how i was out gunning them
i pointed them towards TQ man(13.5) for gearing & stuff one of them had the same car & same gearing as TQ man but was really not as fast any where on the track

Q) does this mean there are different performance levels between the novak 13.5`s ,so if you have a slowy & your mate has a fasty ,your buggered

so this is the same boat as 27t now ,you get bad ones & good ones

i think the BL stock will get in the BRCA next year for club racing as the `right` people are for it
it`s not what you know it`s who you know

this brings up the next question
there a few LHS over here that rely on 27t & brush sales (quick turn over) & while they are there they will buy some thing else which helps that LHS to stay alive

now bring in stock BL how does this help those shops


BL is really good if it comes in i`ll be getting one ,but i will wait to see which BL stock is fastest novak/GM/Tekin/lrp/orion then buy that one particular one to go faster

anyway stock is allready to fast why are we making it faster to put more novices off

it`s like flogging a dead horse
Just like brushed some are faster. I've done enough testing for myself, I'm on my 6th 4300. My 4th one was the fastest. I think my fifth one was a 13.5 can, the dang thing was slow. Just like 27t. They are all with in 2 or 3 teeth of each other.
Brushless still has a ways to go. I would get the Novak vs the others, till they come out with a sintered rotor.
I think the minimal tuning options are going to help to keep brushed racing alive.
Most racers don't like speck motors that can't be tuned.

And with the technology of cars and batteries and motors, we cant help but go faster, faster is racing. I think we make it faster by our own efforts its racing. As long as we are racing slow motors we will always try to go faster.
The answer is don't run a motor slower than the track.
Its really the only fair way to race. Think about it. If the slowest motor you could run was a lap faster than the track will go.

We can always make a class for novice, even if it means hand out motors.

If I owned a track brushless racers would pay more for there entry.
If my track were to raise there fee 5.00 or 10.00 I would pay it, I'm saving 1000.00's using B/L and I'm not kidding. Literally 1000.00's. I only buy tires and bodies any more.
It sure does make racing a lot less work, and a lot more enjoyable.

And yes it seems were beating a dead horse, but keep beating its not dead yet. Theres more to hash out. It will be interesting to see what the race officials come up with on rules.
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Old 04-06-2007, 08:37 AM   #119
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I've run a 12.5-13.5 and a 14.5 while testing the motors for Novak. The 14.5 was not as fast as a brushed 27t stock motor. I gave the motor to another driver to test it out and it was almost but not quite there.He didn't like the motor and went back to the brushed motor. The 12.5 was an unfair motor in the stock class- but it was fun for me.We came up with the 13.5 and to me that's the best and closest to a well tuned brush stock motor.
You can chat all you want to about brushed and brushless but the writting is on the wall.Brushless is here and brushed is going bye-bye.It is the next generation of R/C motors. No matter what you say here they are coming and more people will get them.I've sold my com cutter- brush cutter and now trying to get rid of my stock pile of brushes and springs and motor tools.
And just like brushed motors there will always be the motor of the week. Only this time they will be brushless.Go into a hobbyshop and listen to a new racer get a motor. Do they ask for a slow stock motor or the fastest stock motor? Doesn't make any difference to them if they can't turn right or left just straight.How fast does it go.Heck they might get a mod motor because it's faster.Also how many motor motors are sold that don't hit the race track?If you had a 10% hit the tracks on the weekend we probably couldn't handle the crowd.
Brushless is here stay and brushed is going to be extinct soon.
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Old 04-06-2007, 09:06 AM   #120
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That testing was done with the bonded rotor, right? Don't get me wrong, I'm a HUGE fan of the 13.5, and would rather practice alone than race brushed motors again, but the sintered rotor is really what changed things. I'd be interested to hear how a 14.5 sintered would do. Alas, it's probably too late now, I have a feeling the 13.5 is here to stay.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BullFrog
I've run a 12.5-13.5 and a 14.5 while testing the motors for Novak. The 14.5 was not as fast as a brushed 27t stock motor. I gave the motor to another driver to test it out and it was almost but not quite there.He didn't like the motor and went back to the brushed motor. The 12.5 was an unfair motor in the stock class- but it was fun for me.We came up with the 13.5 and to me that's the best and closest to a well tuned brush stock motor.
You can chat all you want to about brushed and brushless but the writting is on the wall.Brushless is here and brushed is going bye-bye.It is the next generation of R/C motors. No matter what you say here they are coming and more people will get them.I've sold my com cutter- brush cutter and now trying to get rid of my stock pile of brushes and springs and motor tools.
And just like brushed motors there will always be the motor of the week. Only this time they will be brushless.Go into a hobbyshop and listen to a new racer get a motor. Do they ask for a slow stock motor or the fastest stock motor? Doesn't make any difference to them if they can't turn right or left just straight.How fast does it go.Heck they might get a mod motor because it's faster.Also how many motor motors are sold that don't hit the race track?If you had a 10% hit the tracks on the weekend we probably couldn't handle the crowd.
Brushless is here stay and brushed is going to be extinct soon.
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